Guess what I just found for sale locally:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cg...item=597757864


I am trying to go see this car sometime this weekend if anyone from another area needs an honest opinion.

Jon

 

That's pretty cool, if you ask me...I really like that thing.

 

Yeah, he posted it 4sale on the ECHC Forum as well. i emailed him about his rear swaybar. He said it was a custom setup, but he would take pics of it and email them to me before he sells it if he can. He seemed like a nice guy

 

Super nice guy, actually. Turns out I've met him before... He's also got two modded 3rd gen RX-7's and a turbo rotary powered Lotus Seven. I'm going to go drive that Accord tomorrow... can't wait!

Jon
who will be honored to sit in a seat formerly occupied by Randy Pobst

 

while you're at it, see if you can try out the turbo-rotary'd 7! Thats one car I'd absolutely whole-heartedly love to just even be able to move it 50ft.

 

Funny you should mention that... it's the only car I can think of that can be run at Summit Point with the Mazda Club on Saturday and then displayed at a British car show on Sunday.

Jon
hoping to win the lottery soon

 

Would this car be H1 for the ECHC due to the high compression pistons? Or are those not allowed in the ECHC at all?

 

I remember those cars, a guy named Joel in Buffalo owned them. I could probably find his email somewhere if someone on this board buys the car and wants to get in touch with the original owner. They sat for a long time, sounds like this guy bought one and went through everything to get it ready to go. You'll still need to update the safety items and maybe finish the harness bar all the way across depending on who you want to race with. All in all, I would say that's short money to get into a Honda race car with great history!

 

Jon, find out if he was at VIR with Mazda Club this past September.

 

now you see what I aspire to. i am very interested in the setup of that car. Jon let me know all the info that you find out. Sounds like everything is almost the same on my car except for the saftey items and wheels. damn am i jealous.

Morgan-who wishes Jon had waited until next weekend.

 

Well I went and saw/drove the car earlier tonight. Two words - GREAT PACKAGE!

First of all, the car looks like hell. The only totally straight panel on it is the roof. It has sticker residue everywhere... which in my opinion adds character. Oh, and the license plate is "I H8 RICE"...

It has just under 12,000 miles on it... but at least 11,000 of those are on racetracks. (The motor was reportedly freshened before the last race and has less than 1500 miles on it.) The only non-cosmetic damage I saw was small crinkling at the corners of the core support, as if the car had been through one or two front-corner-contact incidents...

The interior is semi-gutted but all the factory soundproofing is still glued to the tub. There is no driver side window because the door has been hollowed out to fit the cage's NASCAR door bars in there. It's got a *nice* Recaro racing seat (looks a lot like a Corbeau Forza) for the driver, with a stock passenger seat. Older Autopower harnesses (too old for roadracing) are on both sides. The HART rollcage is beautiful, simple, and unobtrusive. (Personally I would weld some more stuff in - namely a rear connector across the shock towers and the rest of the harness bar).

The suspension is "Konis with Eibachs". The car felt pretty stiff (as stiff as an SE-R with AGX's and Ground Controls) so I'm guessing they aren't "off the shelf" units. Rob said the shock settings "hadn't been touched since the car was last raced"...
Also, the car had large front and rear strut tower braces and the biggest friggin' NASCAR-style rear swaybar I have ever seen.

As for driving it... flip the battery master switch to the right, turn on the ignition, pump the gas pedal twice, twist the key, and it fires right up with no smoke or stumbles of any kind. It heats up quickly but runs cool (never higher than 1/3 of the way up the factory dial, according to Rob).

The shift linkage is apparently stock, which is in this case Honda-smooth and easy, if not all that fast. I'm not sure what kind of clutch was in there - it felt grabbier than stock but still totally streetable.

The car is loud. Actually it's worse than loud. It's the most god-awful, obnoxious, tinny, buzzy, raspy noise I've ever heard from a street car. And that's *with* a muffler! I'm sure it is under the 103db racetrack limit at WOT, but not by much.

It pulls strongly, and the torque curve feels surprisingly flat from about 3k to redline (computer-imposed 6700rpm with the current setup, easily changed). The car was quick, but not tremendously fast... I have no idea how much hp it makes (170???) but I'm guessing that it would do a low 15 second 1/4 mile. It free-revs very easily - you can rev-match a downshift with just a nudge of your right toe - so it's obviously got a good flywheel on top of that spin-happy balance/blueprint job.

So I drove it on some twisty and deserted back roads after dark, with decently worn Toyo Proxes RA-1's picking up every piece of gravel in the road. From 30mph low in 2nd to 90mph high in 3rd, it pulled really hard and was rock-solid with no real squeaks or rattles. It definitely left me wanting more...

The suspension was definitely streetable - stiff but not horrible. (In fact, too soft for a dedicated racecar IMHO). I didn't really horse it around turns, but my initial impression was that the car didn't push. Actually it felt beautifully neutral to me, but again, I wasn't really driving it hard.

And the spares... he's got an entire engine/trans that looks good, spare axles & hubs, spare motor accessories, belts, hoses, rotors, calipers, $500 worth of Porterfields, a real FSM, the rest of the interior, and much more. Also a set of black Speedline wheels with Toyos, that were very light (est ~30 pounds with tire).

All in all - it's a lot of car and a lot of spares for $12k. For the right person this would be one helluva good turnkey package deal.

Thus enters my dilemma. The SE-R is at least 10 grand away from being a halfway decent racecar, or 15+ grand from being close to the limits of ITS rules. And when I'm done, I'll have a car that *still* can't keep up with the RX-7's and 944's and 240Z's and 325's in ITS. So... the reason I went to look at this car is because I wanted to see what 12 grand would buy. And this is one helluva fun way to spend 12 grand!

