nihad

iTrader: (2)

Ok i have a D16 and after some hard pulls it wants to start over heating... Is my fan to small or weak or is the thermostat not opening up fast enough should i get one that opens at lower temps.. Help me out with this.. The fan i have is a ebay 12in and a cx racing 2in radiator with 13lbs cap.. What fan should i buy... and should i buy a diffrent lower temp thermostat

HiProfile

The OEm gauge starts moving again at about 210F. A colder thermostat will give you 30 seconds longer before it gets past 210F. Even if it opened slow, it would eventually cool down if your coolant system was good.

If you look around, 90% of the "cooling issues" threads have 3 things in common - 1) cheezy ebay slimfan, 2) no full shroud for the radiator/fan, and 3) zero heat wraping. The thick rad actually makes it worse for that fan, since it's flow drops severely when it has to push through thicker fins.

Fixing just one of those things will completely change things around. Changing 2 will keep it cool unless you're in Death Valley, changing all 3 will keep it cool while racing IN Death Valley.

da_dude

I had the same problem. I switch to a 13" SPAL fan and problem solve.

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Looks like i will look for a spal 13"... I purchased the "cheezy" 12" fan of ebay it look like it would work for stock civic.. The radiator i purchased is a cx racing i dont see any thing wrong with it fits nice... My cooling system is good..I have had the head milled flat and a new y8 gasket oem... Its good its just some times it likes to go past half.. I will look for a new fan which other brands do you guys recommend and what thermostat should i get..

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Yeh the coolant keeps pushing.. I have replaced the head gasket with a y8 honda gasket and had the head milled so it shouldnt have any head lift its torqued to 70LBS.. What happens when i WOT it will push and start spraying out of my overflow tank.. Its a stock honda overflow tank.. So if i caped of the radiator over flow that would keep it in side the system and it wouldn't overheat.. Is this safe to do and i am thinking of drilling a hole in the thermostat where the nipple is at.. Like 1/4-3/8 hole.. So its recirculation most of the time i dont have a climate control if i did that would keep it cooler to.. I wish i could run a full size radiator..

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Would it be smart to remove the T stat.. I know its good to warm up the engine as fast as possible but then its hard to keep it cool..

HiProfile

If it keeps pushing, that means the mating surfaces are probably warped again, your torque wrench is inaccurate, you're not using the moly lube right, or you have some gunk left in the headbolt threads that are messing up the torque numbers. In other words, your HG mating surfaces are to blame.

In many cases, once your HG shoots a load (of coolant), the head warps juuuust enough to keep repeating the problem. The needle is in the middle spot from ~150-210F (I forget the exact numbers), after that it rises. Not far above that is overheat zone, where coolant turns to steam, and allows parts of the head to get superheated.

The extra hole in the t-stat won't do anything. There is already a small hole mainly for removing air pockets. If the t-stat opening, it's the entire system that can't keep up.


1st I'd suggest testing your t-stat with water and a thermometer. 2nd get a SPAL brand fan, at least a 12" medium profile (13" hi-prof is awsome). 3rd rig up some ducting to the rad, or make a fan shroud. 4th get the head/block checked for straigtness if it still pushes coolant.

nihad

iTrader: (2)

I will try to get a SPal soon.. I am woundering if i took out the t stat that would keep it cooler a bit at least up high but i would have to let it warm up a little longer then i usually would have to. And should the overflow be pressure raised like most turbo charged cars are....

nihad

iTrader: (2)

would like a answer to my last question about the pressure rising overflow so it doesn't leak...

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Fixed few things got a new upper rad hose and that is better now... But it still pushes some coolant.. What should i do retorque it to 80lbs or wait for my spal fan and see if that helps 12in low profile... If it doesnt i will remove the hood or raise it in the back.. I really am stuck on this one... And would appreciate any help.. Would a golden eagle head gasket help.. Thanks for help..

da_dude

If you're pushing coolant back to the reservoir then look into a new radiator cap before head gasket. Get the fan on and go from there. It's a good idea to retroque the head studs after a few heat cycle.

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Yeh the fan should be here soon i am thinking maybe a oem rad cap might be the best idea i have the cx racing cap and a 13psi one.. I also dont have the heater in the car and just re ran the hose to the side of the head so am thinking maybe if i had the heater that would help a little bit..

