<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dynasty-x-motorsport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">this is what i have to say:

if you can afford a 26 to 30 thousand dollar car, and a 4000 dollar supercharger, why not spend 400 on hondata? instead of 300 for some rigged up bullshit? like it say up there........</TD></TR></TABLE>

HONDATA IS NOT COMPATIBLE WITH THE NSX

*flush*

 

Jeez - what do you guys not get about this? The blower kit works fine with NO ADDITIONAL TUNING. There are over a hundred of them installed that way that work just fine. I am just looking for a simple way to make very small adjustments in the middle of the curve. Yes - a stand alone system is overkill for that. Hell, Comptech says the AFC is 'more than I need' (just got off the phone with them).

So, if the AFC is not the solution, what is the best way (short of a two thousand dollar stand alone system, which any reasonable person could see is more than is needed) to make 5% or so fuel corrections at a few points? Anyone have anything useful to add?

BTW, I just got off the phone with a good tuner who has used the AFC on a customer's car with this kit and had a lot of good things to say about it. So, that does seem to be the right solution (contrary to all the bs posts above).

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dynasty-x-motorsport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">this is what i have to say:

if you can afford a 26 to 30 thousand dollar car, and a 4000 dollar supercharger, why not spend 400 on hondata? instead of 300 for some rigged up bullshit? like it say up there........</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you had read the thread before you posted, you would have seen this has been covered and dismissed near the beginning. Don't post 'rigged up bullshit.'

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Top Ramen &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
BTW, I just got off the phone with a good tuner who has used the AFC on a customer's car with this kit and had a lot of good things to say about it. So, that does seem to be the right solution (contrary to all the bs posts above).</TD></TR></TABLE>


What do you expect with sooo many "experts" in the field. Please post the numbers when you find out. NSX

 

Screw all the ******** out there. If you just want to straighten out your A/F curve a little bit (wich by the way is what the AFC was designed for) there is no reason that it is a bad idea. As long as you are not realying on it for your only means of fuel management its fine. My understanding is that the kit comes with fuel management, and you just want the AFC to fine tune the curve. Just so you know, you will not get a "fine tune" with the afc but it will do what you want it to do by smothing out the curve some what. there is no reason not to do it. People are just on the ghey honda-tech bandwagon. Its why I hardley come here any more. Everyone thinks they are a damn t00ner y0!

Rob

 

That's why I usually go to the GDD&lt; and that's about it. I'll come in here to make sure there's no insanity being spread, and the Kills when I need a laugh.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rjardy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Screw all the ******** out there. If you just want to straighten out your A/F curve a little bit (wich by the way is what the AFC was designed for) there is no reason that it is a bad idea.</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is pretty much what I am thinking. Not sure how using the AFC for minimal fine-tuning is 'half-assed' or 'ghey' when that seems to be exactly what it was designed for.

Will post before and after numbers in a month or so, when the blower kit gets here.

 

Although I have no experience with the nsx, I would guess that putting a blower kit on a nsx is no different than putting a jrsc kit or a greddy kit on a gsr in terms of reliability. Either way it is safer and more consistant to run lower fuel pressures with proper engine management, then a 'hack.' My biggest problem with a car like the nsx is the cost of an engine. Is it worth it? There may be a hundred of these kits out there, but without personally knowing these 100 nsx owners or even riding in/driving their cars , how do you know how these cars run?
That being said, When I was up @ payn for my dyno tuning (in troy, michigan) there was a supercharged nsx there that looked absolutely stunning and was supposedly running 11second timeslips. Perhaps if you called up there and spoke with tom (owner), he may be able to give some perspectives...either way, good luck!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by markaria &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Either way it is safer and more consistant to run lower fuel pressures with proper engine management, then a 'hack.'

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Look smart guy...
HE IS NOT USING IT AS THE HACK He wants to use it in the fashion that it was designed for. Sometimes I swear people around here, either DONT READ or are stupid. Do you people understand what the AFC was designed for?

Robert

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by markaria &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> but without personally knowing these 100 nsx owners or even riding in/driving their cars , how do you know how these cars run?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Look at his avatar. He owns one.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by markaria &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> but without personally knowing these 100 nsx owners or even riding in/driving their cars , how do you know how these cars run?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

While I obviously have not spoken with every CTSC owner, I have spoken with 50-60 over the past several years. I have also seen over 20 dyno charts with that kit. I believe that gives me a pretty good handle on how the kit works without additional tuning, but to each his own....as I said earlier, that's what makes the Internet so damn much fun.

 

So does using the AFC in the normal way cause any of the low throttle angle jittering from the injectors shutting off (6 or 7% i think)? I guess that problem has something to do with the fuel map resolution when used in the hack setup.

If it does jump and jerk around in parking lots I would deffinatly not do it. It's bad enough in a 93 base model civic...uberdata this week!

 

The fuel curve is pretty good at low rpms with the base kit. I only need to tune the middle and upper part of the curve. The standard kit tends to run just a bit fat in the middle and a tiny bit more lean than I would like at the top end. I probably won't need to touch anything below 3500 rpm or so.

 

jsut hook it up normal, **** ive seen boosted integras running hondata AND have a vafc. youre not going to hurt anything, all you doing is tweaking the map signal. i wouldnt do the hack though, not worth the risk. good luck let us know how it goes.

