PhantomX

Just like the title, I've been talkin to my friends about getting a new tranny for my LS-T, but i got mixed reviews about both Trannys.... I need more info!!!



VS.



Which one is better and why? Price to do the whole swap will be nice too... thankx

BoostedEG6

one trans has LSD where the other doesnt seem to have LSD (but I cant say 100%)




Modified by BoostedEG6 at 4:31 PM 6/3/2007

tony413

will you just please search this is gone over ALOT.
what are your needs thats the only thing important are you racing the car hardcore or DD or only street driving?

but if anything bcuz you have an LS-T keep the stock gearing and change the final gear ratio or whatever else you need to modd the tranny to your needs

numbnuts22715

This is only my opinion on the subject, so other people may think otherwise, but I guess it really depends on how much power you wanna make.

You dont want to go through the gears too fast.

I would definitely drop the ls tranny, it's gears are pretty damn long.

An LSD would help A LOT.

If the b16 has an lsd, and the gsr doesnt, get the b16.
If they both have it, or both dont have it, I think I would recommend the gsr. I really like how mine is geared, It has a nice compromise for quickness al throughout acceleration, as well as cruising.

ForceFed Motorsports

Touchie subject but here it is... it all depends on your goals and what the purpose of the car is. If its a daily driven ls-t then ls tranny is definitely the way to go. Unless you plan on track only, w/ large slicks, and are looking for tuned ratios to compensate for turbo size, cam size, and rev limit then stick with ls tranny. LS tranny is perfect for LS powerband. Without the addition of the modifications i mentioned those trannies will keep to high in the rpm powerband. Not a smart choice, get a lsd for the ls tranny and call it good

1fastEK9

you should use the LSD trany it doesn't matter if is for daily driving or track the results are greater with it

ForceFed Motorsports

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1fastEK9 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you should use the LSD trany it doesn't matter if is for daily driving or track the results are greater with it </TD></TR></TABLE>

Far from the truth, there are too many variables to make that comment.

EARLdaSQUIRREL

gsr transmission with lsd

ls transmission is way to long no matter what anyone says

ForceFed Motorsports

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by coptzer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">gsr transmission with lsd

ls transmission is way to long no matter what anyone says </TD></TR></TABLE>

Says the lost child of ls-t

tony413

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ForceFed_Motorsports &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Says the lost child of ls-t
</TD></TR></TABLE>

lol i was once there too

a1320honda

My personal experience...Ive had a 00 type-r w/lsd, and also had a stock ls which is in the car now and ran faster with the ls tranny and easily cutting consistent 2.0 60ft. times on street tires. Plus with my rev limit set at 7500 the type-r would top out at 137ish. My ls tranny does 165. So if you mess around on the freeway at all youll def. want the ls. Im pro ls all the way and absoultly love it. and im speaking from experience with both. At 10psi shifting through the gears ive never fallen out of my powerband.

Heres the vid of my ls tranny.

KeyserSoze

Like has been said before this has been covered a LOT of times, you have been here long enough and have enough posts that you should be searching for this stuff.

That being said, for all out acceleration the b16 and itr trannies are the best. Now, can you keep traction, who knows. But that is not the fault of the tranny. Next best accelerating transmssion is the gsr and lastly the ls.

Do people cut good times with ls trannies? Yes. Is it the best route for them to take.....well that depends. IMO the best of both worlds in definately a gsr tranny. The gears in the ls are to long and I would be more inclined to put a b16/itr in a drag/track car.

Heres a post from Jeff Evans from a while back. Dunno if he still abides by this theory but maybe it will help you a bit.............

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted hybrid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Gear ratios are merely a way to trade torque for rpm. With a higher numerical gear ratio, you are putting more rpm at the wheel. With closer gear ratios, you are able to stay at a higher rpm in between shift points. Something like the LS transmissions are suited more towards the broad torque curve/low reving LS engine. It keeps you in the peak torque area in between shifts. The ITR/SI/GSR transmissions keep the rpm's built up in between shifts, to stay in the more peaky powerband.

Having said that, for the track the itr/si tranny is the best hands down. Most high whp turbo engines are operating between 5.5-9k, and having their shift points in between. In combination with a tall slick size (24.5"+), and the high shift point (8.5-9k), you are able to keep the engine operating within the optimum torque curve.

With the LS transmission, between shifts it would possibly drop you out of the optimal powerband and therefore make you slower. Gearing simply put allows you to stay in the powerband of your engine in between shifts.

The myth that you stay in gear longer with the LS transmission makes you faster is purely false. Think about that statement for a second. Acceleration is the measure of velocity over a unit time. Watching the rpms climb on the tach during a 3rd/4th gear pull, they would be climbing slower than with the si/itr tranny. Looking at the definition of acceleration as a measure of velocity over a unit time, the engine would be getting to the same velocity over a slower time lapse. This would yield slower acceleration, and simply put make you slower.

Having said that, the gsr transmission is probably the best balance of a street/strip transmission. The gearing is a little less aggressive as the itr/si transmissions, which will yield a little more traction. For all out acceleration si/itr tranny wins hands down. For a slower car, go with the LS transmission.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

As for the prices, well.....you will just have to gind that out yourself. GL.

PhantomX

Thankx for all then info....

