DA-NINE

Hello Honda Tech brothers. Im getting a sneaking suspicion that something might be up with my engine that I just built. So far it has 60 miles on it of various rpm driving (out of vtec if it matters) between idle and 4000rpm.

The main problem I am having is that the engine smokes out of the exhaust near idle when there is no throttle applied. Under acceleration the smoke disappears and there is no smoke present during deceleration in gear.

Head was redone less than a year ago with new valve stem seals and did not smoke at all on the last engine.

I Went from an ls/vtec (oem shortblock), to a b18c1 block, new ls crank, new oil pump, water pump, timing belt, bearings etc.

Oil pressure is great, reaches 50psi at 2000rpm or less with 10w30 oil.



Am I being overly dramatic for it being such a young engine?




FYI:
B18c1 Block
LS crank
Ls rods with Arp rod bolts
ARP head studs
Fel pro head gasket
New OEM oil and water pump (both b18c)



Oil is clean and clear, coolant is clean and clear no contamination found.



Thanks in advance guys.

spoolinlude

What color is smoke? Might just be vapor.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

What injectors? fuel used? any basemaps?

More information, please.

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

Is it turbocharged? What turbo? Any restrictor? What are the specs
On the ring end gaps and piston to wall clearance ?

DA-NINE

Blue, definately oil
Oem 240cc, neptune ecu with a gsr basemap, AFR at idle is 14.5-14.8

Currently Naturally aspired for break-in.



P2W- .0010" +- .0002

Ring end gaps are:
1st- .0010"
2nd-.0017"
OIl rails- .0011"

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Stock pistons? That's a very very tight p2w clearances

The ring gaps are also very very small as well

What's was your initial startup procedure and what oil, petroleum based or synthetic?
Fresh builds need to run petroleum based oil.

New valve stem seals as well?

Do a compression test, I've never heard of p2w and ring gaps that tight, might be the reason the car smokes.... the pistons don't have enough room to expand in the bore and the overly tight ring gaps might be causing seating issues
Also do a

DA-NINE

Cast pistons, all to factory b18c1 spec. Regular non-syn oil. break in procedure was(is) varied rpm between idle and 4000 rpm, gradually working up into the rpm range. letting the car engine brake down on decel.

Spawne32

iTrader: (3)

your first ring gap is wayy too small, i noticed you said currently aspirated for break in, which means your probably planning boost down the road, .0015 at least as a minimum on the top ring would be required. Why kind of ring compressor did you use? It's possible its a broken oil control ring, or a bad valve stem seal...gotta isolate it down to a specific cylinder or all cylinders if thats the case.

DA-NINE

Regular ratchet ring compressor. Clocked them to factory spec.

I think I know the problem.
I think one of my friends I was working with filled the engine with oil while the front end was in the air. Probably 5 quarts of oil in the thing. I'm up to 80 miles and changing the oil at 100 so ill be sure its correct..

I went to factory spec. I suppose the original ls block is going to the machine shop and getting set up for real boost.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Over fill won't matter when na, something else is wrong

And yes, all of your clearances are wrong, way too small for a boosted app (ideally)

And what are your power goals? Stock internals might not be enough so you might have wasted this rebuild

DA-NINE

Looking for 270Hp on this engine when its done.


I set all of them to factory specs, and people turbocharge factory engines left and right.


Today I finally put the car through its first cross over. after tuning out a lean spot right around 4500rpm @ WOT, the car sang in VTEC. was revving it to 6k.


Still smokes a bit between off idle and 2000rpm,


I think my ring end gaps prevented the rings from seating properly.

turbociv910

try driving your car harder.. ***** footing around wont seat the rings properly.

DA-NINE

Will do, thanks

blackeg

or you pull it now, rehone and open that ptw up a tiny bit then regap a new set of rings before you have some serious issues like ptw contact or whatever that will mess up the pistons and bore surface requiring a .020 over build.

redoing it now wont cost too much. really just a new set of rings, new hg and any machine costs. maybe 200- 300 dollars total . you can re use all the bearings and such.

mar778c

iTrader: (1)

This for sure. I may be too late already. I gather it has not been tuned.

SiRCiviC94

What's the plugs look like?

DA-NINE

it is essentially a stock engine, running stock maps.


I will pull the plugs and post pictures

DA-NINE

Were Can I find 81.5mm rings alone?

mar778c

iTrader: (1)

If you want stock performance, yes, you are correct. Don't worry about posting pictures of plugs. How those ring have seated are a bit more important.


Hastings or Acura/Honda.

DA-NINE

What vendors sellhastings. I can only find oem rings 81.25mm

DA-NINE

Bump.

What is the optimum crosshatch grit, or pattern also So i know for the future.

DA-NINE

I Used the search function and the glorious powers of the internet to find things out, who would have thunk' it.


I dont think my rings are ever going to seat at this rate. I have narrowed down the problem to a few possible causes.

The finish of my cylinders wasnt up to par, I could still see underlying material that was still near mirror finish, so i dont think my block ever had the cylinders honed properly.

Some "shop". I think my ring end gaps were fine for an oem rebuild but there is no surface for them to seat on hence the blow by.

Im going to pull it back apart, hone it with a 220-280grit stone @ 45* cross hatch angle as per hastings FAQ, New rings that will be gapped a little wider due to eminent turbocharging. and break it is to Hasting's specs.


Along with a head gasket, yadda yadda yadda.


Will keep you posted.

spoolinlude

Your piston to wall is TIGHT man. Who told you to build it that tight? Hell I wouldn't of done that tight even with N/A lol.

I would take it to a legit machine shop and have them power hone it, that will open up your p2w. Buy another set of rings.

Lesson learned for you I hope, make sure you have the right clearances for what you're trying to do. Big boost race motors run .007 p2w or looser (I am not suggesting you go this loose). If you're going to build a motor for boost may as well do it right the first time, no point in rebuilding a motor to stock if you're planning to turbo it.

blackeg

yeah id do this its way easier than having to buy all new parts when u ptw contact..

fyi i built my motor pretty loose for the power level, about .0048 ptw @500whp. it has great compression and leakdown, and it doesnt smoke or have excessive blowby. i learned after i built a tight one and cranked the boost tuning on the dyno...

DA-NINE

I see said the blind man, I love to learn all the ins and outs but damn, does it have to be like this xD

Some of the smoke has since cleared up, did a few WOT pulls to see how the car would react, smoked for the first 2 pulls then cleared up and now only smokes when rolling to a stop with the engine near idle.


Time to order a new set of rings!