Im wondering which is the stronger tranny? Is the ctr tranny the same size diff as a b16 tranny? or is it the same thing as a ITR one?

Thanks in advance.

 

comonn someone must know lol

 

well the gearing on the ITR/CTR/B16 transmission is the exact same.

as for differental size i didnt know they were diffrent, the final drives are the same (4.400) and the R transmissions have LSD standard, its optional on the b16 (jdm only)

as for wich is stronger, they are all the same transmission. only diffrence is the LSD


[Modified by Kamin, 3:22 PM 12/18/2002]

 

power wise how much does the stock LSD handle?? I will be N/A do i have any worries?

 

You're safe with either of the above options...

 

youll be fine NA

 

Thanks allot guys.

 

I didn't think the 98+ ITR tranny gears are the same as the B16's...

Someone correct me.

 

jdm itr transmissions have different 4th and 5th...to be specific gsr 4th and 5th gears.

http://www.hondaswap.com/articles/viewer.php?id=45

the above link is an article i wrote...to the best of my knowledge this information is accurate...

 

B-series Transmissions

In response to recent questions about different transmissions I think its important to shed some light into the ones available for our b-series motors. There are many differences between B-series transmissions and I've never found an article describing the positives and negatives of each unit. Below, you'll see transmission codes, the car it's found in, and whether or not it has factory LSD. It's important to realize that Honda didn't make it easy for us to distinguish between transmissions. For example, almost all transmissions found in Integra's are stamped S80. This includes the tall LS transmission and the ultra short JDM Type-R transmission. In some cases, the only way to determine which transmission you really have is to take it apart and count the number of teeth on the ring gear. Obviously, in most cases it's not practical to take your transmission apart to determine which one you have. To be safe when acquiring a transmission, you should identify the seller; try to identify the car and or motor it came with.

B16A (Cable), B16A2 (Hydro), B16A3(Hydro):
S4C, S80, Y80, Y21, Y1 (optional LSD)

As most of you know the B16A was featured in Japan between the years of 1989 through 2001. This engine has had several different transmissions mated to it causing some potential confusion.

First, it's important to realize that first generation B16A's came with cable transmissions. The Y1 came with optional factory LSD and should have LSD stamped on the transmission. Determining whether or not a transmission has LSD is very simple, just look into the differential and see if its opened or closed. For those not familiar with this, you'll either see a set of gears that form a closed cylinder, or you'll see an open differential with a bar splitting the middle.

Typically these transmissions have had weak synchro's in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gears with 3rd gears crunching the most. Its also worth noting that all of the transmissions minus the Y1 have very weak open differentials making it essential that you upgrade if your putting a lot of power to the ground.

As far as gearing, these transmissions are all pretty short. Here is a listing of the gear ratios and final drive, courtesy of http://www.bseries.net.

1st: 3.230
2nd: 2.105
3rd: 1.458
4th: 1.107
5th: 0.848
Reverse: 3.000
Final Drive: 4.400


In conclusion, this transmission is good for all motor and should bring between 500-700 if its hydraulic while cable transmissions are worth between 400-600. Please be careful that the transmission you're buying doesn't have bad synchro's because a lot of them have been beaten on and this is the first problem you'll have. Plus, if you're making a lot of power, 170 to the wheels, be prepared to replace your differential because these can be broken with regularity.

B16B (Hydraulic):
S4C (LSD)

The transmission found in the Civic Type R is highly sought after and very rare. Its gear ratio's are identical to that of the B16A's but has a stronger limited slip and dual synchro's in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gears. Expect to pay between 1000-1200 for a genuine CTR transmission because they're rare and well worth the price. Its also worth mentioning that these transmissions are Hydraulic type.

B17A1 (Cable):
YS1

This transmission is found on the rare "blacksheep" of b-series motors. The most important feature here is that its cable-type. This means you can bolt this into any 93 and older integra and 91 and older civic without having to change to hydraulic. The synchro's on this transmission are still considered weak, however the gearing is very good for all motor applications as its identical to the B16A transmissions. Finally, this transmission did not have factory LSD, so keep that in mind when someone is trying to tell you otherwise. Look to pay between 400-600 dollars for this transmission, although its going to be difficult to find and usually when you do, there is something wrong with it.

B18A1 (Cable):
YS1

Again, you'll see how Honda didn't help us out any with the stamping on this transmission. These transmissions however, are much different in there gearing. This transmission has a longer first and second gear with slightly longer 3rd and 4th gears. The final drive is still 4.40:1 making this a possibility for all motor applications, but not your best choice. You'll be able to find this transmission in 90-93 Integra's and they're all cable-type. The prices for these should range between 200-400 for clean, good working units. Paying anymore is pointless, as these transmissions are everywhere.

B18B1 (Hydro):
S80/Y80

This is probably the easiest b-series transmission to find because it's found in every non-VTEC 94-01 Integra. Most notably, this transmission is the longest of all b-series transmissions and has the weakest synchro's and weakest differential. The final drive is 4.266:1 and each of the gears is longer compared to its B16A counterparts. For boost, a lot of people like the gearing of this transmission, plus gas mileage is great and they're very cheap. Look to pay no more than 500 for a clean LS tranny because they're everywhere.

