Integralove00

This issue was recently brought up on another web site (Team-Integra.net)

My question is simple but I am going to elaborate.

Elaboration:
A lot of people are using half core radiators now and in most of the cars I have seen the stock water pump is used as well. The setup is commonly used with tubular SS manifolds that have clearance issues, it is also used on cars running back door style intercoolers. Most of you already know all of that..

The real question is:
Does a half core radiator (be it OEM Honda Civic, Fluidyne, C&R, PWR.. whoever) really provide adequate cooling for a fully built turbo motor using an OEM water pump?

For the dealers and tuner shops on here if it is "safe and not a concern" why do the radiator manufacturers suggest not to use a half core in these applications?
Granted all companies do these things to cover their own *** and for liability/warranty reasons..

Again the concern is not a matter of the car over heating and boiling over at the radiator but it is about warpage of the head and/or water jackets..

If you have this set up on your car and it does not even run hotter than normal then let me know. I only want to know about daily driven TURBO street cars. No race cars.

Before 96,000 of you get on here and tell me that "Everyone at full race does it..." If that is your reply just don't post..

The T-I debate is on this link most of it on page 2.
http://www.team-integra.net/fo...eDESC

"The same core material + more fin per sq in + total frontal surface = lower temp... cooling doesn't get simpler than that. so can you guys tell me why half cored track cars like to use water pumps that pushes 1.5x liters more per min?"
-Originally posted by Wenlyone 08/17/04 on Team-Integra.net


Modified by Inte9ralove00 at 1:32 AM 8/22/2004

PhantomSTi

I have a Civic Half Radiator (PWR) On my car, (90 DA). I have never had a heating issue, although I'm installing my turbo kit this week, is only when I'll find out if heating will be an issue. But, one thing I can say is that I've never heard my fan come on, even sitting in traffic with 110+ degrees outside. Only time I had heard my fan come on, was sitting in my drive way for 10 mins idling. So to pwr, but just incase were going to be running my fan constantly, and possibly just take out the thermostat.
That'll give you an Idea about how cool I'm running

Integralove00

I realize there are alot of people running this and I now realize alot of you could tell me the same thing as 90integra05.. but he isn't boosted yet.. Besides I am certain it isn't that common or this would have been brought up by now. I do believe it is an issue..

I am more concerned with how likely it is for this damage to happen than trying to keep tally of those with vs. those with out problems. I don't want to be the first to encouter the issue and by now if it is an issue someone has already experienced it.

The main thing that some of the newer people should realize is that this damage could happen with out your radiator boiling over.. It may only get really bad after it is being used for several years. (If the car was continuously running too hot)

I know the easy solution is an aftermarket water pump like the GE unit.. but I would rather know if it is a real issue.

PhantomSTi

I'll let you know in a few days hehe.

Seedc2

iTrader: (1)

this has been lingering in my head for a while as well.

Integralove00

^

And:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 90integra05 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'll let you know in a few days hehe.</TD></TR></TABLE>

What I am saying is your results in a few days will not be relivent..
A. you aren't making much power "shooting for 200 whp".. HP breaks parts not boost.
B. Even on lower HP you haven't been doing it for a year or more..

I guess what I am getting at is your post is pointless so far.. most people have know clue if this warpage is happening.. how would they? You probably wouldn't know 'til your oil started mixing with your water.

Joseph Davis

Ran a Del Slo dual core for a couple years now, clocked over 40K turbocharged miles. No overheating, no rise in coolant temps over the full sized dual core DA radiator I had in the CRX when it was NA.

If the big power turbo Hondas weren't so fast you might have problems, meaning you only have your foot in the pedal a couple seconds before you have to let off, so you aren't really pushing a lot of heat for more than a moment.\

The only big power street cars that have overheating problems are the sleeved ones, where the sleeves restrict coolant flow around the cylinders. I have a few buddies with that problem, regardless of their radiator selection and engine load.

mildly.interesting

I'm with J., I run a full length radiator in the super hot South, and have never, ever had any cooling issues, in traffic or at the dragstrip.

FWIW, I was told by more than a few reputable tuners that I would be a fool to replace the full length with a half core, even a Fluidyne or PWR, because I drive my car every day, 4 hours to race, and in general beat on it pretty hard.

Mikes01GSR

Well I drive my car daily making 420@ the wheels and have never over heated
once. I was actually at the drag strip last weekend where my friends rented it out
and got 18 total runs, sometimes 4 in a row and never once did the temp gauge go
past normal running temperature. Now relating to what J. Davis has to say, I'll be
a little nervous when I take it to the road course where it will probaly be in boost
for 30 min straight but only time will tell. I'm not sure how or why the dual core
half rad seems to work but it does, in time I do wanna to get a PWR or custom
aluminum rad.

earl

It seems you are missing the fact that the half size PWR (it is just a 92-00 Civic radiator) is twice as thick (dual core) as the OEM. It has TWICE the volume as the stock Honda Civic radiator. It would have equal volume compared to a full size integra. Also the aluminum is much more efficient in dissipating heat than oem plastic.

As to waterpumps, the oem Honda already pumps at more volume and speed than any radiator can handle anyway. That is why you must use a thermostat.

Your temperature guage will tell you if there are any problems with cooling, but those problems are more likely caused by things like sticking thermostats, fans not coming on in a timely manner, air trapped in your cooling system, coolant leaks, running a coolant restricting block guard, etc. There are no gremlins in the motor causing secret warpage. Everything happens for a reason.

Finally, everyone runs one that has turbo clearance issues. No one ever says "gee, my engine now runs hot since I switched to a half sized (not volume) aluminum radiator".

Integralove00

Thanks for the informative reply Earl. I just wanted to rest assured before making a purchase.

ion_four

the other day it was 97º out and I drove around at 5krpm, in second gear (approx. 45mph) for about 10 seconds and started to see the temp gauge rise. I have a single core civic radiator, and an external oil cooler. Mind you, I wasn't boosting. So, my dual core full radiator (integra) is with the UPS man

As J.Davis pointed out, you never really drive at high rpm for more than a few seconds, on the street, unless you are an *** like me and TRYING to wail on it. I want to track my car in the future, so I figured this was a quick and LEGAL way to simulate road-course conditions, despite the fact that I only have 45mph airflow, as opposed to 90+ as I would at the top of 3rd-&gt;4th.

For the street, any radiator is fine. For the REAL track...