tech1145

A few of my friends are big DSM tuners and always give me sh*t about how their gsx's/tsi's are FAR superior (launch wise) because of AWD. As a hardcore honda enthusiast, this severly pisses me off, but what can I really say back?? My real question is, have any of you done any special mods to decrease wheel spin in your honda's? I've heard of FWD traction systems for Honda's that supposedly shift more weight over the front wheels, and the AEM EMS that can modulate boost in low gears, but thats it. If you have any insight that would help me, it would be appreciated.

blundar

traction bars help a little.

You pretty much are fucked.

Finland

street car vs street car, yes your buddies are right, unless you are running slicks on the street, you won't match an AWD launch.

On the strip everything changes, there's people on this board running 1.5 to 1.6 60 foots on fwd and slicks, most awd DSMs will break if you launch them harder than that.

Ask your DSM buddies how many transmissions they have gone through in the past year....

I've owned both (awd and fwd dsm and 4 hondas), and I'll take the robustness of a Honda drivetrain any day over the troublesome transmissions that the dsm guys have to deal with.

FOrSfEd

Also ask your DSM friends "If they have a fast car" how many motors they have been through.

tgreaves

I hear you on the dsm's breaking the awd units at the track.. I have personally seen a dsm at the track destroy the awd transfer case.. Then they installed another unit while still at the track and did it again on the very next race..

Finland

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tgreaves &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I hear you on the dsm's breaking the awd units at the track.. I have personally seen a dsm at the track destroy the awd transfer case.. Then they installed another unit while still at the track and did it again on the very next race..</TD></TR></TABLE>

exactly...that's why most dsm guys launch quite softly nowadays.....quite a change from a few years ago....last time I checked a transfer case was $1400 (new) and transmissions generally go for over 2K easily. Not a cheap day racing...

tgreaves

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by syckturboITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

exactly...that's why most dsm guys launch quite softly nowadays.....quite a change from a few years ago....last time I checked a transfer case was $1400 (new) and transmissions generally go for over 2K easily. Not a cheap day racing...
</TD></TR></TABLE>


Hmm... And to think I was kinda pissed when I blew a charge pipe in my 12 second car..

shrug

nahhhh dsms never break...thats why mine sits in the driveway with no engine. piece of ****.

tgreaves

I hear you on that.. Are you looking for a 88-91 hatch.. I might know someone who is selling one cheap in MD.. IM me if your still looking..

danl

AWD owns you, your childern, your mother, your father, and their parents too. I really don't get this **** about AWD's breaking. DSM trannies are strong as ****, they don't fail for no reason. When you have the traction and can actually make torque then any dumbass can take an awd car and sidestep the clutch on a launch pad and break something.

In the past few years DSM guys have gotten a lot better at making the AWD work well and last full seasons while running single digit passes (John Shepard and Curt Brown) on STOCK MITSUBISHI PARTS. Working with ride heights and keeping the chassis level while digging out of the hole is helping as well. Lots of the guys I've heard of breaking an awd dsm are on stock suspensions dumping a 2900 ACT clutch hard.

I'm on 3 seasons of drag racing my fwd dsm. I don't have the traction to break **** like the awd guys. I don't go around saying how much superior my drivetrain is because I don't have the traction to break something.

FOrSfEd, funny you say that. Their are no less than 10 hondas that blow up locally here in central PA. I've helped rebuild some even. Like I said I'm on 3 years of racing, well over 100 1/4 passes. 140,000 on the stock motor, 15 years of wear and tear daily driving it.

If anybody wants a friendly race hit me up via PM. I'll show you how reliable a well done 4g63 can be on a high speed torture pull if you want. If you want to race we'll do that too. If you want to show off your superior FWD drivetrain reliability I'll have a few of my AWD buddies show you how reliable a well driven AWD is.

So far this thread is littered with ignorant comments. If you don't have something intellegent to post, then don't. I hate the "DSM's are so unreliable" comments.

danl -------------&gt; EX honda owner.

Import_Fan

So you don't have anything on them as far as launching. But just tell them that at least your B-series doesnt crankwalk!

2point2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by syckturboITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ask your DSM buddies how many transmissions they have gone through in the past year.... </TD></TR></TABLE>

HAHA.. My buddy works in a tranny shop.. 4 bays, 3 Cryslers the last time I was there.

danl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by syckturboITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

exactly...that's why most dsm guys launch quite softly nowadays.....quite a change from a few years ago....last time I checked a transfer case was $1400 (new) and transmissions generally go for over 2K easily. Not a cheap day racing...
</TD></TR></TABLE>

$300 for a used tranny. Under $100 for a used x-fer case. $1400 gets you close to a tranny that can (in capable hands) run single digits all season.