But I do have some concerns. As a track toy, it would be reliable and fun. But as a club racer, it is still a ways away from being finished IMHO. And when it's finished, it will run in ITE with SCCA and get its doors blown off by... pretty much everything else in ITE. My other concern is that this car isn't ECHC legal because it is HART-built and because of the hottie JDM cams/pistons. Or that if it is ECHC legal, it will run in some class where it is hopelessly uncompetitive. Can someone clarify that point please? Also, one more thing, it's not light (est 2900 pounds).

If I hit the lottery I would love to have it as a track beater. But, unfortunately, I don't think I can afford it right now. (I can't see getting a loan for a street legal racecar... and still making payments if I ball it up.) It's a deal for 12 grand, but for me, 12 grand would buy a competitive ITS car that would run circles around this Accord.

So... all in all I highly recommend this car to anyone looking for a solid toy. To the right person, this is a great car waiting for a new home.

Sorry for rambling,

Jon
who now knows that Randy Pobst must be pretty small... that Recaro was way too snug for my fat @$$, and my head was almost touching the rollcage

 

PS- Regarding the car's owner, Rob Murray - he was a super cool/kind guy who is very knowledgeable about cars. His other projects included a crazy metallic blue 3rd gen RX-7, a red Lotus Europa powered by a ported, Weber'd 13B Mazda rotary, and...

...the aforementioned Roto-7. It was a black Lotus 7, totally modded out, making approximately 300hp from its T04B turbo'd 13B Mazda rotary with Electromotive Tec-II, among other things!

PS- Adam, I don't think he had the car at VIR in Sept but I know he has run it at Summit with MSCW before.

Jon

 

jdm cam, is this an oe jdm cam???? if so me wanna know

 

Jon,
OK now. Honestly besides the race history, which is cool, this car from what I've seen and read is not worth $12,000. You could build a better car for less. I can understand your interest because of the famous asses that have been in the seat but don't do it. But if you do, please post pic's!!

Victor Penner

 

Assuming the internals of the engine are HONDA pieces...it would be legal for ECHC. It'd go into H1 (side note for everyone - I'm working through the H1 rules right now to try and make them better).

In H1, a hell of a lot more car could be built for a hell of a lot less money. And there's evidence of crash damage, which is never really a good thing. Still though...an interesting car. I hope someone who will use it correctly ends up with it.

 

About 5'10, 170. He was in line right in front of us in Daytona at registration this year. Very friendly and approchable, we chatted with a few others for about an hour waiting in line.

He mentioned racing at LeMans, and the guy in front of him was like "what, like in France? What's your name?" And Pobst points to the guys Petit LeMans shirt like three people ahead and goes "That's me". It was pretty funny at the time.

 

Yeah Victor, I had the exact same feeling. For $7500 it would be worth buying... but 12 grand is better spent on something else. Too bad; I really enjoyed driving it and I would love to beat the **** out of it on a road course every weekend.

Jon

 

That sounds about right. I am 6'-1/2", 230+. The seat was a couple inches too high for me, and also at least a few sizes too snug for my 40 inch waist.

But it was still cool to think of all the fast/skinny folks who had been in that seat!

Jon
if they had never invented Rolling Rock... I could fit in that Recaro

 

That is part of the big dilemma. Not that I'm building an ECHC car specifically, but it would be nice to have one around to drive. My biggest concern is that people with a LOT more money to spend have beaten the snot outta that poor thing for 11k miles. Yes it used to be a "pro" car but... it also sat for 2.5 years before anyone bought it, and that worries me. Karl, you hit the nail on the head when you called it "interesting"... it is exactly that, and nothing more. It has a lot of possibilities but it doesn't fit into the current scheme of things, unfortunately.

Jon
who is ready for bed finally, at 3:07am, despite the fact that he still shares his house with his ex-girlfriend and she isn't home yet... but what can I expect, her date tonight drove a red NSX...

 

No way.
As mentioned, this car won't be competitive anywhere. If you just wanted a drivers school car with an interesting history, It'd be an OK find for less than $10K. Or, maybe it would be vintage eligible if you have the logbook to prove it's history? I dunno.

What I do know is that you could build TWO fast and fun H5 CRX Sis for that kind of money. You could also pick up any of several competitive ITA cars that are currently for sale for less than $10K and have money left over to buy a couple of sets of Hoosiers.

Just my opinion.

PS - That car WAS at VIR with MSCW, but something broke on it and it never made it to the track.

 

Somebody just bid the $9500 minimum on it, and there is no reserve posted, so it looks like it will sell for that when the auction closes later tonight. Lotta fun for less than 10k!

Jon
who had planned to offer him $6k and a 6-pack

 

If indeed that was the one, I went up and looked at it and asked if I could help but I think he was pretty disgusted with the stripped screw in the hub so they were packing it up to go home. I kinda see the attraction being a proven car and all.

 

Black 7 w/13x10's in the rear? Tan 1-car enclosed trailer? Ancient red van? Father & son, son wears thick glasses?

Waiting to hear back from the guy if he was there or not, and now obsessively curious,

Jon

 

Dude and freind - dude wears glasses. One way to tell for sure, look at the philips head screw on the driver's side hat (that weekend it was stripped beyond usability) - if is brand new that'd be him.

 

Not him. He said he hasn't had it at an MSCW event since Summit in '99. He also said you could leave it in 5th gear at 100mph and floor it on the front straight, and the back end would step out. Aaaaahhhh, light weight/high horsepower kicks ***!!!

Jon
who can't even imagine 300hp in a 1500# car