PM-Performance

Exactly like it sayd , what is wrong , we checked everything and cant figure it out we redid the hondata maps , everything ?
when hitting boost , , , well full boost it feeld like a rev limiter is kicking in , but its not reaLLy a rev limiter . i regapped the plugsd tighter and that kinda helped sorta, but still does it , any ideas,
Please this prob is irratating me and my tuner and the tracks open soon , if i cant figure it out i cant race

DRAGLS

what are your plugs gapped at? how much boost? you need to have the gap at around .025" to .030" . make sure they are not old plugs

PM-Performance

well the wastegate is limiting to 6.5 psi , the plugs werre gapped to like 36 or so , i havea highoutput ignition to if that helps .
i put the gap down to like 32 and it kinda felt better, you think to put it down more ? you think it will make that big of a diff? i have had the plugs in maybe 8k miles tops .
the thing is it was workign fine the other week and we went to tune it and went to hell frm there, the uel is very good , timing is safe, and conservative until we hit the dyno , but this thing just feels like its hitting a brick wall
we even put the orig map back in we were using orig before we modded it and same thing .
I dunno maybe if my cap and rotor might be ging ? the caop is an MSD one i got with the whole ig set up in March or april last year , but the rotor is still stock , almost 36 k on it . last time i looked at it , it looked fine .

b16ahybrid

Whats your air/fuel ratio? mine did that because i was runing to rich, i leaned it out and solved the problem

boosted hybrid

The plugs are gapped .036", then we took them down to .030". That helped, for a brief time period but the stuttering came back within a minute. Pete, you might want to take down the gap to .025" and see what it does. He is running an msd digital ignition, so if anything he should be gapping wider. I dont understand what is going on with his car. If anyone knows hondata I'd like them to take a look at the maps we are running and the datalog that i took today and see what they can make of it. Everything looks normal in hondalogger, and the maps are linear and progressive in fuel and timing delivery.

lazerus

it may be too much fuel. investigate that!

boosted hybrid

His air/fuel is 11-12:1 in boost, and the timing is conservative around 20 degree on the high cam in boost on 6lbs. He is stock compression, so i didnt want to run alot of timing till we can get it on the dyno.

Pete, its time to replace those plugs. Spark plugs should be replaced every 5,000 miles. Also change your cap and rotor.

PM-Performance

**** Jeff, i forgot my software in your computer . remind me next time im up there to grab it , or whenever were together next.
im gonna try the plgus again tommorow and check the rotor and **** just for **** and vinegar
i dunno thoug,h if someone has an idea how i can post the graphs and stuf, ill post em , i think we tuned richer under boost, but its not that rich i had it richer before and it didnt do this ?
im soo disgusted with this car right now . the car pulls like a **** outta boost and into lower boostit feels great too , only when hitting max boost
Someone help me

Drew Peacock

Well I had the same problem when I had the gap set to small try .32 thats a good generic setting 8thousand miles your plugs are due for a change anyway, you do have one stage colder I assume..

PM-Performance

yea i have the bcpr 7e-11's
im assuming thats the milage, it might not even be that much , i tihnk i put these in in like oct maybe ?
i dunno , im gona go get a set now .

sk8phaze

the other two responses are right from what i know you more than likely have too much fuel if you have a wide band o2 or data logging on you hondata ecu check your fuel mixture when it starts to break up under boost your air/fuel for boost should stay in between 11.8-12.0 for a proper mixture.

boosted hybrid

I tuned his hondata, his air/fuel is between mid 11's to mid 12's air/fuel under boost via fjo wideband running through hondata. The air/fuel is on point, the timing is on point. There is something else besides the maps that is making it hesitate.

lazerus

you should stop wasting money on cheap plugs, and get iridiums.

ekb18c

You sure you are not over boosting? Sounds like you hit the boost cut off on the stock map sensor. If you did a datalog of the run's where it felt like hitting a rev limiter then look at where your map reading is at. If you hit over 11.3 psi then it will feel like the car hit a wall. First the check engine liight would come on for a second and then go away, but at the same time the car will feel like crap.

Just double check the vac line that is going to the wastegate. After that try another vac line. You might be overboosting because your wastegate isn't opening up.

I had this happend to me before and I went crazy thinking about it. I thought it was my map but it turned out to be simple vac line to the wastegate that messed it all up for me.

HTH

Keep the gap at .030 even with the msd even though it's not really the cause of the problem.

