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I finally, after 8 years got to drive my car to work! yay!! I still have a cooling issue. I am getting air in the system form somewhere. bled air after 4 miles, than again after 8. How I have it set up:
main circuit pretty much stock except I have the Ktuned filler neck and a inline bleed valve (the one that I have been bleeding the air from on a regular basis) that is right before the thermostat.
Bypass circuit, stock
Heater Circuit goes from head to top of expansion tank from the bottom of the expansion tank back to the return.
I had the issue, and even though the pressure test didnt show a head gasket issue, it was recommended so I did it (OEM head gasket)
My current thought is the expansion tank doesnt have a baffle and could be causing sloshing. it is 3/4 full and about 6 inches form the inlet to the outlet. I find it hard to believe, but this is where I am at.
Will pressure test, not sure when, but will let you know. I do know that 15 minutes after I turn off the engine, there is still some pressure in there, enough to bleed it a little more.
After vehicle is warmed up (190) Vehicle starts to heat up as soon as I stop. Fans going full force (2 fans with a manual switch) radiator is warm to touch, but not hot. . saw 220 after about 45 second one time, and 210 for a shorted stop. then I start to drive and it goes back down to 190. FYI, OEM Thermostat. no puddles
I am no expert, but having the heater circuit routed to the expansion tank seems like an issue to me. The heater circuit sees flow from the cooling system, does it not? And you have a tank with air in it. Just my .02
The Stock X19 works in this way (well kinda,it runs off the bypass) . Not saying it is the best, nor do I have to keep it this way. Make for a self bleed. I have been discussing how to properly run the cooling system for awhile and this was the popular way. AGAIN not saying I cant be convinced of another way. I know I need some sort of expansion tank as it is a "sealed" system. I originally was going to T off of one of the circuits to the bottom of the expansion and cap off the intake of the expansion.
got off the fiat forum. one of the others that did the B swap (most do the K) said.... "The way I did it on the B18c was to put a 'T' fitting in the line going to the interior heater coil near the cylinder head. The 'T' fitting then runs directly upwards to an expansion tank mounted on the firewall above. When bleeding, make sure you have the heater on so water circulates through this circuit. If you have air trapped, remember it will most likely be at the high points of the circuit which means in the top part of the radiator or in the top part of the coolant hoses that go to the cylinder head. When I refill my car with coolant I like to disconnect one of the large hoses going to the cylinder head and using a spout, pour anti-freeze directly into the hose until its near the top of the hose, then I quickly plug it back in to the head to avoid spilling more than I have to. Once things are properly bled, I've never had any issues with my car overheating, even when stuck in traffic."
I have the Ktuned. filler neck so filling will be easier. looks like I am getting a 5/16 tee!
The Stock X19 works in this way (well kinda,it runs off the bypass) . Not saying it is the best, nor do I have to keep it this way. Make for a self bleed. I have been discussing how to properly run the cooling system for awhile and this was the popular way. AGAIN not saying I cant be convinced of another way. I know I need some sort of expansion tank as it is a "sealed" system. I originally was going to T off of one of the circuits to the bottom of the expansion and cap off the intake of the expansion.
Thanks!!!
Odie
Have any pics of the cooling system components that you could share? Radiator, expansion tank, plumbing etc
The chances are much better that you have air trapped in the cooling system as opposed to somehow interjecting/drawing it in as you go. You will need to get us some photos of the radiator, how the feed/return hoses to and from the radiator and back toward the engine are routed and your heater hoses/coolant hoses around the engine are arranged. A stock B16A application doesn't have an expansion tank... there is simply an overflow tank if the cap pressure is overpowered, but the feed/return hose is at the bottom of the overflow tank, so no air can be re-introduced back into the system (unless the overflow tank is totally dry). The water in your expansion tank would ALWAYS have to be above the hose or hoses between said tank and the engine or air will be introduced.
