Adi Radoncic

Hey guys this is not a rant on anything but yesterday I pulled my head of as a follow up on this topic https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=224758 and after taking all of the bolts of from the manifold it seemed to be stuck there and I couldn't pull the thing off.

To make a long story short I pulled the head off the block with the manifold on it and after about 20minutes 2 screwdrivers and a rubber mallet I got the thing of the head....

This thing was basicly looked worped to **** after putting it on a flat surface,
now I don't know if they ever recomended for the manifold nuts to be torqued up to the head in a certain manner but I did it from the center on out.....

So I guess I'm just venting about my dissapointing experiance....

Adi

P.S. when I pulled the cams out from the yournals I had grooves in my journals about 3 thousands deep.. so I have to pick up another head here soon.
I will make a new topic tonight about that whole experiance...

falcongsr

so you're saying it looks like the flange that bolts to the head has warped? and this looks like its caused from heat? definitely not you prying on it with a screwdriver right?

Full-Race Javier

which manifold, h or b series? can u show me some pics of the flange?

Adi Radoncic

Well Joe the flange that bolts to the head is definitely warped and It was definitely caused from the metal expanding and retracting from heat.

And this was definitely not caused from my screwdriver because I couldn't pull the manifold off to beginn with just using my hands, besides I don't think 316 ss metal would bend any with me prying on it with a screwdriver.

Adi

It is on a b series manifold and I can have some pictures for you by tonight.

[Modified by newgsr for javierb14]


[Modified by newgsr, 1:21 PM 8/7/2002]

falcongsr

just checking.

i am kinda suprised to hear that the flange would warp from thermal cycling.

why are you tearing your motor down? did it get toasted? could the mani been exposed to conditions outside of what it was designed for? were there expansion reliefs cut into the flange?

Joe

Adi Radoncic

Expansion slots have been cut into the manifold by max rev an they were cut inbetween every runner.

I pulled the head off because one day I took my car out and it just died on me and one of the wouldrough sheer keys got sheared off so I took the cams out and found that I have grooves in the cam journals, also another reason for me pulling the head off is because I had a small coolant leak from the inline pro head gasket I was using...

Adi

Full-Race Javier

adi,

we have never had any problems with our manifolds warping or cracking. keep in mind that any manifold/metal will warp or become distorted when it is exposed to "extreme" temperature. we stand behind our products 100% and we will resurface the flange for you at no cost. if you would like us to machine it for u, call us @ 480-985-1315 or email me @ chassisteam@hotmail.com.

Adi Radoncic

Javier,

What would be considered "extreme" temperature in this case?
Because I will admit that I have hit 1600 in some ocasions while trying to tune my car...

Adi

shadowdawn

I may not own your kit but that statement makes me have faith in aftermarket part businesses (not that I didn't)... I like a man that stands behind his product and is willing to help out a part gone wrong free of charge.... to you my friend :D

Mr. Softee

pimp

Full-Race Javier

1600 deg F ~= 871 deg C....i would consider that pretty hot. also for comparison, if you look at a greddy EGT gauge, it begins to "redline" at 900 deg C and the autometer EGT ends at 1600 deg F. i believe they are designed this way since the standard K type thermocouple can only read up to 1650 deg F or 900 deg C. also, most if not all of the cars we tune/install are set for a max EGT temp of 780 deg C ~= 1436 deg F. this is what we consider a safe max. but the offer still stands.

Cramerox

good man...

Marc

symba

That's what I call good service...Now Javier, all you need to do is get that application going for the h23a1!!!

Full-Race Javier

im on it, trying to make the d-series right now then i can make the H23.

bruthaboost

That's good info to know since I'll be getting tuned in a few weeks and have your manifold. Thanks for the info.

Adi Radoncic

Javier,

I will email you about this subject so we can go ahead and fix this problem.

Thanks very much...

Adi

Full-Race Geoff

holy friggin mackarel 1600!!! last time i saw a egt go that high my buddies valves looked like coal (literally). Hope things on the exhaust side are still ok. BTW thanks for being honest about hitting 1600, a lot of people lie and say "i was jsut driving around not even boosting" (i hate that line...)

Javier -- youre cool. good job


[Modified by FFgeoff, 1:36 AM 8/8/2002]

jdblack1

javier

when are you guys predicting the release of a D series manifold?

1fstevo

That's weird, I have hit 820 degree celius many times right now and 800 degree celius everytime I raced last year the whole time without problems. After last year, I tear down the motor for inspection and yes some valves were alittle black but it's from runing rich, cleaned it up and put it together again this year. Aside from running rich, would timing retarded too much cause high egt temperture? Can anyone confirm?

1fstevo

BTW, many eclipse self tuners are trying to tune closely to 900 degree celius but not passing it thinking that's the best way to get the car run fast, is that correct? I never believed that but who knows.

dustin

Max EGT is @ stoich, so go figure

1fstevo

which is??

Arturbo

14.7:1

1fstevo

not a/f, I meant generally on honda motor, what is the EGT read at stoich? Never had a chance to do it when I had the stock ecu, ems will never let me go stoich.


[Modified by [Evo]Hybrid, 9:51 AM 8/8/2002]

1fstevo

I found something that states on how to use EGT to tune, sounds pretty good but my question is how timing events effect EGT reading. Anyone know?

"high temps indicate lean condition. Not always true! Excessively rich conditions will result in "after burn", where the fuel, which was unable to completely combust due to insufficient oxygen in the cylinder, lights off in the exhaust system, causing an unusually high temp reading. If all other indicators still suggest a rich mixture, try leaning in small steps, and you will likely see the EGT go down. Just be sure that the power does not also go down from the changes. If you are on the right track, power should go up noticeably as you lean towards optimal mixture while EGT drops. As you approach and then pass the optimal mixture point, the EGT will begin to climb again. STOP! Richen by one step and you are there."


[Modified by [Evo]Hybrid, 10:05 AM 8/8/2002]