LandHard

I've been having this problem for a couple of days now:

First, it does not want to start and I have to rev the gas pedal to get it going. Usually it stalls out the first couple of times, but it will start and seems to run normal when the accelerator is pressed. Like once I'm driving it seems fine.
However, stopping at a traffic light can be a problem. The engine kind of bucks a little every 30 seconds or so, like its bottoming out or something. Sometimes it acts like its going to stall out once I press the gas to drive off.

And it seems like the longer it sits there idling, the more prone it seems to want to stall once I hit the accelerator. It seems like it might be a problem with the fuel system, but I have no idea. I've replaced a few things related to the fuel system over the last couple of years but this seems different than other problems I've had.

Does this sound familiar to anyone?

masospaghetti

Any recent tune up items? I agree it sounds more like fuel, but it could be ignition related too.

Fuel filter, EGR port cleaning, distributor cap/rotor/wires/plugs?

LandHard

Nothing very recent, but I replaced the distributor cap/rotor/wires/plugs not very long ago, maybe a year or so, like late 2013 or early 2014, but now that you mention it, the symptom does seem a little bit similar to when I had a bad plug wire a few years back.

I had to check my post history, but replaced the o2 sensor with a new oem one in October 2013, replaced the fuel main relay and ICM (both used) in Oct 2012.

I just checked the CEL codes and I'm getting the same ones I did back in Oct 2013: 1, 17, 43.

Here's the last post in the thread I made back then:
https://honda-tech.com/honda-accord-.../#post49213048

masospaghetti

Curious that you're getting a O2 heater fault (code 1) even after you replaced the O2 sensor. Maybe the heater circuit wiring is bad (broken wire or blown fuse).

Code 17 is the VSS. Not sure if the VSS is used to change engine parameters or not. I know on GM vehicles, different fuel mappings are used if the vehicle is stopped or not. I am not familiar with Honda's method.

Code 43 is the fuel supply system. Looks like a bad O2 sensor can cause this but you already replaced it. It also looks like a fuel pressure regulator or fuel filter can cause it. I would replace your fuel filter first, cheap and easy, probably needs to be done anyway. Go from there.

holmesnmanny

Warm the car up. Unplug the connector for the oxygen sensor. Dtive around and see if the issue goes away. If it does, its likely you have either an open in the wiring, the connector is corroded, or the ecu is bad.

You also need a new VSS. Its fine to get it off ebay or amazon. Its very easy to install.

LandHard

Where exactly is the VSS located?

One thing I forgot to mention is that it has only really stalled out on me after after I put it reverse. Two times, last night and today, when I backed out of a parking space it stalled.

holmesnmanny

It's on the tranny, sitting on top of a the power steering steering assist gear assembly. There are two bolts that mount it to the gear assembly. One of them you must be careful when tightening it down as it's very easy to crack the ceramic type of casing that the bolt goes into.

scubacamper

I had a 1990 DX 5-speed that ran horribly - it would sputter and stall at red lights.

I put a new (used, from the junk yard) Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) in and like magic, it cleared right up and ran beautifully!

LandHard

Ok I warmed the car up, unplugged the o2 connector, drove around for a few minutes and the issue is still there.

LandHard

I can't for the life of me find that damn VSS under the hood. I watched a video and still don't see it down there.


I know his car is a 1995 Honda Odyssey but its the exact same part as 1993 Accord, maybe a slightly different location.

scubacamper

On my 1990, standing on the driver's side, leaning against the fender, peer down between the firewall and the motor - it's sticking straight up facing you - you'll see the bolt holding it in.

You might have to remove something but it's there....If you were to look at the motor, standing in front of the car, it's at about the 1:30 or 2 o'clock position.

Once you see it, you'll never not see it but if you don't know what you're looking for, it's kinda camouflage.

Correction - it's held on by 3 bolts and is mounted on the transmission.

CAUTION: When you take it out - do so VERY carefully!!!! There's a tiny little metal pin that sits in the assembly and it can very easily fall out (very difficult to locate once it falls).

This PIN will be replaced with the new sensor, but don't lose it just in case!

LandHard

Actually I just found it when I went back outside after my last post. It was covered with so much grease and crud that it literally was camouflaged. Now I just need to figure out the best way to get this bastard out. There's so much stuff in my way.

scubacamper

Lots of patience and extensions.

holmesnmanny

You should buy another one so that you have an idea exactly what it looks like and what you're dealing with.

It might be best to disconnect the shift linkage. It may look hard but it's not really hard. Just two cotter pins and 3 bolts that hold it onto the tranny.

LandHard

Well I replaced the VSS with a brand new one today and the problem hasn't gone away. Still running the same. I guess I'll have to buy another new o2 sensor and see if that works.

holmesnmanny

I would pull the ecu and open it up and look for any burned spots.

scubacamper

What about a bad distributor or dizzy cap?

masospaghetti

IMO a problem in the ignition system (such as a worn cap, rotor, bad ignitor, or bad coil) is much more likely than a bad ECU.

LandHard

The cap, rotor, plugs/wires, and icm have all been replaced fairly recently. And the o2 sensor is about 16 months old. The bucking and surging seems familiar but I can't quite place it.


that's under the carpet just below the dashboard on the passenger's side, right?

LandHard

OK, its been a few days and I haven't really been driving it, but this is what actually happened last night and what's been happening as opposed to my original post:

It actually starts just fine the first time, and revving the gas is not needed and is more likely to stall if I give it gas. It seems to idle alright except for the minor bucking/surging.

When I come to complete stop, then hit the gas, it just stalls out, then it is hard to start, like it takes awhile to turn over.

If I put it in drive, let it coast, then barely touch the accelerator, just gradually increasing the speed, it will drive just fine. But as soon as I come to stop, BOOM, it just wants to shut off.

Does this sound like something that's happened to any of you before? I'm going to go over my post history since 2012 and see if these symptoms have already happened to my car and I'm just drawing a blank. I don't know, maybe the 02 sensor I bought 17 months ago is defective. But it almost kind of seems like there's 2 different things wrong with it. Like in Oct 2012 when I had to replace both the fuel main relay and the ICM to get it running right.

holmesnmanny

I have had issue similar to this and it wound up being the ignition coil that was bad. I'm guessing it was overheating and burning itself out.

LandHard

The ICM? I looked thru my posts and I had to replace mine 2 years ago because it was doing the same thing.

holmesnmanny

I said ignition coil, not icm.

LandHard

What was the car doing and how did you figure it out? How did you test it?

LandHard

Ok now I'm stumped. I replaced the ICM with a new one (it took 9 days to get here) and although it ran a little bit better, it still ran rough like something was misfiring. So I replaced the ignition coil today and things have seemed to have gotten worse. It's hard to turn over and when it gets running its just rough and misfiring. I'm trying to figure out what I might have done wrong in the process of putting everything back together.