joppe

Its b16 with eagle rods and stroker crank 3.335 or something, and 81.5 srp.pistons.
Fuel: Stock lines and fpr, walbro aem rail and bosch 1000cc. We were street tuning and we got tuned it 15psi and it was pulling good, so we were to raise boost to about 23psi, and we got that, and tested and trying a pull with 4th gear. Full boost about 4000rpm and we take it to about 6500rpm, when it stopped pulling good and we let it go, and check the engine. No water in radiator... So we get water to the engine and heard strange noise, like water was leaking, but no leaks found, so i pulled oilstick and the water was gone to oilpan.. So maybe cracked sleeve? Its stock sleeved and it was ebay turbokit, that basic t3/4.

Water temp was normal and afr was about 11-11.3 during the pull on boost. Vtec is 4000rpm... Here is map from crome take a look and what u say? I think the sleeve just didnt handle it. Edit, srp:s are 9:1 and fuel was shell v-power.

http://www.aijaa.com/v.php?i=5048891.jpg

HamiltonRex

pull it apart and see whats up.

komat

did you have headstuds?
if not head lifted , water got into the cylinder and probably cracked the sleeve

joppe

forgot to say, deck and head was milled to straight and was oem gasket and arp bolts.

AbitAvenger

cracked a sleeve probably

95DC2GS-R

I'm voting on the lifted head situation... seen it first hand once or twice.

joppe

I dont see how it lifts or fails from gasket because it was block and head was milled and there are arp studs torqued to 81ft-lbs. I think you just simply cannot do this better with this money (machining fire ring to block and special gasket) next step... I think it was putting about 370hp at crank or little higher when u calculate from injector duty cycle, and there is cars that made sick power with this style (oem gasket and arp)

Boosted_B_Series

23 psi, pump gas, 57 trim, stock sleeves, and crome?

How much timing did crome 'say' you were running at peak tq in the 23psi column?

What do the plugs look like?

sgnlab

pump gas and 23 psi is a no no! 2nd why vtec @ 4,000 rpm's???

josh green

You cracked a sleeve, the exact same thing happened to a buddies car.

joppe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shell_V-Power

Its very good pump gas, people are making over 700hp+ with it. We were seeking good vtec point and it worked pretty good 4000rpm cause it had full boost over there. There was something with datalog cable or something and then we runned crome free. I did early datalogs with 12psi and timing was good in crome. Im using same fuel on my own dohc zc and using 15deg ignition in 20psi boost (low cr 8:1)... We are not yet pulled plugs but i wil report what they looks, and maybe pic... It was ngk iridium plugs i think heat range was 8. Im pretty sure that u can make 400hp 9:1 b16 with pump gas... This block just didnt take it.

Car was first stock jdm b16 with 12psi boost, made 303hp at crank with this same fuel. We had some detonation tuning stock engine but it stopped with full 3" exhaust. It lasted some time but car wasnt driven in winter and after that 3rd cylinder got nice blow by and pressure was half of another cylinders. We didnt take it apart, only take head off and another block that was allready bored etc.

I personally think that its a bit russian roulette with stock sleeves... I have crack one sleeve with my d16 too, but it cracked when only revving with no gear on and i didnt find any real reason for that, lucky that pistons etc didnt take any damage.

It was pretty cold outside when we were tuning, about 26f. I have tuned and beat really hard my dohc zc with pump gas and 27psi boost with sc50 .48 in -4f and it was working fine, but had major traction problems cause winter tires and cold asphalt, spinning 5th gear some...

This isn my car i only assembly block and tuned it, just looking for reason that sleeves failed below 400hp at crank, some people are making way more with stock sleeves...

MadVTI

sounds top me like u got some det and cracked a sleeve. What you running to check for det etc? Im running v-power on my bone stock B18c4 (GSR) with s256ETT with 19psi and 14 deg timing max. Im getting not det but i know its on limit with 99 octane fuel. Much more timing and i recon il bend a rod. Its doing 120's on qtr mile so i recon im at 320ish whp.

joppe

Only my skilled ears We did have some detonation at stock engine and boost and it could hear so good... I will check with flash light piston tops and plugs, more i cannot do cause its not my engine and project continues later or be selled. Dartons install (only) is here in finland (at one place) allmost 3K$!! Can cracked stock sleeve engine be sleeved good or does it need to be good block? Maybe its cheaber to import from usa GE block or benson or something...

kyden

were you checking plugs after each pull?

