crashsvg

hey guys am currently running b18c with a b16a head and some other modification with a vortec supercharger.on the dyno last time and i got 240whp on 9psi but we kept getting a check light so we stop tuning.
both the dyno and the tuner said the car would make it to 260-280 whp if we had sorted out the check light..which is tps related
i was very impressed with even those result at 9psi. ANYHOW TO THE POINT

i was planning to but a brian crower stroker kit for my b18 but i was thinking to my self --y not just get a b20b which is already 2.0L and then what if i could make that into a 2.2L...


my question is would it be best to bore out my b18c or use a b20 from a crv?

does anybody have any experience with a b20b turbo/supercharge??could they take big boost like a b18c ?

tony413

b20 sleeves suck *** so you're going to need to sleeve any B series block inorder to get 2.0 or over

lakai_19

my sig proves that what people say about b20 sleeves is bullshit its not the sleeves its the tune and the car gets beat on everyday for the last 5months and compression is still golden oh and my bottom end is bone stock

tony413

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by lakai_19 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">my sig proves that what people say about b20 sleeves is bullshit its not the sleeves its the tune and the car gets beat on everyday for the last 5months and compression is still golden oh and my bottom end is bone stock </TD></TR></TABLE>

when you start pushing 500whp on stock B20 sleeves post it up with a video then you can talk. other than that 300whp is just another cake walk

crashsvg

does any of you know how much extra hp gain some one would get from stroking a stock b18c to a 2.0L with no mods added?

would it b around 50whp?

spoolin turbo s

id guess it would be closer to 30whp or so

tony413

honestly its not enough for the price you will see a better torque increase, and since hp is torque over time hen yes your hp will increase but not alot

lakai_19

none said anything about going to 500hp on a b20 but i belive it could if you have the right person tuning i read on ht some guy in a green Dc made 600whp on stock b20 sleeves had videos and pics up

tony413

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by lakai_19 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">none said anything about going to 500hp on a b20 but i belive it could if you have the right person tuning i read on ht some guy in a green Dc made 600whp on stock b20 sleeves had videos and pics up </TD></TR></TABLE>

im sry but cylinder pressure would kill those sleeves in matter of weeks. they just are not thick enough. i understand the importance of tuning and keeping cylinder pressures in check but b20 sleeves will pop

HiProfile

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by lakai_19 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">my sig proves that what people say about b20 sleeves is bullshit its not the sleeves its the tune and the car gets beat on everyday for the last 5months and compression is still golden oh and my bottom end is bone stock </TD></TR></TABLE>

THere is also a D16Z6 (with TONS of evidence) that made 400whp bone-stock, and ran 3-4 years with 350-390whp. There are also D16's that blow up with 150whp, so don't act all omnicient, because one example doesn't set the average, it sets the upper limit.

The vortec SC will be able to make more power with more displacement - with a bigger pulley. Running the same RPM's with a larger motor will mean the SC will produce less boost. The B20 is a much more fragile block due to the sleeves, especially if you go to 2.2L and try for more power. Its all of 11% more displacement - I'd rather just increase the boost by that much and have a nice day.

Assuming you're looking for torque, you're better off getting a smaller turbo like a T3-60trim, resleeving the B18 to 84mm (w/stock crank), and running 20psi of boost. You'll have FAR FAR better low&mid-range torque, while still making up to 325whp with that turbo. Transient response will be worse for the first 1/10th a second, unless you're starting from idle or at redline.

dancrxsir

My 2 setups with vortech supercharger both at 6 psi
note that the first dyno sheet is hp at the flywheel.....
and the other one it at the wheel

both of these setup were tune very safe.... cars are use every day....

b20Vtec 9:1 cr
235 whp


now on b18c5

Schister66

I'm not knocking your setup, but after seeing a graph like that, i would much rather build a turbo setup. My GT3255b wasn't exactly instant boost, but i still had a great powerband with tons of usable power on the street. I guess everybody has their own opinions for their own setups, but i would still recommend a turbo setup rather than an SC...

HiProfile

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Schister66 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> My GT3255b wasn't exactly instant boost, but i still had a great powerband with tons of usable power on the street.</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://forums.evans-tuning.com...=5047

Thats just a stock LS with that turbo. It also makes 260 @9psi, but then 348 @20psi, and actually beats it in torque everywhere after 3700rpm. Then there's the ls/v setup with a plane-jane 57trim - it also beats the Vortec after 3700rpm:

http://forums.evans-tuning.com...=4982


Use more displacement to spool a smaller turbo and the Vortec, frankly, seems like a waste of time. I'm sure you prefer being different, though. So I'd suggest upgrading the head before increasing displacement if you do stick with the SC.

