SilverS

i'm sure this has been asked b4, but please bear with me. dont tell me to search cause i dont really know what i'm searching for.....

SOHC MOTOR w/ greddy turbo kit

i want to run 10psi
i know i need a Fuel Pump, what kind? intank, inline?

fpr,fmu, injectors?

what ratio? size injectors?

vafc to control fuel??

i want to make ~200 to the wheels...

daily driven, on the stock ECU. i cant afford a Stand alone.

basicly i'm asking for a parts list to go out and BUY.....

complete list for my fuel needs..

keep in mind i'm on a budget, daily driven, want it to idle like stock, but be able to run 10psi at the track...

thanks


[Modified by 2000EX, 9:30 PM 12/24/2001]

VTC_CiViC

More than one way to go. The way I did it, RC 440cc injectors, Walbro 255lph pump, and VAFC trim w/ NGK BCPR7E-11's and 3 degrees retard. With this I've boosted 10psi regularly and have seen as much as 1.03bar. It is however kind of glitchy since you're manipulating the MAP reading so much by usuing alot of AFC trim, so you might get tired of it. This is why i'm going with a standlone in the summer.

SilverS

which is why i'm tryin to figure out the easiest way to do this w/o going stand alone. :-p

Smashback

I would think that 310's would do it, and the VAFC stuff shouldn't give you too much trouble. I just set mine up (custom t3/4, not greddy tho) and it runs super rich, even though I've cut down on fuel below 3k rpms. Damn I need to get to the dyno huh?

SilverS

ok so a set of 310's.....

do i need a fmu too? or just a regular non boost dependent regulator?

what are the flow rates on GSR injectors? woudl they fit? and be cheaper?

DA666

i think the best setup would be a bosch inline spliced in right after the stock intank, a cartech fmu adj, 8.1, 10.1,12.1....then some 310's, then apexi afc, then an adj. fpr, with a fuel pressure gauge as well...u should run around 50 psi.....but check out this link for further info.......this is prob the best way to go other than standalone...but then again im not no genius....http://www.theoldone.com/articles/fuelpump/

SilverS

bump

what FMU ratio? will the car idle like stock?

so we have a Fuel Pump, 310 Injectors, VAFC

can i use any other honda injectors? GSR? Prelude?

maxim

OK, since you aren't thinkg to go the standalone route there are different ways to approach this, but to start off my suggestion is to get an inline fp, 10:1 FMU, with stock FPR, 310cc injectors, V-AFC. If you decide to have the Walbro 255lph intank pump you should get as low rate as possible on the FMU like 8:1 or lower and then you can get larger injectors. If not, you will run really rich. Remember it's like a balancing game between the higher pressure fuel pumps and FMU. the I don't believe you will need an adjustable FPR just as long as you have the FMU. Remember the in-line is very important no matter what, even if you have the intank you will need the inline.

VTC_CiViC

If you go the FMU route with 10psi of boost, you'd better get an inline pump because an intank won't tolerate the 100+psi of fuel pressure you're going to be demanding at full boost. Even with a set of 310's, you'll want an 8:1 FMU which at 10psi of boost will generate an extra 80psi of fuel pressure on top of your static which is something like 40psi, what do you have now? 120+psi of fuel pressure in the rail.. let's see an intank try to keep that up! Either go with some bigger injectors i.e. 370's, or go with an inline pump and the 310's with an 8:1 FMU.

SilverS

ok so inline pump w/ the stock pump?

310's and a 8:1 fmu

why would i need to go w/ bigger injectors 370's vs 310's? something to do w/ fuel pressure at rail??

clean

sell the greddy kit, you wont be happy, put it on a 5th gen si then do what your talking about. you wont get the times you want and then you'll bitch, i know you will cause i have the kit on my 6th gen ex too.

VTC_CiViC

Larger injectors will spray more fuel with less pressure, allowing you to run a smaller FMU rate, say 3:1 or 4:1 which will generate something like 60psi at the rail, in which case you can use an intank pump.