MadVTI

if its cracked at top half and not all way down the bore u can usually use for sleeving.

Boosted_B_Series

This V power is not race gas, its just normal junk watered down gas you get from the gas station that is very similar to the vpower gas we get in the states.

You need to get a good EMS before you start pushing your limitations. 15 degrees in crome, isn't 15 degrees, its a lot more and could easily cost you an engine at that boost on such low octane fuel.

I never understood why people push their engines on crappy gas, why blow up an engine at 400whp when you could have enjoyed it all season @ 550whp-600whp with the right gas, and a good tuner using an ems that has accurate, repeatable timing figures.

23-27psi.. with pump gas and crome.. You need to change one of these things to run that amount of boost reliably. It can be done, but normally this is exactly what happens.

joppe

My friend runs old celica with 1.6 toyota engine 10.x on track with that fuel.. Broken sleeve was number 4 cylinder, im gonna post pic off plugs later..

joppe

http://www.aijaa.com/v.php?i=5061977.jpg upper 4 to lower 1

I dont know what its called in english, but that part inside distributor (rotor?) Failed, because it was shitty ebay blue one, and plugs were pretty black before tuning but it was running good so i think that its only carb partly cleaned, it was not melted or anything.. We had only one run on 23psi 4k->6.5k and it failed, and car was still running (with 3) when we pulled over (night on freeway) That 27psi motor was tuned with turboedit cause its obd0... And it was about 8:1 compression ratio. Runned in summer 27psi too, 13.1 @ 118 and 13.3 @ 120mph with 2.3 60ft shitty steet tires...

Ok back to topic, this map had 12.75 adv @ 20psi and 10.5 @ 25psi and it runned 22-23 psi so its something between that? How much crome ign is wrong? This engine was 9:1. So too much timing you think?

crx=si

cracked sleeves is a very common thing on honda with stock sleeves making over 400whp, especially with something as small as a 57 trim, you'd have better luck with a bigger turbo with less back pressure for once. So at 23 psi on pump gas, I'm asuming you're making over 400whp already, so as far as the cracked sleeves, there's no surprises here. As far as your pump gas good for 700+ hp, I don't know what kind of pump gas you get overthere, but unless it's higher 114 octane I don't see any pump gas ( from 93 -98 octane) that's good for over 500 hp, unless it's e85...

joppe

This skyline boosts ~30psi with v-power doing 890hp at crank. Racefuel was 106oct. Its with 2x holset hy35. http://www.turbofriiks.com/forum/vie...?f=13&t=932ost

boosted k20

most likely sounds like the head lifted. a customer i was tuning had serious amount of coolant pressure above 20 psi. he had ARP head studs torqued to 80 ft-lbs. the studs got loose and a few of them you could have loosened them without putting much effort. after retorqing the studs, the head did not lift again.


do a compression check.

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

23psi on pump gas? Jesus are people really just getting more and more ignorant. how many cracked sleeve threds does there have to be for people to finally realize pump gas and stock sleeves and high boost are a no no end of story

slow96lude

I have a little more to add to the crome part. I use crome to tune my cars and I read up on it all the time. Even the guys that use crome pro and make money doing so, usually will not go about 11psi with it because of the stock map sensor. I know crome is perfectly capable of using most of the aftermarket map sensor to run more boost, but most tuners dont recomend it. Crome is just too simple and doesnt have all the feature as let say, neptune or hondata s300
. The most on crome I have personally done was 17 psi on my gsr with a simple 60-1 setup and a gm 3 bar. IT was also sleeved so I didnt really have to worry too much about that.

joppe

Have to check if see any signs of detonation when pulling apart. Turbo-ls i was boostin 27psi with that vpower pump gas all summer and more, and drive it hard. And this skyline is boostin about 30psi with that, and i know cars using that fuel, boosting about 35psi and doing long pulls, like this saab doing 0-312kmh or 0-194mph on airfield. Watch video. Speed was measured with police radar, text is sweden but video is from finland.

http://www.garaget.org/video/ow3zdxhzaka0

boosted k20

theres nothign wrong with crome. As long as you set it up properly and add in the extra timing control script (for free and pro users) or if you use crome GOLD, there is no timing problems. i personally as well as many others have run 600+ whp on crome with no problems.