Hi, Im looking to do a -10 feed and -6 return, im using dual walbro's with fullblown setup. Im looking to make a bit of power, im just wondering if the return will be big enough at idle to keep the base pressure where I want it. Fuel will be E85.

 

this is how im running on e85 now man except im using the A1000 FUEL SYSTEM SETUP

 

im thinking about replacing my -8 feed with a -10 feed from my aeromotive pro pump and use the -8 line as the new return hose...it cant hurt right lol.

 

so it sounds like it 'should' work. Im unsure of the A1000 fuel system setup, but im guessing it flows more than dual walbro's in parallel, so if you don't have any issues keeping base pressure down at idle with the small return line, im guessing I won't either.

I could use a -8 return, that i have on the car now as the feed, except its more work since my fullblown dual walbro hanger accepts -6 as a return and -8 as a feed, and I would already have to re-work the feed to accept -10, i wouldn't mind just keeping the -6. as well as my aeromotive FPR is all -6 ports, so I would like to keep that.

Thanks, I honestly didn't think it would be a big problem

 

The -10 and -6 return should work.

The A1000 is a worthless over priced piece of ****. It wont outflow twin walbros in parallel, IMO i doubt it would out flow them in series. The A1000 is rated at 800hp, on gas. I know of someone with a buschur dual pumper setup in an evo making 771whp on e85 and still has plenty of pump left.

The A1000 is a loud noisy piece of ****, not to mention u have to buy and wire up a voltage regulator for it.

My vote is for the dual pump setup. Its simple, quiet, and will flow all youll ever need. Some say its good for 1000hp but ive not seen anyone make that much power with it. All of my friends with Evos have them and love em, all run e85.

 

correct i have the regulator as well its noisey, and hard on a single battery as well so I run 2 batts. im triggered off my tach for the regulator, and im on E85 im on small power as well my little rc 1000's are at 96% duty at 28psi. I have been contemplating dual bosh 044's myself

 

You may not be able to get the base pressure below 50lbs. That may or may not present a problem for you depending on boost level

 

lol my a1000 was quiet, maybe because i mounted it with rubber bushings like you are supposed to...it was really quiet. No voltage regulator either. Tested perfect after 2 years! Made 830 whp using an AEM large universal regulator with a little more room left. I would hardly call an a1000 a piece of ****, im using an aeromotive pro pump on my next setup, that is a high flowing pump for sure lol.

 

I like my a1000 its done well, and the regulator is for street driving im happy with it

 

All I'm saying is that you're making an awful lot of claims here with nothing to back it up. Why don't you list the drawbacks and benefits of both before coming in here with a post like that?

People have ran the A1000's many many times and never had an issue. I guess it matters what your goals are though.

 

I dont look into fuel pumps that often because its not something that is on the top of the priority list to me. An a1000 is a lot more work then a dual pumper setup. My DSM i have the same 255 that i put in over 4 years ago. Ive run 93, 110, 100, e85, whatever. Its fine. I recently added a 392 (inline 255) and just ran an automotive relay with i believe a 15a fuse. The inline was added over a year ago. I dont even see myself running out with the setup ive got, ever. If u want a full blown drag car, go with whatever. But ive riden in a1000 cars, its just annoying, and my DSM had a 4" side exit with a 42r and i couldnt stand the whinning after 20 minutes in a ****ing car that had one. But thats just me.

With the setups out today. I will garantee you could take 20 700whp street cars all somewhat different (supras, cobras, evos, hondas, whatever) and i bet more would be running a dual pump setup over an a1000. Ive got a few friends with 700whp whipple cobras, they run 2 viper pumps in parallel i believe. All evo friends with buschur dual pumpers. 700whp s2k friend, fullblown dual pump, srt4 friend on a s360 running 40psi, with the same setup.

The dual pump setups didnt get real popular until recent. If it was 1999 i would of probably said a1000. But like computers, technology changes. If you NEED more fuel then 2 walbros can supply, then youd probably be making 800+whp. Which is more then what an a1000 is rated at, whether it can flow more i dont really care.

To make a long story short. If you have 2 setups 1 the a1000 which is farely expensive after u buy lines, fittings, getting it mounted, regulator, whatever. And then u have a farely simply dual pumper setup thats much quieter, cheaper, and can flow just as much if not more. I dont see why an a1000 would be an option. But hey if u make 6 figures a year and dont mind hearing a smoke alarm while your riding, buy the expensive ****.

 

with that pro series pump your going to run a 12 feed from your sump/cell right?

