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Not sure why the obsession with 5 lug to be honest. Sure you have more options, but given that he was DC2R wheels, doubt he is going to get rid of those for the sake of 5 lug.
Wheel selection may be a bit more limited, but what more do you need than Enkei in any size from 15"-18"? Not to mention the already excellent DC2R wheels he has. Re tyre size, no limitation there. Tyres don't care about how many lugs you have.
In my case I wanted to increase the size of the rotors, tires, and rims, so it made sense to go to 5 lugs. That way I could use the rotors off other Honda cars that were 5 lugs. Also, finding 17x8 rims was much easier also. I ended up with Enkei Tenjin.
It's the easiest way to take care of problems like getting rid of that trash captive rotor setup and not being able to find replacement hubs if they are bad when he needs to replace the stock rotors. He can easily upgrade from stock size rotors in 5 lug to anything larger. Heavy wagon on tiny 15s and 30 year old brakes.
You make a good point there in terms of choice of rotors and factory honda options, but I doubt he will be swapping at this point.
Speaking from experience, I ended up with my setup step-by-step. And each step cost me money. Then I had to sell of the things I bought and buy more. First my 16" rims, then my 17"rims the were not wide enough. I went to the Odyssey rotors, then the RL rotors. So if you first decide where you want to end up and go there, it is a lot cheaper. But nobody ever does.
I was thinking about doing the 5 lug until I sourced my DC2's, I really love em and don't want to lose those!
I could try to get a pair in 5-lug but like Fitz said it would just cost me where this build is more of a daily driver / learning platform for me, but definitely something to think about for the future. If I end up keeping this baddie instead of importing a SiR CL2 in a few years I'm sure I'll get the itch to swap a bunch of stuff out again haha
Also I definitely dumped those awful captive rotors and did the RoH conversion, idk who designed that junk. But as for the brakes the Wagons actually came with some beef, for comparison the NSXrotors are 11.1 (282mm dia) with a 21mm thickness and the wagons are 11 (280mm dia) with a 25mm thickness with calipers to match. From all my research I did the primary benefit of an NSX swap for me would just be weight reduction. I think best bang for my buck right now is SS brake line kit, rebuild the master/booster, rebuild the front calipers, WAY better brake pads, and hook it up with rear disc. But if there's something I'm overlooking on that list for my current setup any advice is greatly appreciated!
I do have one update though, laid some paint on the rear wheel wells:
I installed new door lock actuators for the front doors too but that's not as fun haha. Currently waiting on parts to put together my rear shocks/springs then after that hopefully start ordering parts for the rear disc conversion/rebuild. Slow n Steady!
If you are doing all that, it is a good opportunity to look through your bushings in the back and make sure all are 100% before mounting the knuckle etc back up, Same for sway bar endlinks and all that.
I was thinking about doing the 5 lug until I sourced my DC2's, I really love em and don't want to lose those!
I could try to get a pair in 5-lug but like Fitz said it would just cost me where this build is more of a daily driver / learning platform for me, but definitely something to think about for the future. If I end up keeping this baddie instead of importing a SiR CL2 in a few years I'm sure I'll get the itch to swap a bunch of stuff out again haha
Also I definitely dumped those awful captive rotors and did the RoH conversion, idk who designed that junk. But as for the brakes the Wagons actually came with some beef, for comparison the NSXrotors are 11.1 (282mm dia) with a 21mm thickness and the wagons are 11 (280mm dia) with a 25mm thickness with calipers to match. From all my research I did the primary benefit of an NSX swap for me would just be weight reduction. I think best bang for my buck right now is SS brake line kit, rebuild the master/booster, rebuild the front calipers, WAY better brake pads, and hook it up with rear disc. But if there's something I'm overlooking on that list for my current setup any advice is greatly appreciated!
I do have one update though, laid some paint on the rear wheel wells:
I installed new door lock actuators for the front doors too but that's not as fun haha. Currently waiting on parts to put together my rear shocks/springs then after that hopefully start ordering parts for the rear disc conversion/rebuild. Slow n Steady!
Good job doing that. I always think that is something that is overlooked in most builds/cars. Not only does it look 100% better, it protects from rust.
@collkid Thanks dude! that's what I'm thinking haha, I'm trying to spray the areas that I think will be somewhat visible but missed when I take it in for a full paint job
@nicolaselias Definitely want to change all the rear control arms. definitely a lot of cracks and crust. It seems like the rears are way harder to source than the fronts though (I was able to get all OEM / Sankei on the fronts). Is there a good aftermarket option for the accords? I heard a lot had accord specific fitment issues. I was thinking that the other option was to try and press out/in new bushings but from my understanding the actual metal arms will suffer stress from use so its good to do full swaps. Any recs would be greatly appreciated!