Landon

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rjardy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Screw all the ******** out there. If you just want to straighten out your A/F curve a little bit (wich by the way is what the AFC was designed for) there is no reason that it is a bad idea. As long as you are not realying on it for your only means of fuel management its fine. My understanding is that the kit comes with fuel management, and you just want the AFC to fine tune the curve. Just so you know, you will not get a "fine tune" with the afc but it will do what you want it to do by smothing out the curve some what. there is no reason not to do it. People are just on the ghey honda-tech bandwagon. Its why I hardley come here any more. Everyone thinks they are a damn t00ner y0!

Rob</TD></TR></TABLE>

this thread reeks of honda-tech..

dewd yous got a nsx you better get dual sump aeromotive fuelpumps and run -8 an lines to a 5 gallon fuel rail to feed your 1300cc injectors then just get tony1 to tune that **** or else it will blow man fo realz

 

since when was an fmu good fuel management? why is everyone saying that the "hack" would be ghey because it is an expensive sports car and then saying if he just uses the fmu and the afc to tune this is somehow better than the hack? i think we have established that the "hack" is a better method than using an fmu. if you don't want to go with a standalone, then i vote for the "hack and larger injectors/fuel pump.

i am NOT SURE but i doesn't the afc work by manipulating the map signal? if you were to hook up a voltage "clamp" then wouldn't that render the afc useless when the limit voltage is holding steady at 3volts or whatever the max voltage is? then again, inlinePro uses the fmu and afc together so i'm not sure.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bailhatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So does using the AFC in the normal way cause any of the low throttle angle jittering from the injectors shutting off (6 or 7% i think)? I guess that problem has something to do with the fuel map resolution when used in the hack setup.

If it does jump and jerk around in parking lots I would deffinatly not do it. It's bad enough in a 93 base model civic...uberdata this week! </TD></TR></TABLE>

no hesitation unless you are trying to run larger injectors and use the AFC as your primary means of fuel management (the hack) in normal canditions, adding or subtracting a few values, it will run fine.


Rob

 

I'm concerned that the NSX probably comes factory with pretty aggresive ignition curves, so jumping backward on the MAP column (AFC hack) is probably going to put you in a higher advanced ignition value, so you're probably going to see part throttle bucking...

?

-PHiZ

 

however phiz is right, with an AFC hack you will have really advanced ignition values under boost for the amount of retard you have, then you'd need a ignition retard box... a mess!

I think a normally rigged AFC coupled with the rising rate should get you real close to target, because you shouldn't have to modify the fueling values much, exept maybe richening it, and you dont have ignition problems with richening the mixture, only leaning it out, where the ECU tends to add in timing.


(In regard to the quote below) yes, actually you do.. they just have a VPC with it...

it works just fine on a factory boosted ECU, especially on one with good code...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tegasaurus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i think everyone is saying that if you can afford a 26 thousand dollar car, and a 4000 dollar supercharger setup for it, why not spend 400 on hondata s200b? instead of 300 for some rigged up bullshit? you don't see any supras running around on the afc hack after they convert to a t72 do ya?

common man, just spend the extra couple hundred on a better setup and don't worry about the hassles with the hack.

i had a **** experience with the hack and there's no way in hell i'll run it on my ghetto integra, let alone a car that would be an extension of my weiner (nsx).

-ryan</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PHiZ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm concerned that the NSX probably comes factory with pretty aggresive ignition curves, so jumping backward on the MAP column (AFC hack) is probably going to put you in a higher advanced ignition value, so you're probably going to see part throttle bucking...

?

-PHiZ</TD></TR></TABLE>

perhaps with a large clamp like the hack with 40%
but he is talking slight variations here, he is not going to run it in the HACK manner. just to add a few or remove a few %. I dont think that he will experiance bucking with a 2% removal or addition.


Rob

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by lazerus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I think a normally rigged AFC coupled with the rising rate should get you real close to target,

</TD></TR></TABLE>


agreed

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rjardy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> just to add a few or remove a few %. </TD></TR></TABLE>

That's why I am considering the AFC in the first place. To give you some idea of what I am working with, here is a typical uncorrected a/f curve from one of the many dynos of this kit:



As you can see, it just needs to be nudged around a bit.

 

If you run the hack get bigger injectors, i don' think you'll need the voltage clamp, because i think it works in unison with the fmu, which you will also not need if you run the hack. Ihear of people having idle problems with the hack, but i hooked it up temperarly with my h22turbo and it idled fine.

ok now that i awnsered your question i wanna throw in my .02. The kit may work fine without any additional tunning, BUT if you want to see every reach its up most potential you should go with a dyno tuned standalone system

-i've also got 6 440cc supra injectors that would work for this out of an mk4, as long as nsx injectors are the same as other honda injectors

 

IMO you may as well just leave it as is, or buy real fuel management. Are people running this kit having problems with their air/fuel ratios?

Using the AFC as it was made to be used is not "the hack". People either didn't read your first post, or just don't comprehend "the hack". Seriously, that a/f curve doesn't look bad, I'd just stick with it if you don't want to drop a grip of cash on fuel management.

 

Hack (aka AFC) will only help to lower A/F ratio where youre running a tad rich.
You won't be able to add more fuel with AFC hack on original injectors.
Also, if using original injectors even if you put AFC hack you gonna need voltage clamp.

On the other hand... using larger injectors with AFC means FMU is useless, and you'll have to use something to retard timing, etc... but will be able to fine-tune yr A/F ratio.

So... either invest in 'real' management as AEM, or similar... or leave it as is.
Just my suggestion....