itr1244

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AssPenny &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
RealTime y0!

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roll bar owns.

and did all drives got killed on those "flatened" roof cars?

Stinkycheezmonky

So I guess the BMW guys push it a tad too hard on the track, or what?

Adam ---&gt; Who's next upgrade beyond brake pads looks like it'll be a rollbar/cage...

io_burn

Now are there aftermarket seats you can get that are safe to have without a roll cage? I really like the super-deep-bolstered racing seats, but don't want a roll cage. Are Sparcos or any other aftermarket seat with a reclining mechanism safe to have in a stock car?

HondaJon

Seats that recline are on a stock car (Still no harness though).

It's only when fixed back seats are used that you should worry for your well being in event of a rollover without rollover protection.

JP

AW

I understand the logic regarding rollover protection for cars with fixed seats or harnesses but many stock cars with similar setups are legal?

Harness examples

BMW's and in europe have stock options for Schroth harnesses which are suppossedly street legal.

Dodge Viper GTS ACR comes with 5 point harness as well.

Many 2 seat coupes that have no back seat like the 350Z, NSX, etc... may have reclinable seats but they do not have any room for them to recline. In a rollover you would still be crushed as the seat would recline back, hit the back of the car and you would basically be sitting upright.

Some Porsche and Ferraris come with fixed racing shells as well...

Just puzzling to me...

AW

.RJ

The difference: Factory Installed and Crash tested.

The porsche GT3 with fixed buckets also has a integrated roll cage into the frame.

AW

Only clubsport version of the GT3 has the integrated cage. The seats come standard and is an option in other Porsche's as well.

I believe crash testing only involves front and side impact. I do not think they test rollover protection.

.RJ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AW &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Only clubsport version of the GT3 has the integrated cage. The seats come standard and is an option in other Porsche's as well.

I believe crash testing only involves front and side impact. I do not think they test rollover protection.</TD></TR></TABLE>

How do you know they didnt?

Comparing a porsche/ferrari to a civic (er, ITR, sorry) isnt a fair comparison really.

Rob :190:

the porsche GT3 seats are not available in the us in a porsche car....they are a very special order item.

and for the record, in a rollover, i'd much rather be in a porsche than a honda...

euclid

there was a video a few years back of a mercedes SL500 that rolled onto its roof at 140mph on the autobahn and slid upside down for a REALLY long time... when the car came to a halt the driver got out and walked to the side of the road.... mercedes used it as a commercial demonstrating the safety of the car.

io_burn

.RJ, could you give a few examples of aftermarket seats that don't require a rollcage/harness to be safe?

Rob :190:

probably any of the reclinable seats would be ok when used in conjunction with stock belts...

.RJ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by io_burn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">.RJ, could you give a few examples of aftermarket seats that don't require a rollcage/harness to be safe?</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://www.sparcousa.com

look at their "tuning" section of seats

IGGY

I would recomend the following (which is what i did):

1. Rollover Protection.
2. 5 point harnesses.
3. Bucket seat. (have yet to buy this)

IGGY

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

http://www.sparcousa.com

look at their "tuning" section of seats</TD></TR></TABLE>

There is no "tuning" section for seats, here is the link: Street Seats

AW

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

How do you know they didnt?

Comparing a porsche/ferrari to a civic (er, ITR, sorry) isnt a fair comparison really.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I never said they didn't roll it. The government that does the tests do not have rollover listed in their test procedures. This info is available to the public. This is what I was referring to.

I understand a Porsche or Ferrari is not a fair comparison. I was just trying to point out that there are cases where fixed seats are available on production vehicles that DO not have rollover protection.

I have been in several Porsche 911's and I do not personally feel they are built any more safely than your everyday ITR. Those A pillars are just as thin as the ones in our Honda. I think if you flip one of those, the roof will cave in the same as an ITR. That is why I am questioning why a manufacturer can include a fixed back seat or 4/5 point harness as standard equipment without rollover protection.

Thanks,

AW

AW

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Rob :190: &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the porsche GT3 seats are not available in the us in a porsche car....they are a very special order item.
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A friend of mine has a GT3 and it does indeed have those seats. I guess it is different in Canada vs the US.

AW

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by io_burn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">could you give a few examples of aftermarket seats that don't require a rollcage/harness to be safe?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Any aftermarket seat that is reclinable should be safe. Please note that there are companies including Sparco that make "street" seats that are 1 piece and they would not be safe to use without rollover protection.

AW