 

I understand what you're saying, but if you want to make a lot of power on the walbros you still need to buy lines/fittings also, so that argument makes no sense to me. What do you think about the magnafuel pumps then? They are loud, but some of their pumps can damn well support more power than twin walbros can.

This is my opinion, but my problem with the twin walbros is the fact that one of the two pumps could die at any given time. That drop in pressure may not be noticeable, but still cause detonation. I would rather have a pump that will just die and be done rather than take my motor with it. I know two people so far that have had one pump start to fail and cause them to detonate without knowing it until it was too late. Small problems turn into very big ones, very quickly at 600+ whp. I don't feel like keeping my eyes pinned on a fuel pressure gauge the whole time I'm driving.

 

Lemme get this straight.. You were running dual Walbros on a 42r setup?

This intrigues me... Really it does. In general we run Dual 044 setups at the minimum with a large frame turbo. Yet you got away with a much smaller setup.. What did you use to tune? any logs of this? pictures of your setup? I'd love to inform the rest of the DSM community that we have been doing it wrong all along and that you have found the magic combo... Next you'll tell me you ran it on E85 too.

You hear some crazy sh*t from people when they stray away from their own forums where people would be more suspicious of their outrageous claims.

Then again, I'm not saying you didn't do it, I just saw it as quite improbable.. And if you can't stand the sound of a A1000, I find it hilarious you rather deal with TWO walbros.. I really don't get people these days. One crazy comment after the other... an A1000 in general is more quiet than a single wally, you use 2, and then complain about an A1000. Wtf is going on?

Your price argument doesn't hold water either.. Whether you run a a1000 or a dual pump setup, you are looking at nearly the same price. Once you factor in Y blocks and additional fittings for the second pump as well as additional filters and line, you could even spend more. Same goes when comparing my dual 044 setup to running a single Eliminator pump.. I chose to run the dual 044s due to a hook up I got, not because of price. A single Eliminator pump would probably have been cheaper and more simple to run in the long run, add in the additional safety of having one pump die out and shut down the motor instead of a possible catastrophe, the safer choice would always be a single pump, then again dual 044s is far more streetable and if both bought in new condition and pre filtered, they will out last the single pump since they are sharing the load.

 

I guess im used to DSM's/Evo's. The stock fuel system other then the pumps and filter to rail section is good enough for upwards of 700whp. Im going off everything based on my experiences with cars that dont come 130hp from the factory. Most factory turbo cars come with big fuel systems. My DSM stock has a -6an feed and im not sure of the return.

 

Stock lines are slightly smaller than -6an this being the reason a -6an setup is an upgrade.

The return is also the same size.

In all reality many have ran far beyond 700awhp with the stock rail seeing as it is in between a -8an and -10an in diameter through out, however we are talking about a simple fuel rail...

The fact you have to upgrade the fpr, the filter, the lines, and the pump mean that the fuel system is in fact NOT adequate for such feats SAFELY.

 

I ran a GT4294 on a cast iron revhard for close to a year. Yes i ran an intank walbro 255 and an inline walbro as well. I never got above 25psi with the setup. IMO It was slow, it might of been in the 500whp range. I had the setup on a stock head/cams/tb/intake at the time. Most of the stuff where i live is geared for an 8th mile trk. So anything fast enough to even bother with was wanting to do a 20 roll. I was like man i cant do that ****. I could do a 50 n 2nd and brake boost it and it wouldnt be that bad. But still, the race was over at 100mph. 50-100 is a boring race. So i swapped setups. Here are some pictures.







I dunno why urs were loud but dual intank setups are quiet. I ran 1 intank and 1 inline. My setup sounded just like it did when i first put the intank walbro in 4 years ago. The a1000 is way louder, id say probably 3 times what a single walbro is. The only car ive riden in was an eg with an a1000 and it was almost unreal.

The magnafuel pumps are all good, and the weldons are probably even better. Im just saying choosing an a1000 and a twin walbro setup. If i had to choose. Both setups are probably around 800hp setups. Id choose the walbro for a number of reasons over the a1000.

 

I ran a stock filter, fpr, and lines and have made over 600whp with the setup im on right now, 6262 billet lol.

Also, nobody upgrades the stock lines to -6. I dont even think they offer it, ive never seen it anyway. Even if it is an upgrade. There is a bottle neck on the car after the filter, the banjo fitting. I have that kit from extremepsi. The -6an fitting from the filter to the rail. Maybe thats what u ment by upgrade. The stock lines are plenty for quite a bit of fuel.

 

Here lies the problem... You took a 1000hp turbo and ran it at half its power range and probably an equal amount efficiency wise. Once you start actually pushing these turbos and maxing them out to their potential, you'll see that dual Walbros aren't up to par at times. They are great from a budget stand point, but why do the bare minimum. I always prefer to be safe then sorry..

