Vspronk

Going to build my b16 over the winter so I am researching internal components to support 14-18psi. I know there are many options when it comes to pistons and rods so that's not an issue. What I am wondering is ive seen different piston sizes. Stock diameter is 81mm I believe and with that will after market pistons fit in with no modification or with I need to machine the block at all. The rest of the engine is stock as in the head and such.

Thanks

09chaplak

Are you asking if standard size aftermarket pistons will fit an unmodified block?

Vspronk

I guess what I meant to say was that if there was anything I needed to do to the block to prep it for the new pistons. Or do the new aftermarket ones just slide in and good to go.

09chaplak

If they're the same size, in a way no. Now since you have everything apart, there are some things you may want to consider doing but not necessarily because you're getting some new pistons in there.

Vspronk

Things like? Shaving balancing crank? Sleeves?

09chaplak

Easy guy, start here.
G2IC Turbo Guide - A Guide to Turbocharging your Honda / Acura Integra

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>Do yourself a favor and read my build thread. &nbsp;I have an extensive &quot;how to rebuild a block for boost&quot; how-to.</p><p>https://honda-tech.com/honda-civic-d...hread-3185556/</p><p>No, you can't just toss new pistons in and call it a day. &nbsp;New pistons mean new rods, because floating pin and pressed pin don't play well together. &nbsp;New rods means new bearings. &nbsp;New pistons means block honing, which may mean oversized pistons. &nbsp;There's quite a bit that goes into building a motor.</p><p>Also, PSI doesn't matter. &nbsp;It doesn't mean a ******* thing. &nbsp;Stop thinking in PSI. &nbsp;Start thinking in power goals.</p>

Vspronk

Thanks for the link. And I've got power goals. My turbo guy is rebuilding my turbo for me. Looking to make 300-325, and 14-18psi should get me there. With some engine work of course.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>Forget about PSI. &nbsp;******* forget about it. &nbsp;Don't make me say it again. &nbsp;PSI doesn't mean a ******* thing. &nbsp;Get it out of your head. &nbsp;18&nbsp;PSI through a GT06 is a stiff breeze. &nbsp;18&nbsp;PSI through a C16 will turn your motor into slag, no matter what pistons you put in it. &nbsp;A B series motor doesn't need any internal work for those power levels - it can do it just fine on stock internals. &nbsp;Save yourself some money.</p>

Vspronk

PSI does matter. Stock internals won't handle more than 10. So replacing the pistons and rods to strengthen the motor and drop the compression to run more is pretty important.

Vspronk

And if I can make 300whp NA with stock internals I'm all ears. This is all new to me.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>Whoever told you stock internals &quot;won't handle more than 10 PSI&quot; is a ******* idiot. &nbsp;It's power levels, and shitty tunes that break parts, not PSI. &nbsp;Forget PSI is even a thing. &nbsp;Just erase it from your brain. &nbsp;The only thing that matters is your power goal. &nbsp;Forget about dropping compression, too. &nbsp;That's ancient methodology. &nbsp;You live in the 21st century. &nbsp;You don't need to lower your CR for boost anymore. &nbsp;Also, I never said you could make 300 NA with stock internals. &nbsp;I said you can easily make 300 on stock internals. &nbsp;A GT2860RS on a B16A variant will do that, easily, without breaking a sweat, and without ever having to open up the motor.</p><p>You obviously have some extremely wrong notions about the world of FI. &nbsp;Here. &nbsp;Start reading this. &nbsp;Once you've read it all, read it again. &nbsp;Go get dinner. &nbsp;Read it before going to sleep. &nbsp;Wake up and read it tomorrow in the shower. &nbsp;Have James Earl Jones record it onto a CD, and listen to it while you drive to work. &nbsp;During your lunch break, read it again. &nbsp;Listen to the CD again on your drive home. &nbsp;Keep reading all of this until you realize that PSI doesn't matter, at ******* all, lower compression is ******* stupid, and most of what you've been told in the past is probably wrong. &nbsp;You're with the professors now.</p><p>https://honda-tech.com/forced-induct...2A%2A-1024174/</p>

Vspronk

Settle down man. I'm just trying to learn this stuff as I've never done it before, hence coming to this forum. So if all I need to do is slap a turbo on and get a good tune then good, that makes things easier. I will read more in depth the faq's in the forced induction threads. Winter is long so I've got time to do. I want to do this build by myself so I understand the need to have correct information.

White_EG1

Yeah, that's the jist of it.