SilverS

Ok, so bear with me i think i've gotten a set up here....
either of these setups will work for a SOHC Civic Turbo @10psi daily driven.

now which would be a better way to go? drivablility? fuel economy? i'm not gonna get like 20mpg w/ a set up like this i hope. :-p as i'm understanding the later choice due to less pressure at the fuel rail?


Walbro 255lph pump
RC 310cc injectors
Vortech FMU 6:1
VAFC


OR


Walbro 255lph pump
RC 370cc injectors
Vortech FMU 4:1
VAFC

are the fmu ratio's correct for size of injectors? or should i get a cartech fmu, which i think was adjustiable ratio's????

thanks for the advice.

greyzone

Im running 10 lbs boost with 200whp and Im plenty rich and even using the trim on the VAFC to back fuel OUT (about -5%)...so for every one that thinks it cannot be done with this setup...think again...because it can...

Theres no need for rc310s, your stock injectors can handel it fine...also, you can get away with an intank pump (nicer becasue its MUCH quieter) and a Vortech 10:1 FMU (Im thinking of even changing to 8:1 cause im still runninng so rich). Intank can handle 80 to 90 psi just fine and thats all you'll need (Id suggest Walbro 255 HI FLOW).

Ive had a lot of people give me **** about this setup but its working great and it has been working great for 40,000 miles of hard *** boosting and hauling ***. Charles at GReddy helped me set this up and its been working almost perfect.

I still get 20-22 mpg also.
NOTE: No way i'd boost 10psi with stock compression and no blockgaurd tho. 2 Mil headgasket will lower your compression and block gaurd will help as a saftey feature in case you have detonation at 10psi...also, I didnt notice you mention an intercooler, you will definitely need that also...GReddy T31 is good if you go w/GReddy, but its damn expensive

Now, theres plenty there for people to have opinions about, but its working great for me and Im running 12.5:1 on the dyno at all rpm ranges...



–96 EX Coupe 5spd
–1.6L SOHC VTEC D16Y8
–GReddy Type S BOV
–GReddy T-31 Intercooler
–GReddy Boost Controller, Profec-B
–GReddy EVO Exhaust
–Gutted Oversize CAT
–Missing Link
–AutoMeter Phantom Boost Gauge
–AutoMeter Phantom Fuel Pres. Gauge
–HKS Turbo Timer
–Holly 255lph in-tank Fuel Pump
–Vortech 10:1 FMU
–A’PEXi V-AFC
–MSD SCI Ignition
–MSD Blaster 3 Coil
–MSD Pro Cap
–MSD Plug Wires
–NuForms Block Guard
–2 Mil Head Gasket (GReddy, of course)
–ARP Head Studs
–NGK BCPR7ES-11 gap @ .32


[Modified by greyzone, 12:58 AM 12/28/2001]

VTC_CiViC

You're forgetting, you are using the GReddy bluebox which is manipulating your injector pulses. 2000EX isn't, like me he's usuing ths tock ECU which will NOT change your injector pulses in relation to boost since the ECU can't see boost. Therefore you have no choice but to increase the pressure dramatically for 10psi, or get larger injectors. With a 10:1 FMU and my 255lph pump, anything over 6psi and I was leaning out DRASTICALLY, so 2000EX, unless you've got a spare block laying around, I'd stay away from this route. Supply the fuel or blow the motor.

I'm boosting 10psi on the stock motor...100% stock and I've seen higher with no problem. Fuel is the name of the game, supply and demand.

VTC_CiViC

Use this setup with an inline pump and an 8:1 FMU

Start off with a 6:1 rate and work your way down, though I think a 3 or 4:1 will be best for this setup, maybe smaller.