If that isn't enough you can get a dogbox tranny built that even the meanest of people will have trouble breaking.

tgreaves

I wasnt cracking on dsm's as far as that goes.. I was just saying what I have seen.. And the race team that broke 2 awd transfer cases was a professional race team..

NyQuiL

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by danl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So far this thread is littered with ignorant comments. If you don't have something intellegent to post, then don't. I hate the "DSM's are so unreliable" comments.

danl -------------&gt; EX honda owner.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Im an ex honda owner as well, but the ignorant posts on here are just as well equalled in the dsm camp. On dsmtuners i see ignorant posts about hondas ALL the time. I guess generalizations are all some people have to base there comments off.

danl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NyQuiL &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Im an ex honda owner as well, but the ignorant posts on here are just as well equalled in the dsm camp. On dsmtuners i see ignorant posts about hondas ALL the time. I guess generalizations are all some people have to base there comments off. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I'll agree with you their, but it doesen't make it allright to keep the ignorance flowing.

Their are a ton of ignorant up and comming dsm owners, please don't let their attitude speak for dsm owners as a whole. Especially those that have been in the game for a long time.

I don't post on dsmtuners, have about a post a year on dsmtalk. I don't even hang out with the local "dsm" guys. Much to young and "gangsta" like. The reputation is bad with them, but not all dsm guys are ********.

rioninja

I cant stand the rediculous timing belt setup on DSMs.
Thats the main reason why i sold mine.

Chip

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FOrSfEd &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also ask your DSM friends "If they have a fast car" how many motors they have been through.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm on my first factory 7-bolt motor (the infamouse crankwalk motor) and I've run a best of 11.88 @ 116 with a 1.59 60' shifting it soft. If you treat it right, it will survive. My best trap on this setup is 123 MPH, but I have not launched it hard with that much boost. As an owner of a turbo honda as well, there isn't **** you can say to them about launching If you run into an AWD DSM on the street you beter hope you got a lot of road because you're gonna need it to play catch up.

FOrSfEd

I too was speaking what I've seen. There is maybe one AWD DSM around here that is fast and is on his first motor all the others at least 8 are on there 2and and third motors and trannies.

danl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rioninja &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I cant stand the rediculous timing belt setup on DSMs.
Thats the main reason why i sold mine. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, it is stupid. When properly adjusted it accounts for the stretching of the timing belt to lessen the chance of the belt jumping teeth.

The key word is "IF" properly adjusted. The average mechanic usually fubars it up and it skips a few hundred miles later. Then the car gets the blame.

Probably in retrospec not a great design for a mass produced car. However when its properly done up its a non-issue. I do my own timing belts to give me that warm fuzzy feeling.

stackz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tech1145 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A few of my friends are big DSM tuners and always give me sh*t about how their gsx's/tsi's are FAR superior (launch wise) because of AWD. As a hardcore honda enthusiast, this severly pisses me off, but what can I really say back?? My real question is, have any of you done any special mods to decrease wheel spin in your honda's? I've heard of FWD traction systems for Honda's that supposedly shift more weight over the front wheels, and the AEM EMS that can modulate boost in low gears, but thats it. If you have any insight that would help me, it would be appreciated.</TD></TR></TABLE>

blah! simply overpower them and then who cares.

had a friend with a 96 gs-x running 20psi, all I had was a 94 mustang gt with a 100 wet shot. took him through 4 lights continually and I still missed 3rd twice hahaha.

NyQuiL

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by stackz &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

blah! simply overpower them and then who cares.

had a friend with a 96 gs-x running 20psi, all I had was a 94 mustang gt with a 100 wet shot. took him through 4 lights continually and I still missed 3rd twice hahaha.</TD></TR></TABLE>

20 psi through what turbo? if he had a 96 and what i belive is the stock t25 that it came with, then well yeah obviously you would beat it since that turbo falls flat on its face at 6k rpm, i know since minde does the same thing Also assuming that he's again on the t25 - 20psi through that might be a bit to much.

David W.

awd ownz

stackz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NyQuiL &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

20 psi through what turbo? if he had a 96 and what i belive is the stock t25 that it came with, then well yeah obviously you would beat it since that turbo falls flat on its face at 6k rpm, i know since minde does the same thing Also assuming that he's again on the t25 - 20psi through that might be a bit to much.</TD></TR></TABLE>

no, it wasn't that tiny *** stock turbo. Actually, he used that as his doorstop for his room haha. I cant remember what size it was exactly but it was some T3 that was a normal replacement and he thought he was the hot **** after that so I told him I'd give him a spin one I got my baby bottle filled back up

god I miss college.

edit: what the hell does falling flat on it's face after 6k have to do with anything? you dont have to rev the **** out of an engine just to win man. ****, as long as you dont drop out of the power band on a shift you're pretty much good.

NyQuiL

t25 as a doorstop ... new to me, got to try that.
As i been reading it actually falls off around 5500rpm, now thats a pretty small powerband.