NAH2B

posted this in the allmotor forum as well.....

im interested to know how many allmotor guys out there w/ daily drivers would come out and race at the events if there was a street allmotor class for actuall street driven cars?

imo its fairly safe to assume anything requiring a rollbar (11.49) isnt going to be a true "street car" because of the modifications required to make that kind of power and get the car light enough to run those et's

most QUICK daily driven street cars are gonna run 12's, some may run high 11's. obviously you can only do so much on 93 pump gas so that would be one requirement of such a class.

i believe a class like this is needed to help the sport grow and get more guys interested in racing allmotor. obviously we already have a street allmotor class which is dominated by sportsman allmotor guys driving purpose built sportsman racecars, myself included.

honestly i feel both class's are needed. the true daily driven class for people to become interested in racing and the sportsman class as a stepping stone/transition to pro allmotor.

now some people will say street stock is an entry level class for newcomers. well it is however it doesnt allow engine swaps.....BIG PROBLEM because there are sooo many guys driving around everday in swapped cars that would love to come out and race but arent gonna waste their time or money to compete against the purpose built cars. this is one thing which is hurting the sport.

so, im interested to see just how many of you here would come out and race if it was in a true street class for daily drivers? like i said before, a class like this would probably run mainly 12's but im sure there would be a few high 11 second cars w/ mildly built k and h swaps.

so who would come out and race?

also feel free to provide your own point of view as well, even if we may not agree

2fastGSR

People that dont come out to races now, will most likely not come out regardless . . .

So you want a class limited by fuel choice. . . . Convincing a track to incur the expense of a specific gravity tester, paying extra staff members in order to man it, all for probably the same car count as street stock or our regular all motor class (6-8 cars) probably just isnt going to happen

93-lsvtec-eh2

sounds like a great idea but getting it to happen isn't going to be easy.



i for one refuse to cut up my perfectly good street car to run faster, a street car is a street car not cut up and hollow with lexan windows

NAH2B

fuel is not difficult to regulate. our class has a fuel rule now....

there would be WAY more than a few cars running a class like this. the car count of such a class would put our class to shame no doubt.

i dont know about NJ but around here the majority of street allmotor cars arent cut up. there are TONS of guys w/ swaps in full interior cars driving around everyday who would love to race in a class suitable for them.

of course just like anything else it wont happen overnight, but as the word gets around the class would definately thrive.

keeping things as they are now honestly hurts the sport. believe me i dont like to think like that, especially since i myself have a purpose built car, but we are definately hurting the sport.

like i said, both classes are needed. the slower class to get new guys out racing, and the current class as a stepping stone to transition to pro allmotor.

although some of us dont have any intentions of transitioning, we would rather simply dominate the street class forever sucking all the $$ and life out of our grassroots class

NAH2B

nothing worth much ever comes easy

Professor15

LoL sounds like the same thing all the F/I people were/still saying. I def. dont dis-agree with this. Just interested to see how your planning on making this an even playing field ( hefty weight? + small slicks to limit driveline problems?) None the less....props for even putting an effort.

2fastGSR

Except the reasoning for your theory is flawed.

You use our class as an example , so will I.
Our class says u can run whatever fuel you want except meth/alky. There are 100s of choices of race fuel and octane levels you can use.

In your proposed class the major rule is that u can do whatever you want but have to run pump gas. Because of the limited choices available you are opening it up to more scrutiny to the racers in the class. This fact alone would make it almost a necessity to have a fuel tester. Our class has the rule now but it isn't enforced. Because the major rule is based around being able to run on pump then everyone would want to make sure that is being done. Thus requiring the purchase and operation of a fuel specific gravity tester.

I'm just offering a very realistic point of view. If you were to approach an event organizer and say hey we have this idea for a class but we'll need use of an expensive tool and people to man it, I gaurantee it will influence the final decision.

I don't remember seeing any rule that mandates the transitioning of classes or cars within those clases. must have been in the old Nhra rulebook I guess.

Sucking the life from our grass roots sport huh.
Here goes Randy up on his pedestal again.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where that comment is targeted. So you are criticizing some of the VERYu few people willing to travel and help our sport grow. Just so happens they have a top notch car to boot. That sounds like yet another award winning comment coming from your camp.

But hey I'm just telling it like it is.

BIGTUNA

Randy what makes your car not fit in such class? just fuel?

Heads up racing is what is, the only "fair" and "cheap" racing is brackets, head up class cost $$ either deal with it cut a light and have some fun or go brackets.

and what the hell is "grassroots" no one pays anyone to race in sportsman classes, we all have jobs and invest what we can into what we love, some invest more, some sacrifice more, how is that no longer "grassroots".

I guess if you get free **** from companies that shouldn't excluded you from being "grassroots" but if another racer wants to work overtime and bust his *** to buy whatever he wants and puts you on the trailer then than isn't "grassroots"?

NAH2B

haha dont the f/i guys have 2 street class's already...

since the class is just "hypothetical" discussing rules is kinda pointless at this time, however incase there would be anyone watching who may consider adding a class like this to their event schedule, i am definately open to discussing possible rules.

to start, it would be a heads up class allowing engine swaps and slicks.

it would most likely be limitied to 4 cyl fwd cars. although im sure there are ways to allow rwd and/or 6 cyl cars to compete as well.

the class would require FULL interior, possibly w/ the exception of rear seats. there are plenty of daily driven cars running around w/o rear seats.

full exhaust would be required

93 pump gas required

all oem street equiptment required (lights, mirrors, wipers, windows, etc)

NO widebody fronts (including 3 piece and/or 1 piece)

no fuel cells

ans so on....basically a class for street cars which actually drive on the street and fill up at any gas station, then go to the track and bolt on the slicks

MARC P

Sounds like BOTI/IDRC rules except Pump gas, so I could run in the glass because I run pump gas.