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

20degrees timing @ 6psi is pretty far back. it is an ITR motor, id want to keep it very conservative, but thats about 2degrees retard per psi. I would try moving timing to 22, then try 24.. see if that helps

but ive seen this problem before on my friends car. it was 2 things

1. plugs were gapped too wide
2. exhaust system was choking

I would get new plugs too, 8k miles is alot in my opinion. im not sure how often u have to change step 7 plugs but I change mine at least every 5k and never had issues.


[Modified by DIRep, 7:42 PM 2/22/2003]

PM-Performance

well i just got another set of plugs, i got the 6e11's becuase the 7's wrent in stock
anbd got a new rotor for ***** and giggles.
im gonna gap em tighter to see how much that helps.
Screw getting irids, they cost too much , thanks for the response though.
the wastegat spring is 6.5 psi . so it shouldnt be going mor thna that , i have the 3 bar, but didnt hook it up yet, becauase i really didnt think i needed it yet, dont have a boost controller to up the boost.
i thought that maybe the map sensor might be getting screwy too ? also when 1st trying to take off from a light, sometimes, it will stutter and gt all goofy, then when i give it gas it will go to shut off? it doesnt do that often though as far as the shutting off, but the jerking just started the other day . . . same day i had to beat the **** outta my car to get it unstuck frm the snow .aye aye aye this car will be the death of me .

boosted hybrid

I datalogged in hondalogger, and the maximum boost level we reached was 5.7psi. We reached this psi at 5,000rpm, then the car immediately starts studdering. It pulls very quickly and nicely until that point.

I am keeping it very conservative till we get to the dyno. I gave it more timing from the maps that I was given from Sgt, just to see the effect. It did feel better with the increased timing, but again i didnt want to risk advancing it anymore if there is some other problem at hand. I have tuned three of my personal engines with hondata, and three other friends cars. I have had little problems here and there, but nothing that has stumped me like this. Pete mention that he had a similar problem with his direct port nitrous before he took it off. I am not sure exactly what it could be, but I am thinking its something to do with the msd box.

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

did u tune the idle and part throttle acceleration a/f? also is ur hondata running in closed loop? running in open loop w/ untuned a/f and timing and the car will basically feel like its blind and retarted.

but seriously, the only thing i have seen make a car studder like that is plugs. if they are the right plugs, w/ the proper gap, and proper tuning. and it still does it try some new wires, and then maybe try swapping in a stock ignition. I always look to aftermarket parts first for the problems


[Modified by DIRep, 8:06 PM 2/22/2003]

PM-Performance

i dont remmeber if it was closed or open ?
yea i had a similar prob right before i took the nitrous out, i engaged it and it felt like a sudden rev limiter. . . i just got pissed and ripped it out immediatly , i was done with nitrous at that point .
i dnt know what in the bocx would do it , , with the nitrous i ahd the retard control hooked up , but its not wired to anything now , i took off the retard settings, even though not even hooked up and took off the hgh rpm rev limit and still does it

DC2R714

Its weird Pete cause what u were discribing sounds like what I am experiencing, but I only get it when I start running richer than 12:1. I still dont get it.

PM-Performance

but my **** has been running like 10:1 since i put the turbo n and it ran like a bat outta hell . . . . now in the apast 2 weeks it runs like **** in heavy boost,
outa boost now with a little mor timing its sick and we didnt even tune the patial throttle this time , it feels better now . but shitty in h\eavy boost.

Im soo upset i could vomit right now .

DC2R714

Thats what bothers me. You said it was running fine until you and Jeff messed with the wastegate. Thats why I say try poppin on his and do a run just to eliminate the chance its the WG.

PM-Performance

but the thing is , i took the wg apart 3 times since thne and basically rebuilt it and made suer everything was seated right and workng right, all the moving parts are correct and made sure its seated right and everythingf i dont think its that .
it was boosting finr after we put it back together the 1st time and thne we were tuning and a couple mintutes alster it started acting up .

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

when my friend had the problems w/ the plugs being gapped too wide it ran great for about a week. then all of a sudden it wouldn't go past .5bar and it felt like it was hitting a rev limiter and would sputter. changed the plugs and gapped to .030 problem solved. I don't know what urs is, but it sounds awfully similar.

BigMoose

Whose ignition coil is in this beast and how old is it?

If it is an intermittent dielectric breakdown up at the high end, you really can't check the coil, you've got to change it out with a known good one.

Just another idea for you guys, since it looks like you covered most of the others.

Regards,
BigMoose