But today when i was driving it would over heat little bit when normal driving then the fan comes on and it goes back down..

jarven93

Check intake gasket, i had a problem with my Z6 boosting air into the water pocket on the intake mantifold , causing over heating problem when under a load or boosting!

nihad

iTrader: (2)

I have a plastic IM gasket... Its not leaking so i dont know why it would leak in to the coolant system... But a good idea i will tighten it up.. Any other things that could be a problem the coolant system holds pressure but when it gets little to much it sprays in to the overflow.. Then i got to pull over release the pressure and pore it back in to the radiator.. And then its all good.. This happens when i boost up to 100mph at WOT.. Normal driving is fine and coolant system works good... But if i hit it a few times it starts to do this ****... Let me know if there is any thing else i can do ... I been thinking about swaping the heater back in and if that doesnt fix it then buy some motul water wetter..

HiProfile

I don't know if my posts are too long or if you're hoping for the best while ignoring the worst. Make a promise to yourself you will read this entire post, since I feel I'm just wasting my time trying to help.



If it's still pushing coolant, something is adding pressure to your coolant passages or your rad cap sucks. The coolant system will get up to ~16psi, then move water into the overflow (slowly) as the coolant expands.

**If the rad cap sucks, it will leak coolant out before that. A coolant system below the intended pressure will not have as high of a boiling point, meaning anything slightly over normal temps can boil your coolant.

**It it's not the cap, then something is forcing additional pressure into your coolant system. To spray out, it has to be FAR more than 16psi of pressure pushing into your coolant passages. Since overheating can warp your head & block enough to ruin your HG seal, and max cyl pressures on a boosted honda can get over 1000psi, it's probably shooting air from the cylinder into your coolant.


There is actually a way to test for both. One is a test for hydrocarbons (oil/gasoline) in your coolant. If there is any in your coolant, the HG is toast. The next test is usually free at auto stores, pressure testing your rad cap. They're only a few bucks and a test is will be done in no time. Same for stock thermostats, easy to test in boiling water and only a few bucks to replace.

nihad

iTrader: (2)

I read it all.... Thanks for helping..

I will retorqe the head studs to 80lbs which i think is alot but it might help who knows. I have 2 diffrent radiator caps so both do the same.. The turbo is watercooled could that cause this maybe air from the compressor some how makes it in to the watersystem... I doubt this to its a new BB turbo.. I have read about installing copper liners around the top of the piston deck.. Has any one done this to a D16.. I probably will pull the head later this winter and check it again... This truly sucks

nihad

iTrader: (2)

No coolant in the oil or oil in the coolant.. If there was i wouldnt be posting this it would of been torn apart.. What i think the problem is is the deck of the block it must leak threw there.. I had the head milled and added a new gasket so it can be that... When i built the motor we never had the block milled the machinist didnt say it needed it.. But this does tend to happen when i boost hard and fast.. Slow boost is ok.. I dont let the car overheat it gets up to H little below but i dont let it go past that its probably around 210F...

HiProfile

In an earlier post I mentioned how the stock temp needle works. From ~150F to 210F it stays in it's normal "middle" spot. 220F+ will be 3/4 of the way to H. It doesn't take much over 210F to warp a block or head, especially if a steam pocket is created. That alone can heat that spot on the head more than enough to warp it. By "warp", I'm taking about less than .003" of an inch, half that of a human hair. It's very slight, but enough to make your HG fail.


There's practically no way for it to leak pressure into the the coolant hoses around the turbo. None of those passages connect to the compressor, and if the only one that comes close did (the oil passages), you'd be shooting white coolant from the oil mixing into it.

What you're suggesting is called o-ringing the block with the copper rings. That helps in extreme situatings, but most people can take an OEM Honda headgasket to 500whp without problems IF their head & deck aren't warped. An o-ringed, step-decked block with a warped surface still won't seal properly. It will also be more expensive than milling the block & head.

BTW just be VERY careful with 80lbs on the studs. You will be running the chance of over torquing them (permanently stretching them), as well as running the chance of stripping the threads in the block.

redzcstandardhatch

great input hiprofile. always good tech coming from you.

OP, have you tried a brand new radiator cap ? (not that i think thats the problem)

i think you have a problem with your HG. if an OEM Hg isnt working well, nothing will, its a block warpage problem. one time i had the same problem on my DOHC zc. milling the head didnt fix it (neither did a cometic or OEM headgasket). it was the block. tear it down, deck it and rebuild!

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Yes all that left is the block... I was driving it today and it works ok it goes up 3/4 of the way to H and then comes back down i am thinking the fan isnt turning on early enought..


But i will probably pull it apart later in the year and fix this problem... I should be able to see if its leaking maybe by the rings around the open deck sleeves and the head/gasket.. Or would my spark plugs tell a story.. Thanks for the help..

nihad

iTrader: (2)

Ok spent some time on google youtube.. Watched a bunch of Costa Mesa R&D johns videos... And this apperantly is a normal problem on most engines could be like this from the factory or could of actually warped...


Also found this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3suQy44G_B0

what do you guys think of that.. Yes or No.. I wish i lived down the street from R&D..