Tony the Tiger

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by crashsvg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">does any of you know how much extra hp gain some one would get from stroking a stock b18c to a 2.0L with no mods added?

would it b around 50whp?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Superchargers work quite differently than turbos..

Increasing VE (such as displacement, headwork, etc..) will gain tons of power on a turbo car. Each PSI will net more power gains, therefore, it will gain significant power at the same PSI. The turbo will be constantly feeding it more air to maintain the same PSI.

On a supercharger, airflow and compressor speed is determined by engine RPM. If the supercharger is spinning at a certain amount of RPM, it will propel a fixed amount of airflow. By boring out the motor, porting the head, etc.. it will only allow the engine to pull the air in sooner and at a lower PSI. All you will get is roughly the same power as before, a good amount of torque and midrange gain, but your PSI will drop with the same pulley setup. The only peak HP gain you will notice is from the reduction of air temps due to improved compressor efficiency at a lower PSI from the supercharger, and possibly improved scavenging because of lower intake boost pressures on the same given cam.

Your best upgrade is to bump up the compression ratio slightly if you want to get more power at the same PSI. If you are just looking for more raw power, you should step up to the next higher PSI pulley until you run into heat issues/too much boost at the SC (12+ PSI). After you've reached that point, then it is worthwhile to build a B20, port the head, etc.. to improve efficiency.

crashsvg

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tony the Tiger &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Your best upgrade is to bump up the compression ratio slightly if you want to get more power at the same PSI. If you are just looking for more raw power, you should step up to the next higher PSI pulley until you run into heat issues/too much boost at the SC (12+ PSI). After you've reached that point, then it is worthwhile to build a B20, port the head, etc.. to improve efficiency.</TD></TR></TABLE>

hmmm..never heard of heat or too much boost from vortech chargers..mines got a after cooler that keeps it fairly cool when the engines running really hot.
i have already changed my stock head with a b16a port and polish head which already up the compression.i was just considering porting because i thought the golden rule applied here too 'THERE IS NO REPLACEMENT FOR DISPLACEMENT' but
if that dosnt apply her as you say guess am gonna do what i know will work which is rebuild my bottom just increasing the rev limit to 9500 rpm and get a custom made pully and order a special belt to help with the slipping.

i have seen my a v-5 charger in a civic going up to 22psi and 431whp with out giving problems.thats why i wanted to know if the added displacement would have help me.

but thanks for the info..

HiProfile

Displacement will help, but the point is you need to increase the pulley size to maintain the same boost level. 300cfm stuffed into a 1.8L will make roughly what it will make with a 2.0L, although it will have a better low/mid torque curve. The vortec is basicly a turbo compressor, something like a 60trim t04e wheel, so it doesn't mind extra boost.

If you want to take it to 400whp, you'd probably want to rebuild. 300whp is the safe limit, but lots of people have made 400whp on stock B18C's. The good thing you have going for you is the way that blower makes torque. It makes the most at redline, so less overall stress is put on the engine during a full 400whp pull vs a 57trim t3/t04e making 400whp. That's also one downside to power - the lack of low/mid-range torque.

CK_4500

Old thread bump....

I have a Vortech blower on my B16A2. I agree that if you don't change a thing, but your displacement, you will only get minor gains.
I dyno'd 258whp with 10 psi on a bone stock engine. I believe I got the 10psi using a 3.70" pulley with a CRV crank pulley. I am currently building a B18C1 bottom end to put under my B16 head. I too thought about the B20Z block, but the Vortech needs the revs to make the boost. The B20 can't rev very high, UNLESS you dump a bunch of money into it. So going down to a 7400ish redline will significantly reduce the boost. I ran my stock B16 upto 8400rpm on the dyno, and my power gains only stopped when I ran out of RPM! So, with a B18C1, you can still get the same RPM out of it, but you are gaining 200cc of displacement. I am now going with 9.8:1 compression, and I am going to drop my pulley size (Yes, smaller pulley makes bigger psi on the vortech) to around 2.75" - 3" area. With my new pistons & rods, I should make some nice gains.

With 15psi, I expect to be over 300whp forsure.