Dual walbros for the 6262 are fine and push comes to shove you can slap on a BAP and be done with it. Again, not the route I'd go but it is what it is.

 

Nobody?

You sure about that? Because the most common upgrade is a -6an lines. anyone running anything less than a 40r does the -6an upgrade. It gets rid of the bottle neck and give a slight increase in cap. Not to mention gets rid of the horrid rubber lines. I tend not to half *** stuff.. If it aint broke, don't fix it it.. yes. However if it could break then get r done.

I've seen people run the lines way up into the 600+ range but when you swap pumps and lines to much more efficient setups you'll notice an instant change of your tune, normally resulting in things being much more rich. These saves your fuel pump and makes your setup much more efficient over all.

And you are a bold one over running that stock FPR with those twin wallys.. A single 255 is pushing it on a stock fpr, but running a dual setup is asking for it. You'll greatly clean up your tune by adding in an aftermarket afpr. Not only that but you'll increase your gas millage tenfold..

 

I didn't plan on it, i was just going to run a -10 to it. the size of the openings on a sump most of the time is 1/2" anyways, which is still smaller than 10an.

I dont think 2/16's of an inch is going to be detrimental to anything.

 

A GT4294 is not a 1000hp turbo. Not on a DSM anyway. The 94mm exducer wheel is only a 70mm inducer. Its only a 75lbs/min turbo. Now the 4202 or the 102mm exducer wheel is a 74mm. I beleive its rated closer to 85lbs/min (not 100% on that)

What does a turbo have to do with the pumps? To be honest, the 6262 that i have now has made over 800whp on a 4g63. The 4294 hasnt made much more then that. I pushed it quite a bit farther then half if its rated at a 75lbs/min turbo.

 

Of course the tune will change but yours steering off the beaten path. That doesnt change the fact that it can be done, safely.

Taking and running a completely different line straight from the pumps is obviously gonna free up room for fuel. You have less fittings, less bends, etc. And lets be honest, the stock system ususally isnt designed for high HP goals in the future. I guess u could call it an upgrade but like i said, ive never seen anyone just upgrade to a -6an line when the stock lines are pretty much the same size from the factory.

Your getting off on to some completely different ****. Ive done quite a few things that OTHERS have done, not just me. I dont build cars right off the bat for infinite amounts of power. I did what i did because ive seen many do it and why would i waste the money on a big fuel system and a1000 pump when i can take the stock system with the 255 i already have and just throw an inline pump and be done with it. I set a goal at power (600) and i acheived that. I dont need a 1000whp fuel system if i dont want 1000whp. Just because you say, my car made yada yada yada but ive got a setup good for 1000whp, that doesnt mean anything. You didnt make it, you made, yada yada whatever it is u made. Simple as that. I dont sugar coat ****, i made what i made.

 

Here we are comparing 2 turbos with completely different power bands. Hell people have made over 700hp on 35rs but don't hold your breath..

And I didn't know you were referring to the 94 instead of the 02 (which is closer to 95+lbs/min) 2 totally different beast. The point is all the setups you are referring to that I have seen pushing that kind of power are running way more pump than dual walbros. And if you are running dual walbros then you must have no future plans to even touch E85

 

It just seems you don't frequent the boards much.. The -6an upgrade is THE most commonly done upgrade to a fuel system apart from a larger pump. Not too many guys running -8an, because like you already know, most will never be pushing the power to need it. Hell I run -8 an from my sump to my twin 04s which are Y'd to a -10an all the wa to the rail. (and that's not accounting for the 2 pre filters, 1 per pump, and the final, filter in the engine bay.) Is it over kill, I don't think so. I think its "just right".

My point is, yeah you achieved it, while pushing the limits of your fuel system. I'm no a fan of over working your supporting mods just to support an under worked/over sided turbo setup. I'm all about efficiency and doing them with in a safe parameter of the items being used. There is no arguing that you are pushing those walbros to their limits on pump and they wouldn't be near adequate on e85. Guys running an intank wally feeding an 044 are running out of fuel on full tune setups on the e85.


Going back to the OPs original issue, there is no problem running a -6an return on dual wallys, they simply aren't big enough to push that much fuel. also -10 is WAY over kill.. You are talking dual 044 territory, even 044 guys can get away with -8an lines.

So all in all you'd be just fine with a -8an supply and a -6an return. As far as the a1000 goes, sure there are better options, but it works as mentioned and unlike the fuel lab pumps, isnt plagued with issues. (besides over heating from regular usage)