Honestly, here in the caribbean we don't tend to replace whole arms unless ABSOLUTELY neccessary. What i've found from MY experience is that pressing in the bushings has never caused any damage (on my accord, my volvo, my wife's subaru forester or my Hilux Surf). The key thing I've found is not to damage the arm while REMOVING the previous bushing. A lot of mechanics here just burn out the existing rubber bushing rather than fighting to press it out if it doesn't want to go easily.
I am no expert on how to determine the condition of the arms themselves, since we don't typically have too much rusting issues here unless you live close to the sea. If you do decide to do the bushings, Prothane makes a complete kit with the rears, it aint cheap, but fitment and quality is first class. Most people suggest sticking with rubber for the trailing arm bushing however, but poly should be fine for all the rest.
Dude I’m definitely going to do that then! No matter what it’ll be way cheaper than buying all new arms haha
and I live inland in SoCal so rust isn’t an issue here, just worried about the stress but the car itself was a family car all it’s life and I assume the rear has way less stress than the front so swapping the bushings is probably the best way to go
Got a few minor updates on the wagon but probably more Questions than answers.
Finally started getting parts for the rear disc swap/rebuild. I cheaped out and bought some OEM style rubber bushings for the Trailing Arm and the Upper Control Arm which are full press fit (metal sleeve and all not just the rubber). Had to take a bunch of measurements and fight em out but it was a good lesson learned haha.
One thing though I cannot find a replacement Sankei ball joint for the upper rear, so I was thinking about either getting an off brand or just getting the boot cover and re-greasing. They aren't torn open just cracked up so it might be fine underneath? not sure the best move here. Also absolutely cannot find OEM style bushings for the 2 lower control arms, so I was thinking about just grabbing some full fancy arms I've seen people with online like the adjustable Megan Racing style and SSR Solid Arm style (for examples). Has anyone had any experience with either style? Is there a good brand to go with or should I just keep trying to source new arms/bushings?
Got the Rear Knuckles in too. pulled em apart, cleaned em up and slapped the usual coat of Corroseal on so I can tape em off an paint em up. I think the knuckles I got had the ABS wiring hooked up to them though, can I still use the knuckle if I don't have ABS? I cant see any reason why not but figured I might be missing something
Finally I've also been trying to source a roof rack for this thing that's not $300+. I heard somewhere that the racks from the 97-99 Odyssey's fit the accord wagons but didn't know if anyone could confirm this?
Either way any help is greatly appreciated! My main focus right now is just gettin all the parts for the caliper swap and gettin this thing movin again!
Some pics of some ****:
coated the Arms to stop the surface rust, also gonna try to hammer the dust shields back to normal an clean those up. My OCD is kicking in so I'm probably gonna order all new hubs and rotors too. Already got some calipers on order I found dirt cheap already rebuilt
The trailing arm bushings I got pressed in hoping that "closes enough" wont be my last words hahaha
Also swapped out my retractable antenna for a whip style one! unplugged the motor and just kept the bracket in for support. found a super easy swap from the Antenna Shop that was pricey but worth it in the end
Sometimes, MOOG in the US are just rebranded 555 Sankei. It has happened for me in the past to be honest, but no way to know until you receive the ball joint. Honestly, any decent aftermarket ball joint is better than the old worn one (if it has play) so I would say MOOG, beck/arnley, ac delco gold etc would be fine.
Some brands sell adjustable camber ones as well but I have never used those so I can't offer any meaningful feedback on them to be honest.
Re the plans to replace hubs and rotors, it is really about your budget, just a matter of if you can afford to do it or not since you have everything apart.
@nicolaselias Thanks dude! I def like it way better than the Auto-one. Also I think my budget opened up a little bit on this wagon. I was looking more into importing a JDM and living in Cali is WAY more trouble than its worth. So I'm just gonna extend the budget for this instead of trying to save for that haha. I have been eyeing the older 5-speed AWD CR-V's though. Might grab one of those too if I can find one with under 200K miles on it
@FuzzyManPeach Appreciate it dude! I'm glad people are still checking out the thread. I feel like I want to be updating it way more/faster, but $$$ is always the issue. Slow and Steady but definitely still makin moves!
Posted this in its own thread but gonna put it here too just in case I can glean some good info for the future:
Trying to find the 3 rear control arms has been way harder than I thought for both OEM and performance oriented items (Accord specific). I ended up ordering a Megan Racing kit with all 3 adjustable arms. I usually do all my research beforehand but I jumped the gun in a rush to finish and when I did my research post-order it seems like everyone hates the Megan racing stuff for a handful of reasons. The thing is though all the posts I find are from pre-2010. So my questions are:
Are they still around because they got better? or because they got cheaper?
Has anyone had any recent experience with the Megan Racing stuff on the Accord?
If it is garbage is there something better I could go with? What are good options for accord rear (and front) control arm upgrades?
