B18C-EJ1

Hello eveyone. I'm considering buying the Vortech SC kit for my poorboy ITR.

What I would like to know, is if you have one, do you like it? If not, why?

Please, if you haven't experienced one, then don't just say "POS" "GO TURBO" etc.

Been there, done that.

Here's what I really want to know.

Does it have the tip-in throttle detonation problems?

Aftercooler? Bitch to install? Where does the water come from?

Relocation? Anything necessary?

That's the kind of stuff I'm looking for. Pics would help too.

So far, I'm pretty impressed at the numbers for the SI kit, and since my car is close to the SI, with more power, I'm thinking I could pull 300 street drivin SMOG legal HP out of this bastard.

Thanks in advance.

chri5

The worst power curve I have ever seen. Piddly JRSCs make more power until like 6000 rpm. They run basically the same times with the same mods. Yet you pay more than a good turbo setup for a good Vortech setup. If you want to do something different just for the sake of being different go Allmotor.

JG Luder

Allmotor? That'd be the worst idea. Man... way too much money. Not enough results.

chri5

I wouldnt do it myself, but I would do it over the Vortech SC.

jinxproof99

crap

Arturbo

Vortech=A belt driven lagging machine.

art

Mikex25

I think all motor is fun as heck, because you can mash it everywhere, but you don't get as much power.

Etylorcen

All motor owns the auto x. Can't run at full boost for that long...at least I wouldn't recommend it.

B18C-EJ1

Hey guys, thanks for taking the time to read my original post.....

You know, the one that said "Please, if you haven't experienced one, then don't just say "POS" "GO TURBO" etc."

Anyone out there ACTUALLY used one?

I could really care less about and POS, and "Belt driven ****" or "Turbo on a stick" etc.......


So when I read this post again, hopefully someone "INTELLIGENT" will have responded.

chri5

If all you want to hear is that they are good i suggest you try somewhere else. I have seen Vortech cars run, and seen their power output and it is not very impressive.

Instalation is fairly easy from all the accounts I have heard. Easier than a JRSC, since you dont have to pull the freaking intake manifold, and about the same as a Turbo. The aftercooler goes in fairly easy(in an Si at least, they dont have one for a GSR out yet). The aftercooler is the best part of the kit IMO, I would rather have the air/water IC sitting up out of view then the big front mount, but htat is a personaly preference.

As for tip in detonation it is not a problem. The tipin detonation you are thinking of with the JRSC is a result of that kit's strength. MAx boost right away. The vortech isnt going to make max boost until redline. So its boost grows along with the rpms. I dont think this is a good match to our engines. I'd rather have full boost at 4000ish with a turbo or less than that with a JRSC.

There is only one car i have heard times from that are close to what yuo would suspect given the peak HP output. That is "Boosted Si" on here. One of the Vortech Sis local here is putting out 270+ to the wheels and has run a best of 14.1. The problem is the car has less power than an average JRSC Si until almost 6000 rpms. The power curve really does suck imo.

0Mike95lude

If that is the guy I think it is...he lives in WA. And he runs very very low 13's, not 14's.

DoctorBob

Just a word of support: I'm also considering the Vortech for the GSR, partly because I love my Comptech headers and I don't want to give them up for a nasty turbo manifold.

I've been exchanging emails with asterix_2ksi (of https://honda-tech.com and http://www.clubsi.com) who has a Civic kit. He's very pleased with it and agrees that it makes for a really nice street car. Might not be the fastest at the drag strip but I, personally, do not care. I go to work every day; I go to the strip never.

From doing the math (differential equations can be fun) it looks to me that a 7psi Vortech kit would run approximately the same quarter mile times as a 6psi JRSC kit, while a 7psi turbo kit would beat them both. Note: all of the above are assumed non-intercooled.

Here's a starting point for you:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=71988

Email, etc., is in the profile if you'd like more info.

Hope some of that helps.

--
Regarding forced induction: "Everybody will tell you that the option that they paid for is the be all and end all. That's human nature.... " -- DoctorBob

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE
I've been exchanging emails with asterix_2ksi (of https://honda-tech.com</a> and <A HREF="http://www.clubsi.com)" TARGET="_blank">http://www.clubsi.com) who has a Civic kit. He's very pleased with it and agrees that it makes for a really nice street car. Might not be the fastest at the drag strip but I, personally, do not care. I go to work every day; I go to the strip never.

[/QUOTE]

I dont see how it makes for a good street car if the power is all up top.. For a daily driver get u going in traffic car you need low end torque... Jackson does this great, and so does 5.0 liters of displacement but the vortech does not..

If u want the vortech go for it but remember we warned u.. (lag + good peak #'s)(x > 4000$) = slow track times, no low end power and unhappy customer.. or customer in denial



[Modified by DIRep972, 8:18 PM 10/9/2001]

DoctorBob

I think that's the point: the power is not "all up top." Boost is a function of rpms so at 1/2 redline, you make 1/2 max boost. Regarding "low end torque": when I had my Mustang, I used to worry about "stop light drag racing." In the FWD GSR, putting max torque down on the road is a huge problem already. With SOOPER DOOPER BOOST, all the weight's going to come off the front end anyway.