I don't think the answer is to add classes, it is to fill the current ones we have(which doesn't always happen)

Not always the fastest guy wins, people break(look at this year how many events the top guys have broke)

Just my opinion though

Marc P

NAH2B

so why throw this thread off topic w/ all that bs? half of it i dont even know where its coming from.

everyone knows there are guys who will continue to run this class and keep scaring away newcomers rather than stepping up w/ the big boys in pro allmotor.....which is probably why pro allmotor has died out the way it has.

as for the fuel testing, yes it will need to be looked into alot more for a class like this. but i will tell you what, i havent seen any race gas yet that doesnt have a very recognizable smell to it, so in reality the only tool youy would need is your nose but honestly if the class is a success how hard would it be for sanctioning body to purchase something to test fuel?

Jake, im not sure why your coming at me the way you are but i honestly dont appreciate it one bit. im trying to throw an idea out there to help our sport, why so much negativity from you?

its not like im saying to get rid of our class in favor of this new class.

NAH2B

you run pump GAS or e85?

yes it would be similar to boti but pump gas would limit the possible et's.

as for filling up the current class....its not gonna happen. it takes upwards of $25k to build a competitive car for our class from ground up. how many people can do that? obviously not many or the class would be thriving now.

whens the last time you have seen a full boti field?

while i appreciate hearing everyones imput, its obvious the current top dogs besides myself wont like the idea. id really like to hear some imput from the guys who would actually fit/run in a class like this.

OmegaDynamics

Man up, who do you think should leave the class?

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Mike@CCT

I see both of your points Randy and Jake

I know I have at least 10 customers that would love a class like this. Good idea, but I doubt it would work out. It would be dominated by k-series cars at first. Then everyone else would bitch and it would end up the same as our current class. The K guys would get nailed with weight and then the class will crumble.

NAH2B

haha man this threat is turning to ****


care to give an opinion rather than stiring the pot?

NAH2B

thats a good point.

im sure there would also have to be other restriction than just fuel.

lets talk about comparing different motors and possible et's....

i know out of the box, H and K series will run the same et's

but what about mildly built pump gas H and K's....

you can go low 12's high 11's w/ a pump gas H series in a street hatch

what about a k series in the same car? i would guess very similar.

OmegaDynamics

Care to reach down and see if you have a pair?

You made a comment, you think people should step up, who are the people you are talking about?

ALLMOTOR18

having run in BOTI and NHRA S/S, I feel that weight restrictions are the only realistic way of evening the playing field...

The NHRA S/S format seemed to have a somewhat level playing field at the time... Obviously the weight restrictions would need to be looked at more closely as K-series builds have drastically advanced..

If BOTI were to put weight restrictions on swapped car for S/S then I would not mind competing against swapped cars...

NAH2B

i think i should step up which is what im doing. im working on improving my setup to the point where i can transition into a pro chassis.

if others want to stay in the street class all their life thats fine w/ me, however the street class will remain w/ a 6-8 car field and the sport will have one less improvement.

what do you think? do you feel new racers will enter the current class if the several who currently dominate were to move on?

and since your so persistant to have your question answered, here it is....

10 second et's are too quick for a street allmotor class. its not realistic or obtainable for 90% of people. so i think anyone who consistantly runs 10's in our class should consider transitioning to pro allmotor.

yes i do have a pair, so now you can give some useful mature imput or STFU

Bserious

lol... everyone has there own opinion on things. Trying to start at the bottom does not always make the best sence. Some believe the issue is more 'sportsman' cars need to come along for Import Drag Racing to grow, I look at it from the other end of the spectrum... more Pro-cars need to come along before that even happens.

AM_H2B

I agree that a class like this would get a lot of the younger racers involved in the sport. The cost to build a dedicated race car, trailer, truck, etc... is out of reach for many. It would be a great way to encourage the guys that daily drive their cars, are running high 11's - high 12's to continue being involved in the sport and hopefully improve their setups over time.

Bserious

What's the drive for the 'younger' racers? Why would they want to be envolved? It's still an expience any way you look at it.

NAH2B

most younger people arent gonna be able to afford to build an all out racecar, but this would give them a class in which they could run their swapped daily driver.

its still an expense, BUT there are tons of them already out there driving around everyday and its obtainable for almost anyone. if they know they dont have to run against purpose built 10 second cars, they will come race. its that simple.

our current street allmotor class doesnt even have street cars running in it and thats the problem. none of the cars running mid 11's and quicker are streetable. they are purpose built cars which 90% of people cant afford or dont have the resources to build.

our class should be called sportsman allmotor rather than street allmotor.

NAH2B

ok and how are pro cars gonna come along when nobody is transitioning from the street class?

although i do have to give Richie Gibson credit for trying to make the switch

MARC P

The difference between pro all motor and sportsman is about 100k more to build. Don't know about you but I don't have that cash to waste. Plus there are 4 times the races for sportsman racers.

Marc P