accord_raffi

Is there a stock MAP sensor that can register more than 11psi that i can use on my 96 accord? I figure this way, i can just go to the junkyard real quick.

Schister66

A 3bar is like $80 with the pigtail and 2.5 Motorolas are quite a bit cheaper. Just look into one of those two units and you'll have the reliability of something new rather than a junked part. That's my .02

rustydusty1717

What are the stock map sensors good for anyways? i've got a 99 civic si. Is it 11 psi also?

ahobbs

technically 11psi, but you can really run 9psi or 10psi becuase of boost cut

rustydusty1717

only 11? looks like i'm gonna need a new map sensor...

what would i need for up to 18 psi? basically just trying to max out my 18g once i get my head back from the machine shop.

Unknown Racing

im pretty sure 3 bar map sensors are good for like 43psi? 1 bar is what 14.5 something like that so 3 bars? 43.5psi? I dont know if thats how they work.... 3 bar is all you need though Im sure of that!

ahobbs

Edit becuase IM a dummy...lol
I personally used the Omin power 4 bar becuase it was worth the straight swap and it calibrates good with tuning programs. cost about 20-40 more but id rather use a plug and play

robx7fcna

I would recommend using a map sensor that fits in your desired boost range. Examples of that would be using a motorola sensor if you plan on running , lets say "22 psi" for example.

Reason being, is that every map sensor uses a 0-5V signal, so a 2.5 bar map would tecnically be more accurate for a car running "22psi" than a car using a 5 bar map. Doing this will make your car idle better, have better throttle response, ect.

Running a 5 bar map on "22 psi" is like buying a boost gauge that goes to 50 psi and only running 10lbs.

Hybrid96EK

No, a 3 bar map sensor is capable of reading 2 bar ABOVE atmospheric pressure. Since atmosphere is 14.7, you can read 29.4psi or posative manifold pressure with a 3 bar map sensor. It doesn't work the way you guys are thinking.

ahobbs

you know what your exactly right. Man I do that more than I should I always forget about the 1st 1bar..... which is 14.7.

I kept screwing the math up in my head when I was converting bar to mbar =millibar.

riceball777

stock is good for 11psi

ahobbs

So where do you set your boost cut? can't do it at 11.1 map sensor doesn't read it.

Hybrid96EK

I wouldn't personally run a stock map past 10psi myself...

ahobbs

So then why is it good for 11psi? You see my point

accord_raffi

ya i saw that omni one that was plug and play and was debating it. I can probably get away with a 2.5bar map. I only want to do 10psi, but you never know what the future brings lol. Anyways, if i wire in a new map sensor, that itself should not effect passing emissions for an obd2 car correct? I have to do enough stuff to get it to pass inspections next time.

HiProfile

Any MAP sensor that's not the stock 1.75bar will run very poorly if used with the stock ECU. It will not harm 'raw' emissions if you use it with a tunable EMS like Hondata, as it will work like stock.

Legally I don't think you can do the aftermarket MAP, but the same goes with the aftermarket EMS tuning. We do it anyways. The drop-in MAPs from Omni look almost identical to stock - they even have metal rivet 'collars' in the bolt holes similar to stock.

One thing that others such as I have done is to get a $15 Motorola, take apart a stock MAP, and slap it in there. Instant 2.5bar MAP identical to stock. You can also get DIY housings from Xenocron for a decent price - it all depends on your abilities and cashflow.


I do recommend people get a slightly smaller turbo than people tell them, and just give it a bit more boost. Same horsepower, broader powerband & more torque.

rustydusty1717

what's the 2.5 good for? like i said i'm looking for up to 18 psi. pretty much whatever my little 18g maxes out at.

legomytego

i switched from my stock to the omni it was $140 and worth it i got one of there older units and it craped out on me at my tuning appt made a post here and omni sent me a new one next day no questions asked it was at my house ive been driving on it for prolly a month now no problems even a 5 hour road trip to pen state grab the omni/hondata service was top notch using it with hondata no problems and its one click to change the settings and i like using the stock wiring

accord_raffi

I know for my car, i'm going to have to switch the stock injectors in, eliminate my second o2 sensor cel (which i have a solution for), and put the stock ecu in. Oh, and don't let the car see any boost at all of course. From teh sounds of it, my car will just run poorly with the upgraded MAP sensor. It's not going to throw CEL's is it? If it is, should i just keep a stock MAP as well to put in for the emissions test?