EARLdaSQUIRREL

Having said that, the gsr transmission is probably the best balance of a street/strip transmission. - jeff evans

ha ha ive been saying this all along

93CX

Whichever has LSD..

but personally I wouldnt want a B16 tranny on a low revving motor like the LS. It will always suck unless you're at WOT.

blackeg

just make the trannny meet your setup - if you hahve a small turbo use an ls trans, larger turbo higher geared gsr trans. i think the b16 tranny might be too short for a street car especially if you do a lot of highway messing around.


ive had all the combos, and i think my t3t4 with .48 exhaust and ls trans was the most fun

JDMs1eeper

LS FTW

ForceFed Motorsports

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by coptzer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
ha ha ive been saying this all along </TD></TR></TABLE>

Congrats... but he stated exactly my point. How many ls-t setups do you know that rev to 9.5k let alone even 8k lol? What i stated was exactly true and the real reason for picking a transmission. You must choose one based on your wheel size <TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ForceFed_Motorsports &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> turbo size, cam size, and rev limit</TD></TR></TABLE>

Im sorry but as i stated before, unless your going full drag setup with huge slicks, revving upwards of 8k with an ls, and are even making power that high in the rpms then ls transmission will be perfect for ls powerband. Im not saying that its the one and only answer but for most cases is the optimum overall choice.

notfastenough

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93CX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Whichever has LSD..

but personally I wouldnt want a B16 tranny on a low revving motor like the LS. It will always suck unless you're at WOT.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You must not be speaking from personal experience, b/c I LOVE my b16 tranny with the ls-na. who has a honda that can actually accelerate in 5th at 40 mph....me. for b16 tranny for me. With the ls's torque curve+short gears makes it feel like you have more than 1.8 liter engine.

However, I don't really drive on the highway. with 195/50r15's, my fuel cut is very close to 130 in 5th. If I had a mid to high hp turbo car, I would either mod the engine to rev to 8k with tall slicks or run a different fd.

ForceFed Motorsports

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notfastenough &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You must not be speaking from personal experience, b/c I LOVE my b16 tranny with the ls-na. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Were talking about ls-turbo and the last time i checked this was the forced induction forum

$ISELLTOU4LESS$

Ok, I know this is the forced induction forum, but this is just my personal experience. I know the torque on a B16 and a LS is WAYYY different, But I have had my fair share of setups. I had a B16 Hatch with Si tranny (CTR cams CTR Pulley, ACT Clutch, Light Flywheel etc), I loved the car with VTEC and it pulled really nicely and felt very quick. Then I wrecked it, so then I got another hatch and dropped an LS in it, because I had my turbo stuff I was going to put on my B16. It is a bone stock LS swap with S80 (not sure on the code) LS Tranny. I raced my friends car in both cars, and the LS is better because of the gearing, in 4th gear, I pull and pull and pull and pull. Whereas my B16 tranny I would run really hard until about 3rd gear then he would catch me and we would stayy even or he would pull a half car, then a car at higher speeds. His car is an 06 Sentra SER Spec V 6 Speed). So kind of in short for the torque and 7,000 revs that the LS has, the LS tranny is better in my opinion, because it isn't so short geard that you break the tires loose, but it continues to pull and pull. Now if I had a B16 and was turboing it, I would go with the GSR tranny, because the B16 doesn't have nearly the amount of torque that the LS has, But depending on the setup you have it all matters, but Istill like the LS tranny just for the long gearing. I have raced a few people now with my LS hatch, and it is either even until about 3rd into 4th then i just leave them, not saying my car is a rocket, just saying that with the LS tranny in 4th it pulls hard. Well anyways my turbo should be on in a few weeks, so I guess it will show the tru test.

fmfkid250

I have done test's with both ls and GSR

I personally went faster on an ls
11.01 on Drag radials (lstrans)
11.13 on Drag radials(GSR)
the ls was better overall on the motor
(i wasent about to bash rev limiter in 4th@9300rpm)

go with the ls 7000rpm redline you WILL run out of gear with a 23" tire in the 1/4

notfastenough

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ForceFed_Motorsports &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Were talking about ls-turbo and the last time i checked this was the forced induction forum </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah yeah But what I'm getting at is that a b16 tranny isn't useless in a ls-t car, it means you need sticky tires Personally, I love the "torquey" feeling of a car when driving around town. Even with a small turbo on this same setup, I still think it is a decent combo....preferences i suppose.

boostedDA

iTrader: (1)

This is going to be an endless argument that has been beat to death. Honestly, it's all going to come down to your personal preference. Physics and pure common sense show that shorter gearing will out-accelerate longer gears in a perfect world scenerio. Obviously we all know the world isn't perfect, and that there will be limiting factors. Do you have the money to run a stricly race setup on the street, and not care about drivability? If so, go with the shorter gears. It will accelerate the quickest. To me, I've driven both. I don't have the money to invest in a nice suspension setup with big slicks and a nice traction bar. I like to cruise at a decent rpm on the freeway, so I stuck with the LS tranny. To ME, it was just more practical for a street car. If this were my drag car, and I didn't have limiting factors to keep me from driving with 24.5" slicks on the street all the time I would have went with the B16 transmission hands down. But like I said, for a street car it's all going to boil down to your personal preference. Just my .02

fmfkid250

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notfastenough &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Yeah yeah But what I'm getting at is that a b16 tranny isn't useless in a ls-t car, it means you need sticky tires Personally, I love the "torquey" feeling of a car when driving around town. Even with a small turbo on this same setup, I still think it is a decent combo....preferences i suppose. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Do you like shifting to 5th in the 1/4?

personally its not my thing but i dunno