I am trying to find a good diagram for how the radiator is set up. Pictures really went work well as the tubes are pretty hidden. Basically, radiator in front. With cooanlt tubes going straight through on the bottom of the car. Bleed valve on the top. The top of the radiator is lower than the height of the water pump.
I swapped from going with a pass through expansion to a single inlet expansion. So what i did is ran the heater out of the head, to a tee and back to the return. The tee goes to the bottom of the tank and the bottom is higher than heater circuit (no actual heater) tank will be filled 1/2 to 3/4.
odie
Last edited by autox19; 05-20-2018 at 02:25 PM.
Reason: Adding pic
Still having issues. Right now the tank is connected in the heater circuit. The air gets stuck in the radiator return line. Highest point. When up to temp (190+) open the bleed which is at the highest spot on the radiator return and no coolant coming out. I might just be impatient on the bleeding keeping in mind fiats even stock are known to be a pain to bleed.
my next thought. Move the tee to the tank to the return from the radiator. I might have a tougher time bleeding that circuit but once it warms up the air should purge with the tank on the return.
the pic shows current. You can see a metal stainless extension to after the bleeder adapter. I would put the tee there.
The hose going to the higher can MUST come from the highest point on the engine... which should be the front radiator hose fitting closest to the firewall. So "T" into that area. Also, you CANNOT "T" into the heater hose circuit... that only has fluid movement when the heater core is flowing fluid through it.
Normally, one would fill the radiator fully and place a "burping bucket" with the proper radiator cap fitting on top and fill halfway. Crank the car and let it idle until the electric fans cycle two or three times... then shut the engine off and allow it to fully cool... making sure some fluid remains in the bottom of the bucket. In your case, this means filling the swirl pot completely since the bucket needs to have fluid in it during the burping process... so you would have to cap the overflow fitting. The real question is will the swirl pot design keep from introducing air back into the system ???
Not including your swirl pot... what/where is the highest point in the cooling system ???
Highest spot is where you see the black adapter with the brass bleed valve. ( not including the tank) it is the return line from the radiator. The heater is not hooked up. So coolant flows constantly through that circuit.
I also purchased an airlift vacuum filler after I posted. I didn't empty the system. The tank was 3/4 full. After I applied the vacuum, I forgot to close the valve and the level went down to about 1/4 telling me there was air it purged. The vacuum held 20 psi for 10 minutes without moving before I let it refill the second time telling me there isn't a cooling leak. Which is good.
I am going to try it out tomorrow. If it still has issues I am going to move the tee. I am only going to try it as is first for 2 reasons. 1. A fellow x has the same swap and this is how he has it, (not saying its right) 2. It's kinda a pain each time I need to drain/refill.
I really appreciate the help!
Think I got it! I cant do a full test as my tow vehicle person is celebrating today. So I still had some air in the return bleeder. I painstakingly opened the valve, squeezed the hose shut the valve let up on the hose. Manual pumping. Until coolant came out instead of air.
ran the engine to 205 and started the fan (manual switch as the thermo switch is bad. Winter project next winter) temp went down to 186ish. Opened the valve Nd only coolant!
Hopefully full drive next week
video of it before it got to temp.
WOO HOO!! thanks guys!!! Just drove it to work and temp stayed 179-182. great sunny morning to drive top down. Did find out I have an LS transmission as 80 MPH was a little below 4000 rpm.
Oh and My friends that do the K swap (a much better, albeit more expensive option) got featured on hagerty K20 Fiat X19
Odie, I am not sure what size tire you are using... but if you use a 23" tall tire, 4000 rpm at 80 mph would indicate that you have a GSR transmission and not a LS.
Odie, I am not sure what size tire you are using... but if you use a 23" tall tire, 4000 rpm at 80 mph would indicate that you have a GSR transmission and not a LS.
05-17-2018, 05:28 AM
AutoX19'S B16 in a Fiat X1/9
nice work!