Schister66

The stock MAP is a 1.7 bar. The one thing to note when buying a MAP sensor is that you need to account for the 1 atm of pressure that is the atmosphere; therefore, a 1.7bar map (OEM Honda MAP) is really only reading .7bar positive pressure (10.29psi approx). The GM 3 bar will read up to 29.4, a Motorola 2.5 will read ~22psi. I hope this clears up any confusion.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I've been saying that for years, as long as it isn't too small and pushed beyond its limits

Schister66

I agree. Its a lot more fun to have a properly sized turbo that spools when you want and makes just the right amount of power for your setup. I know that when i built my first setup, i was pushed towards an SC6152e and i'm damn glad i didnt go that route. For a stock GSR, that's a little overkill...The turbo you recommended to me was a much better buy

ahobbs

and i constantly forget it...lol until i do the math or someone reminds me.

accord_raffi

well i'm not planning on boosting high since it's stock internals. But just in case i do boost higher one day, how does this 2.5bar sound? http://www.xenocron.com/catalog/moto...kit-p-194.html
This is a really nub question, but do i just put it in the stock MAP housing and wire it into the stock MAP wiring? And no one really answered my question about passing emissions? Is it just going to run poorly on the stock ecu when i have to put it back for OBD2 emissions tests? Any CEL's?

omniman

Just to add a few things up so they are all together in one post.

starting with pressure readings. 1bar=100 KPA=14.5 PSI at sea level on an overage day the pressure is about 14.5 PSI. so when you buy a MAP sensor which are generally measured in Absolute pressure PSIA (meaning zero is 0 or the bottom of the scale).

A 2.5 bar map sensor will allow 1.5 bar of boost before it reaches its limit. or about 22 PSI
3 bar is good for about 29 PSI boost pressure
4 bar is good for about 43.5 PSI boost pressure
5 bar is good for about 58 PSI boost pressure
7 bar is good for about 88 PSI boost pressure

The stock map sensor is generally accepted as a 1.7 bar but in testing they do vary a little from sensor to sensor. Typically they will allow between 9.7 and 11 PSI before they reach maximum voltage or boost cut.

As far as driveability goes there is no differnce in the way a correctly tuned stock 1.7 bar will run, idle or consume fuel vs a 2.5,3,4, or 7 bar. We actually did testing on a normally aspirated engine to see if there was any change that was negative. The ECU has far more data points than the MAP sensor so even if you condense the 5v signal over 7 bar the ecu has a more condensed voltage interpretation. The reason we looked into it was because at one point we were considering producing a "Hi resolution" NA MAP sensor in 1.1 bar, but after testing it was realized that it didnt matter what MAP sensor you ran as long as it was correctly calibrated and tuned. There was no measureable significant changes. Some may not agree with this.

There is nothing wrong with saving a few bucks for a DIY map sensor kit such as the ones you find on Homemadeturbo or Zenocron. Those kits are excellent for people that have some extra time to assemble their own sensor, and have the tools to do so.

If you do a DIY map sensor its important to use a specialized adhesive to seal the sensor and prevent leakage down the road. Omnipower offers a single use specialized plastic adhesive for people that want to build their own map sensors using a stock case. Its the same plastic adhesive we use for all our map sensors and has been tested to hold over 130 PSI. Dont use silicone or other gerneral automotive adhesives as they will eventually leak.

Funny thing about the adhesive we use, we had to sign a 10 page form promising not to build weapons of mass destruction, missles, or bombs with it. As well as providing a ton of personal info and how it was going to be used by us.

If your going to boost more than the stock map sensor (over 11 PSI) can support, and dont want to go through the DIY process, Omnipower does offer a 3, 4, and 7 bar sensor. We can also make a 2, and 2.5 bar sensor if we have customers that insist on it. A 3 bar sensor will be more than enough for almost all street cars as most streetable turbos are not efficient in the 30+PSI range. For street/strip cars that use a larger more efficient turbo the 4 bar will generally cover your needs.


I received a question asking how much HP are MAP sensors were rated at? You cant asign a HP rating as the sensor is based on pressure. The HP rating would be determined by your maximum boost, engine size, modifications, and turbo choice. If you have a turbo that is efficient above 30 PSI a 4 bar sensor would be the logical choice so you at least have the ability to reach the turbo's maximum capability. Its a good idea to look at the spec sheet on your turbo before getting a MAP sensor.