[Modified by VTC_CiViC, 10:29 AM 12/28/2001]

SilverS

i'm sorry for the confusion
actually i do have the greddy blue box too.... will this still work w/ the fmu?

here is my set up as of right now

–00 EX Coupe 5spd
–1.6L SOHC VTEC D16Y8
–HKS SSQ BOV
-Greddy Turbo Kit W/ Blue Box
–GReddy T-31 Intercooler
–GReddy EVO Exhaust
–AutoMeter Ultra-Lite Boost Gauge
–AutoMeter Ultra-Lite Oil Pressure Gauge
–Blitz Turbo Timer
–A’PEXi V-AFC

NGK BCPR7ES-11

greyzone

The Blue Box actually is not being used for fuel mapping on my setup...the missing link disables that part of it since the map sensor is not reading any boost...so what I have said still applies (note I didn't list it in my setup, above).

THats something I will actually be doing next dyno trip is removing missing link to see h0ow the blue boxes fuel map might change things, but as of now it is disabled, again, since it needs to see boost to provide any fuel mapping.

And I agree thats its all about fuel, tunning etc...in an ideal world you have perfect tunning without detonation, as long as thats the case you can boost 10psi and more without any problem.

The idea with the blockgaurd, headstuds and thicker gasket is really an "insurance" policy...that since "ideal and perfect" conditions often do not exist and detonation does happen (even if you cant detect it) those three items (above)will often prevent MAJOR engine damage that could otherwise occur.

Inline pumps are needed for applications above 90psi....this setup works fine all day long with excellent A/F ratios at 80psi.

In this case you could use the money you'd save on injectors and purchase a headgasket, blockgaurd and studs for about the same price and have a much safer setup that would still run plenty rich up to 12psi.



[Modified by greyzone, 1:15 PM 12/28/2001]

VTC_CiViC

Ohh, I didn't read that before.. Well in that case, your stok injectors should be good for at least 10psi like greyzone has. Just get a good intank Walbro and a small FMU for 10psi operation and be happy..

greyzone

I would suggest a 10:1 FMU becasue you can hookup a vacuum bleed the will make it adjustable to about 8.5:1...that way you can cover that entire range and your overall fuel pressure can be a little lower, which is always nicer to have.

THis particular car and setup is my passion!

By the way...my car got broken into last night...over 1,000 damage...and they didnt touch my boost controller or VAFC...busted out my window and took out indash CD player and took over 100 CD's but they were all just copies...I wish I would have couaght those ******!! ******* alarm didn't even go off!

SilverS

sorry about your car man, that sucks...some people need to get jobs like the rest of us...****...


as for the FMU. is vortech the one i want? vacuum bleed? will teh guys at teh dyno know what that is?

woohoo i'm on my way to running 10psi...

all i need is
Walbro 255lph HI FLOW fuel pump
FMU 10:1

i guess i will order the block gaurd and headgasket too.
what a good brand block gaurd? will it just drop in w/ having to machine the block? and i guess i should do the headgasket and block gaurd at the same time since i have to pull the head anyway....




[Modified by 2000EX, 3:14 AM 12/29/2001]

Aahj

Grey,

It hurts to hear that man. And the alarm didn't even go off?! That sucks dude. I would be thankful that they didn't steal anything turbo related. At least you can still drive your car (without tunes! )

oh well man,

good luck,

2000EX, I would recommend that you get the headgasket and the blockguard at once. Like you said, kill two birds with one stone!

I am posing off of Greyzone

I ordered the blockguard and headgasket and studs. I have the STR blockguard though. The headgasket was just sent out today, but because UPS doesn't deliver Saturday, Sunday, New Years Eve, or New Years day, it won't be here until next friday

later guys,

aj

MatT3T4

I ran 10-14.7psi daily on my old D16Z6 with a Holley 255lph in-tank, a Vortech fuel rail, and a B&M Command Flo. It ran awesome for a year until I spun a rod bearing at 145mph...

Aahj

damn

SilverS

where did u order the head gasket from? greddy one right? how much was it?