<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bork &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">not enough to stop you from reading it, though. </TD></TR></TABLE>

It takes a critical amount of work-place boredom, believe me.

Big Phat R: Yeah, this place, like most public forums are troll HQ. Unfortunately the only private automotive forum that I know is a subforum of the Something Awful forums. The $10 registration fee keeps idiots and trolls far, far away.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by io_burn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The $10 registration fee keeps idiots and trolls far, far away.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i would like to know of these....

 

forums.somethingawful.com - Best forums on the internet

 

Frank, I think that the moderators are doing you a favor. The hole you are digging for yourself is deep enough, I think. Your opinion differs. My advice? Leave it at that.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by io_burn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">forums.somethingawful.com - Best forums on the internet </TD></TR></TABLE>

Right Click save Link

 

Ok, you say this:<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The issue at hand has nothing to do with this, and i fear you've completely missed it and are blinded by your own self righteousness.

</TD></TR></TABLE>Then you say this:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">RJ - who's waiting for the "Ghettoracer Track Academy" so he can instruct there and be ensured joyrides in exotic machinery</TD></TR></TABLE>
So I guess it's ok to combine personal opinion with your moderator status while at the same time accusing someone else of being self-righteous. Sad state of affairs....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Frank, we dont care how many students are swinging from your *******....</TD></TR></TABLE>

Isn't that the H-T way though? See how many people you can swing from your *******?

 

Definitely a scene from "When Moderators Attack"

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ITRbroham &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Definitely a scene from "When Moderators Attack" </TD></TR></TABLE>Ok, i'm trying really hard not to laugh.

 

C'mon guys.... keep the discussion more civil ok? It's a Type R board so it should be better right?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Wai &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">C'mon guys.... keep the discussion more civil ok? It's a Type R board so it should be better right? </TD></TR></TABLE>

No, everyone who is upset and sad about the R forum comes into posts like this and bitches and moans about trolls and people who hurt their feelings.

I'm amazed that very few people have taken the time to read what GR has said and focus on that. The arguement is mostly about his intentions and what his primary reasons for instructing are based on: instructing or driving people's cars?

Chris - who doesn't get why people say "everyone comes on these threads and posts stuff they wouldn't say to Frank's face" when he ASKED for everyone's opinions in the thread in question.

 

this whole thread should not have been made, niether should the first one.


**** this thread...**** this guy.... and off-mauve is NOT a color

 

Before I had alot of respect for Frank and the things he has accomplished. But as of late, the comments and his attitude just make me feel bad for this guy. He really needs to calm down, and get off that hollywood starbucks mentality.

You might be the best instructor in the world, but for you to say that you would help one student more than the other just because you get a joyride is just wrong. And to me it doesnt matter if you got a **** faced rust bucket or a high priced exotic car. If you cant pay for repairs or replace then you shouldnt ask to drive this persons car.

Check your attitude at the door. Oneday that attitude might sneek up from behind and bitch slap you. And you'll be stuck with a foot in your mouth.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nice_Guy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Isn't that the H-T way though? See how many people you can swing from your *******? </TD></TR></TABLE>

I CURRENTLY HAVE 12 SWINGING. HOW MANY DO YOU HAVE??

IBTR/L

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chris N &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The arguement is mostly about his intentions and what his primary reasons for instructing are based on: instructing or driving people's cars?</TD></TR></TABLE>

And to me, after I read some more concerns from others, I felt that financial responsibility is another big issue, and is VERY legit.... I can see how those pro racers could pull that off without much doubts from others, simply because they have a trailer full of $100K+ race cars on the other side of the paddock.

Not doubting Frank's driving skill to avoid accidents, but sometimes, something just isn't avoidable.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Wai &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not doubting Frank's driving skill to avoid accidents, but sometimes, something just isn't avoidable.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Wai &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

And to me, after I read some more concerns from others, I felt that financial responsibility is another big issue, and is VERY legit.... I can see how those pro racers could pull that off without much doubts from others, simply because they have a trailer full of $100K+ race cars on the other side of the paddock.

Not doubting Frank's driving skill to avoid accidents, but sometimes, something just isn't avoidable.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree 1000%. I left that out of my statement above mistakenly. I touched upno how important I feel this issue is in the previous (now locked) thread.

Equally important, is the idea that instructors SHOULD have some credentials to show that they are qualified to instruct (i.e., some sort of accreditation/training from NASA, or other instructor-training program).

 

I said I would not discuss it further myself, but feel free to comment.


--

When I drive students' cars, I cater the demonstration to their level and their needs. Out of hundreds of driving demos I've done, I don't think I have had a student that complained afterwards. I keep the communications open. The demo intensity can be anywhere from 5/10th to near 10/10th (very rare, and usualy my own car).

As for handling the asking part... it depends on the rapport with the student. It could be as simple as "lets switch seats for 2-3 laps". Or on a very formal level something like, "If you are comfortable, I think it would help you out a lot if I can drive your car for a few laps at medium speed to demonstrate the things I'm talking to you about. If you are not at all comfortable for whatever reason, we can use my car instead." Once we go out (doesn't matter my car, or the student's car), I make sure they are comfortable, and adjust speed as necessary, and focus on what I think is useful to them. And we are in constant communication. Students have find these demos very valuable.

I instruct for all these reasons equally in no particular order... there may be more reasons, but I can't think of them all right now.

- meet people that love cars
- meet people that loves high performance driving
- help people understand, appreciate, and practice high performance driving; spread the joy of HPD
- help people appreciate their cars by improving their understanding
- great satisfication knowing i was able to help people
- help people safely learn (it pains me to see people damage their cars because of inadequete instruction)
- having a great time with people, and develop friends
- sometimes I get to drive cool cars (even if at low speed)
- free/reduced cost of seat time

For those of you that think you really love the sport, why don't you guys continue to instruct. But take away the free seat time and free food - ie, you pay full price to attend the events. Will you still be as dedicated and work every session? Will you do it all for love?

I get blasted because I speak the truth, that free seat time is important and a nice gesture by the organizers to the instructors. As hard as instructors have to work sometimes, it is more than a fair return. If I like a group enough, I will instruct for free or even pay. At Audi Quattro Club events, we have to pay partially to instruct. But the people there are so nice, I don't mind paying. It is the only club I actually have pay money to instruct at.

Take away the freebies and see how many instructors in your club will continue to instruct. I think (not positive) certain marquee clubs schools operates something like that. Instructors get very little, if any seat time. For the most part, you will not find true quality instructors there. Any decent driver with few track days can help the track beginners, but it takes considerable more experience and skills to really help the intermediate and advanced drivers.

 

someone please lock this thread.(?)

 

If anyone wants to discuss this further IM/email Frank.

This is not ITR related and at this point you are beating on glue.