I would recommend arp head studs though. And while youre in there give it a new head gasket, and timing belt/ water pump, if you already haven't. Then you'd be golden, pretty cheap insurance if I do say so myself.

Vspronk

Ya its supercharged right now but that's coming off. The motor is fresh only 60000km (canadian car). But ya oncei pull the engine I'll take a look at all the gaskets to keep it fresh. Thanks for the tip.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

You don't need internals for the power you're trying to make.

Schister66

Power goals, not PSI. Different turbos make vastly different amounts of power...some are small, some are large meaning a comparison solely based on boost pressure is irrelevant. If you must compare, use lb/min flow rates to compare...

If we sound frustrated by having to explain this, its that we do this multiple times each week and after 10 years (see join date), it starts to get irritating.

theYBLEGAL

https://honda-tech.com/forced-induct...today-2139051/

If it were me...

Take it all apart. Take the block and crank to your machinist. Ask him to measure cylinders, and recommend piston size. Probably 81.25mm, .25 or .50mm over bored. Determine if this is race only, or a street car, then determine forged or cast pistons. Either way I'd do forged rods. Order pistons and rods, take them to machinist. Have him bore/hone and balance the bottom end. Bring it home, plasitgauge the crank bearings yourself. The only specialty tool you need to buy is a ring compressor, and a hoist (I'm thinking). Refresh head's valve seals.

But as you can tell, make any changes in the block, and you need machinist skills/accurate tools. I spent maybe $1500 on tools. Calipers, dial bore gauge, straight edge, good feeler gauges, lift, valve spring compressor tool, etc. I've been doing this for 10+ years, and I know I'll continue, so it was worth the investment.

Machinist costs weren't bad tho.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

How do you think I feel lol.

Vspronk

Ok I've forgot about psi. It just seems to me that making 300hp on a stock engine that has 160hp stock doesn't seem like it would have any longevity. I want to make a fun street car that is turboed. Installing better internals just sounds like a safe bet. I fully understand the importance of tuning and how it can make it break an engine. My fuel system is already upgraded due to the supercharger. I'm just trying to understand that how my stock b16 can make the power I want just by swapping the blower for the turbo. It to me doesn't feel like it would be strong enough. I see that people have done it but still doesn't seem like it would last making those kind of numbers.

Geis

Yeah, you don't think it would because you don't know what these engines can, or for how long. We do, so when we tell you what it's good for and if it will be reliable or not this is coming from people who DO KNOW, so quit ignoring the advice you're getting here.
With just pistons and rods, you could press at least 400 reliably. Stock around 350, rods are usually first to go.

theYBLEGAL

On the street, how often are you into the throttle more than 50% on even a 250whp Civic? Answer: Not much to never.

Unless you race everything that moves, you'll be driving in NA territory most of the time.

If you race more often than you think I'm assuming, you may be a candidate for forged pistons and sleeves as well. But know that is temperature and warm up time sensitive, to some degree. Not as daily when you can't just start up and go, you have to wait 5 minutes for some temperature to build before you're just scuffing walls or skirts.

Stock or cast anything will fail under repetitive high (300+) horsepower abuse such as lap racing, or continuous highway runs, sooner than later. It depends on how you drive it!

In general, know what you want the car to do, and the environment it will be in. Low horsepower daily, and high power on a toggle for the occasional "official" drag is most common.

AZ_CIVIC

iTrader: (1)

If it were me I would take care of the block. New pistons, rings, rods, bearings, etc.

Everyone always says they want 300whp but as soon as they reach 300whp they want more and try and push it further until they break something.

For $1500 bucks or less you can have a block with some fresh new parts that will allow you to step up past 300whp if you want or give you piece of mind regarding longevity if not.

Trying to push the limits on stock blocks with who knows how many miles is dumb. Having the best tune or tuner isn't going to help the longevity of old worn out parts not really designed for a turbo application. Just my opinion

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>B series engines have been proven to be reliable at 300 HP on stock internals, just like D series engines have been proven to be reliable at 200 HP on stock internals. &nbsp;Just because you &quot;find it hard to believe&quot; doesn't make it any less true. &nbsp;Many, many people have done this, have pushed the envelope, and have found the breaking points, and they are now well known. &nbsp;You absolutely don't need to open the motor for 300.</p>

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I do tend to agree with AZ CIVIC on this one.. Its not just about power level, its the type of use that determines how this should be built.

"Pushing" on a dyno or for several seconds is nothing compared to some enduro racing