This is what I got on order BTW (and wondering if I should cancel it):
Can't speak to Megan now. About 10-15 years ago it was seen as a poor man's tuner part, but recently the megan prices I see online have gone up, and cheaper no-name brands have replaced them. It seems like they either elevated their brand status, or just the lower end of the market been flooded by unknown brands so megan was able to move up. I only have one megan part on my car, which is a resonated test-pipe, and it has held up fine (in hot tropical weather) for about 10 or 11 yrs.
I think of a story my dad told me, when he was a child in school he had an Omega watch, which was considered a cheap and basic watch, but now Omega costs thousands. Things either become defunct or elevate their brand status
Finally have a solid update! after saying yolo and ordering a bunch of parts I'm finally putting together the rear suspension. After jumping the gun on ordering rear control arms I double backed and did a bunch of research, I ended up keeping the upper control arm set from Megan Racing (following @nicolaselias solid advice, these things def look quality) because from my understanding being able to pivot from that angle is actually something you should control when adjusting suspension. However for the lowers I went with solid arms since a side to side pivot is not something I need for my application, and if you DO need that then you'd be looking for something way more advanced than an "affordable" setup. for lowers I wanted something strong so I went with Fat Four Customs set and DAMN, these things are legit as hell. So I was able to get the rear shock/struts in and my rear knuckles, right now I'm just waiting on the smaller support bushings for the trailing arm. When I swap those in I can jack up the knuckle and tighten everything down
I also have most of the parts for the Rear Disc Conversion (calipers, brake lines, rotors) just waiting on the new hubs to show up. Still need to get the proportioning valve though, it seems like people are onto the 4040 rarity ($16 at the PYP vs $120+ on eBay fml) and I suspect someone working at the Pick Your Parts is pulling them all cause every single integra had them clipped out. Like nothing else would even be touched yet but the 4040 was gone, so not sure what I'm gonna do about that yet. But I'm also gonna get a new Booster and Master (maybe something performance?) and still need to source new e-brake cables since I have the drum ones still on there. Looking at Majestic Honda though they don't say there's any difference between the disc vs drum? which I think is strange but I haven't seen anything to compare it to so who knows. Just killing time now till next payday to hopefully source the last of the parts and get this thing rolling again
Pics (This is my first time with this job so if you see anything off lmk):
P.S. this is my first and last set of STR.T's (do they even make them anymore?) I don't know if its all aftermarket struts but the top section where there's usually an allen key slot to tighten it down they swapped it for just like a flat section to clamp onto (maybe ill need to take pics) and its a pain in the *** to tighten it down. just looking at them I'm not looking forward to it after thinking about when I did the fronts
so it has been a while since my last upload but the Waggy is STILL ALIVE! Everything is back together and the brakes are done. I’ve actually taken her for rides around the block and she runs, drives, and stops. Per @nicolaselias advice i need a 40/40 prop valve because without it the brakes feel squishy. It took me forever to find one (under $100 for a $16 yard part lmao) and I have that and a new brake master to install
another reason for the long wait between updates is I’m kinda stuck rn. So before I tore it apart it was sometimes randomly big down and shut off coming to a stop. After her last few cruises it’s happening all the time even idling in the driveway. starts up fine idling at about 2K rpm, then as it warms up it drops down but when it gets under 1.5k it drops down pretty quick to 1k, then to 500. When it hits 500 it starts to bog and dies (all the lights stay on after it does)
So far I’ve: changed the MAP sensor, tested the battery (running / non running), changed cap/rotor/wires/coil, inspected the air intake and filter, tested the fuel pressure, and bought a Main Relay to swap out. After that all I can think of is cleaning out the whole TB/IACV/FITV and maybe swapping out the fuel pump? I’ve done tons of research but nothing really definite has come up with the same symptoms so next paycheck she’s goin to the Mechanics. If they can’t figure out what it is I’ll try the cleaning and FP swap. After that I’m at a loss. My daily was vandalized and totaled out though so I have to get her running or she might land on the chopping block!
I would have opted for KYB AGX instead of those STR T's. Yes, I'm sure someone will say go with the Konii Yellows but they will not fit that size GC coilover.
@NVturbo will the KYB work direct fit? I didn’t realize how non-adjustable this setup is haha. It actually ended up way too low so I “raised” them as much as I could but now the ride is like bouncy and not stiff. Wondering if just a new set of full coil overs would be better?
KYB AGX should fit on the GC sleeves you currently have. I'm going take a wild guess and say you have the stock spring rates on the GC sleeves which is quite soft. I have TEIN Street Advance coilovers on my wagon and they are okay. Wish I can upgrade the rear springs to something stiffer but no one makes tapered springs that fit.
02-08-2022, 09:47 AM
Re: 1994 Accord Wagon Build