I'm comfortable with the torque curve that I have with I/H/E. Adding boost will only increase the fun factor.

"lag": How do you define lag? Time to peak boost? Or time to any boost? Hint, that's a trick question.
"x > 4000$": the Vortech web site lists the current package price at $3,321.15
"slow track times": Is that drag strip or a track where you get to use the turny circle thing in front of you?

Personally, I love the fact that the Vortech-boosted NSX on the Speedvision series carried heaps of reward weight, had it's boost turned way down and was _still_ in the running against everybody....

--
DoctorBob
"If you don't like it, don't buy it."

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

when I say lag im speaking of on throttle torque, not neccessarily boost lag.. Lag is just the time when you are not in the "powerband" and the car is essentially slow..

just like any "kit" that is not EVERYthing that is involved.. there are always hidden costs..

slow track times is everywhere, the "lag" in power will cause u to have slower REAL track times then you could have with a JRSC.. and for strait line racing it is also bad because the kit only makes good peak power, and the actual powerband is not that powerful which results in a car with peak power of 270hp only running low 14's..

Im not telling u not to buy it, Im just saying JRSC is better for a person like you who does not care about strait line and who basically just wants "fun power" and then for the people who do care about actaully being fast and running good 1/4 mile times turbo is what they need.. Somehow the Vortech falls behind in both catagories.. but if u just want to be different buy the vortech its your money

jinxproof99

that is just rediculous.


anyway, i can speak from personal experience. the jrsc can be fun(in a granny riding in the left lane of the highway doing 40mph in her queer 76 malibu) kinda way. or go turbo.

i can't believe this is still an issue?! do they even sell s/c'ers anymore?! hahahaha

and as for vortech.....that garbage can't possibly still be on the market can it?

DoctorBob

Oh tragedy! You have caught me in the crushing grip of reason. Please have mercy and, whatever you do, do not call me "rediculous." I can't take the agony....

--
"Your opinion has been duly noted. It is now taking a tour of the bit bucket." - DoctorBob

B18C-EJ1

Gentelmen and Ladies, I want to thank you for all the input, either good or bad. I'm going to do some more research on the Vortech kit. When I find out more info, I'll post it for all to read. 3 weeks left, and I'm SEMA bound. Those of you who will be attending, I'll see you there.

boomslang

Some dude named SiRacer had his motor built up and used a vortech for a couple months. Now the Vortech is for sale.

Xerxes

here's the link: http://forums.clubsi.com/ubb/Forum12/HTML/008228.html

B18C-EJ1

More new info...........

After talking to the guys at Hondata, I learned some interesting information.

1- The Vortech kit has some problems with "Belt slipage", I guess at high RPM's the drive belt has been known to "slip" thus causing a loss of power.

2- The Vortech does not make for a good daily driver due to it's progressive style boost. Aka "Turbo on a stick". ( I think someone mentioned this earlier )


So it looks as of now, I'm going to wait and just stay all motor with a bit of the funny gas.

Thanks to everyone for their replys.

Dublocivic

Jinx,
EHehe.. you kill me..
Well next season Im not promising you anything but that junk will cause you to see my tail lights.. teehee..
We can just have a friendly grudge match.. I know you run 11.30 I saw the pass but you dont have enough up top.. get a Garret t3/t4 that lil turbo you got is almost outta breath aint it? lol
(keep in mind this is all fun)
PS you'll need about 150 more hp..
I love starting ish..

jinxproof99

yeah, keep thinking what you want. i don't know who you are, but i'll take that as a friendly threat. you can take this as a friendly threat. whatever your building better run 10.50's in FULL street trim(NIRA power 4 trim). if you run that you'll have a "chance". out with the old and in with the new as they always say. you see i've already(yes, already) purchased next years set up. its proven, will have very few "bugs" to work out, and will destroy any previous power 4 class car in america.


good luck to you.

Smashback

LOL - nasty turbo manifold? The runners on mine are huge, and they're only like 6" long. Doesn't get any more free flowing than that.

I can't count how many times I've heard people complain about not being able to use a "good" header if they go turbo.

Look at it like this, you're giving up about what, 3 HP if you lose the header? Say you start out at 150 HP. Subtract 3 for taking off the header. Add 50+ for the turbo. Hmmm...

Dublocivic

This is what I live for man.. its all in good fun I dunno if 500-600 hp will be enough.. I gotta get my damn suspension tuned in.. aint it a blast when you get passed half track cause your spinning 26 inch slicks the whole way?
I dont know what it'll run.. Im hoping atleast a 10.50.. I know the power will be there Plus this car is being built with my own hands and with my own pockets lol as you know it aint cheap going that fast.. I dont have a single sponsor, and dont want one... I think it would be cool for just a regular Joe like myself to take the class..(lol) Im getting my 8pt welded in over this winter break and motor assembled and broken in.. this car is going to be driven to work EVERYDAY as well... I checked out your setup last time I saw the car at the track..it obviously works great.. you should route your wastegate under the car it seems like you may be pulling in some exst back in through the inlet on the turbo..
On a serious note though.. I cannot wait to have some good competition next year..and I look forward to racing the Inline crew..
you guys have some very quick cars and next year should be interesting!
Did Stan sell his car? whats the deal with that? is that Stan's old car or something?