turboex

Ok there is a slight knock that goes a way a bit when the motor warms up but it is really loud as startup. If i pull the number 1 plug wire of the noise goes away. The motor has all new acl bearings that were all sized perfect. any ideas?

Sonny

What kind of rods? Did you check the side-to-side clearance between the rod and crank? Eagle rods on my crank were .017"...right at the factory spec.

Sonny

turboex

there crower rods. and the clearance was all good. its weird that its just one piston.

TREVER

Sounds like piston slap. If it goes away after it warms up it sounds like the wall clearance is being taken up by the heat expansion. What pistons and what was the piston to wall clearance set at?

turboex

I the pistons are edyne. I cant rember the clearance. But wouldent the noise come from all the cyls if it was slap?

crxhybrid1320

Probably piston slap at warm up. Heard of this before also.
Rod knock will normally knock after its warm also.
Maybe one was honed more than then rest or not honed properly thats why only one is doing it!


[Modified by crxhybrid1320, 1:58 PM 1/19/2003]

turboex

Rod knock will normally knock after its warm also.

so your saying rod knock would be louder when the motors warm?

crxhybrid1320

You can hear a rod knock when the engine is warmed up but is not as loud.
I have also hear a pinging noise too at my work when the timing is too far advanced but is probably not your problem.

My best guess would be piston slap. Does it make noise after its warmed up.
If so that will be a major problem, the knock sensor will feel this and retard your timing.

Some turbo pistons are made alittle small and will slap, one you are warm and boosting there os alot of heat and expands the piston and the slap will go away.

turboex

Yeah it kinda oges a away a good bit once its warm. Its just weird that one cyl is much louder than the others. Now i gotta fix the idle problem. It goes from 900rpm to 1500rpm over and over.

crxhybrid1320

Could the the Idle air control valve.
Normaly the IAC will cause this. This is the sensor on the back of the intake manifold next to the Throttle Body and has the 2 coolant hoses going into it.

turboex

yeah when i unhook the iac it goes away

TREVER

probally not the iacv. probally a vacuum leak. iacv failures are rare.

I would consider pulling the head popping that slug out and measuring the wall clearance. my machinist measure all cylinders seperatly. I have seen pistons vary some and if the machine shop bored to the largest piston the smallest one could have to much clearance. Maybe thats why only one piston is doing it. Maybe the machine shop screwed up and over bored that hole?

earl

Could be either. A leak down (not compression check) might tell you something. Otherwise, pull the pan and check out the rod bearing in question

crxhybrid1320

He is using the acl bearing like you sell earl!
I though in recent posts thast these bearing worked well.

turboex

I did a leak down test and it pulled 15percent across the board. This is a not broke in yet not even a mile on the motor. I figured out a bit of it. The d-series wires we were using were causeing a shitty park, so now the idle is much better but the knock is still there. I think im gonna pull the pan and check the rod just incase. and other ideas?

earl

Don't blame me, I just sell them and use them Anything is possible

crxhybrid1320

yeah anything is possible right.

Maybe the engine was not lubed properly when installed rods and bearings, or maybe did not start the new motor correctly. If there is no oil on the oil pump or bearings could have wore metal away at start-up causing the knock now.
It noesnt knock once warm I would think piston slap.

Pull the EFI fuse and build oil pressure to lubercate before start-up

[Modified by crxhybrid1320, 3:51 PM 1/19/2003]


[Modified by crxhybrid1320, 3:52 PM 1/19/2003]

earl

This is the kind of info that you should have disclosed in your first post. I would look to your rod bearing first. I'm not saying that's the problem but seems the pistons have not had time to get hurt unless piston to wall clearance was wrong. Need more info as to what was done in your rebuild

crxhybrid1320

Hey earl ckeck on my post about sleeves.
What ones do you recommend.
Right now have 81 mm JE pistons with the block guard. Is it worth selling the pistons and doing the sleeves or just leave it as is for now and wait and see later!

turboex

Pull the EFI fuse and build oil pressure to lubercate before start-up
I did this, this is not the first motor i have built. But that was a god point for others. Motor had plenty of asembly lube and had instant oil pressure. The know does seem to go away a bit after it heats up. this is specs on motor.

Head:
98 GSR
Complete port and polish by JG
Crower retainers
Crower valve springs
Ferra oversized valves
JG intake
JG Throttle body
JG cams
JG light speed cam gears
Cometic head gasket
AEM fuel rail
Taylor Plug wires
DSM 450cc injectors
B&M fuel pressure regulator

Block:
B20
Golden Eagle sleeves with o-rings
84.5 mm Bore
Endyn Rollerwave Turbo Pistons 9:1
Crower rods
ACL Complete bearing set
Gsr water pump
Gsr oil pump
Unorthodox under drive pulley

Transmission:
GSR tranny
Quaife ATB LSD
Honda saver Stage 3 custom clutch
JUN flywheel

Engine management:
Hondata 3b with dataloging
Skunk2 obd2-obd1 conversion harness

Motor was bored to match pistons by a very good machiest. He may have made a mistake, dont we all. But its just not like him. Im gonna let it warm up one more time, and then dump the oil. Ill pull the rod bolts on #1 just to check. If theres no wear then ill go with the slap theroy. OH also the header we have has a bit of a leak. Its an obx type-r deal. So ill try get that tight to, so im not hearing things. But it has to be something with #1 as when i pull the plug wire the sound totally goes away. Thanks for all the great help so far.

earl

I am a big fan of the open deck configuration so not much help on your thread.
Benson uses an open deck Darton which works great. I also sell open deck sleeves myself. I sell the 4 sleeves ready for installation for $295. RS Machine charges $650 to install my sleeves AND bore and hone the cylinders to your piston. This is probably a little more expensive than you can get sleeves installed PLUS the bore and hone from GE. I am just not a fan of any process that uses aluminum to reinforce steel. When things heat up, the steel expands at a different rate than aluminum causing uneven stress loads on the cylinder.

turboex

oh, question for ya guys. Can you use a b16 turbo hondata map (stock map sensor) on a b20/gsr? Im wondering is this is whats messing my idle. due to lack of fuel. Any ideas?

civicguy

is this a swap on a diferent car like a bseries on ef? i had the same problem like you but it was the fuel line was put in the wrong way not letting fuel go in,then we fixed and went away almost complete,but some still left so we raise the fuel presure and there you go its gone.just on a really cold weather like 20 deg does it again until warms up,then is gone

turboex

I havent messed with fuel pressre yet. good idea man

turboex

Well i pulled the rod cap this morning and it all looks normal. There are wear line but not ones that your can feel. So I think this is normal. Im gonna have to go with the piston slap on this one.