Here is a look at the Specs.

1st: 3.230
2nd: 1.90
3rd: 1.269
4th: 0.966
5th: 0.714
Reverse: 3.000
Final Drive: 4.266:1


B18C:
S80/Y80 (Optional LSD)

The transmission found in JDM GSR's is very popular and overall an excellent transmission. For all motor and boost applicatiosn this transmission has excellent gearing and a stronger differential compared to its B16A and B18B counterparts. The transmissions with LSD should have "LSD" stamped on the casing and to make sure, inspect the differential and use the parameters I described before to identify whether or not the transmission really has LSD. Look to pay between 700-1200 for this transmission depending on whether its LSD equipped. Also worth mentioning, these transmissions are all hydraulic.

Here is a look at the specs:

1st: 3.230
2nd: 1.900
3rd: 1.360
4th: 1.034
5th: 0.787
Reverse: 3.000
Final Drive: 4.400


B18C1:
Y80

This transmission is found in all USDM GSR's. Although LSD was not offered these transmissions are still highly sought after because of their stronger differentials and optimal gearing. For those not interested in ultra-short gearing this transmission provides the perfect balance between acceleration and top end. Look to pay around 700-1000 for these transmissions.

The specs are the same as above:

1st: 3.230
2nd: 1.900
3rd: 1.360
4th: 1.034
5th: 0.787
Reverse: 3.000
Final Drive: 4.400


B18C5:
S80 (Helical LSD)

This transmission is one of the best B-series transmissions Honda has offered in its vehicles. Every gear has dual synchro's and the gearing is perfect for all motor applications. Plus, LSD is standard and will be stamped on the housing. Look to spend between 1200-1400 for these transmissions because of their quality, LSD, age and gear ratio's. Finally, if there is some question about whether or not you're S80 has 4.4 final drive or 4.7 final drive you can check the transmission housing. The code "4jhd" means 4.4 final drive was offered as original equipment, while "ne3" signifies 4.78 final drive.

The specs are below:

1st: 3.230
2nd: 2.105
3rd: 1.458
4th: 1.107
5th: 0.848
Reverse: 3.000
Final Drive: 4.400


B18C (JDM Type R):
S80 (Helical LSD)

JDM Type R transmissions are the best for all motor applications where acceleration is emphasized most. All 98 and up JDM Type R transmissions came with 4.785 final drive with the same 1st, 2nd, 3rd gears as the USDM Type R. To make highway driving more tolerable, the 4th and 5th gears are the same as GSR transmissions. Look to spend between 1400-1600 for these transmissions because of their final drive and rarity.

Here is a look at the specs:

1st: 3.230
2nd: 2.105
3rd: 1.458
4th: 1.034
5th: 0.787
Reverse: 3.000
Final Drive: 4.785

 

thats really long but i know what your saying, i should have clarified
the JDM 98-01 R has a diffrent 4th 5th and final drive, but USDM is all the same as the CTR/b16

 

sweeet honda-tech rocks thanks guys.

 

The 98+ JDM ITR trannies will be labelled "N3E"...not 'ne3.' The USDM ones are labelled "J4D."

I have a Euro 98 ITR tranny (4.785 FD) and it is labelled 'E3D.' I believe it also has the shorter 4th and 5th gears (1.107, 0.848), but I am not sure as I don't have it in the car yet.

I'll be sure and post it up when I find out.

Ask 'austrian type r' ...his Euro 98+ ITR trannies are labelled E3D as well...he was the one who also told me about the shorter 4th and 5th.

 

what a well written tranny report.
thanks for the info,
I am happy to have more knowledge now! thanks Chet!

 

You sure this tranny have the 4.40 final drive? Not that i'm not believing you but always thought that it was 4.26. Hell, if it's the case, good for me

Anyone else can confirm this statement? I'd like to get a more opinions.

 

So a B16B has a 4.4 final drive?

 

You can't always tell the car the tranny came from by looking at the number on it. S4c tranny also came in the 99-00 B16a here in the states, but was exactly like the Y21 tranny that came here in 94-95 in the Del Sol VTEC. The S4c found in the US Si is completely different than the one found in the CTR.

S80 is also found in newer GSRs in the states, which has the same numbering as the LS, S80. You hvae to know the car the tranny came from, or have a tranny exatly like the one you are looking for to count the number of turns of the input shaft vs the axle in different gears, then do some math....

 

the b18a transmission may have 4.26 final drive. personally, i've never used this transmission so i'm going by what i've read. it would seem to make sense that honda give the b16a and b18a the same final drive in this generation of cable transmissions, although i'm sure someone on here can correct me if i'm wrong.

sorry about the incorrect information if thats the case...and i'll try to find out on my own as well.

 

It would make sense. Some B18B users that tried my car told me that my tranny felt shorter than their B18B's tranny....but who knows

 

according to bseries.net the b18a tranny does have the 4.4 FD


very good info about the synchros though

 

yes, the R transmissions are the toughest. this makes sense, as these transmissions from the factory were dealing with the most powerful motors.

and its easy to see why honda gave the b16a transmissions such weak open differentials...i mean with 100-110 torque to the wheels the differential doesn't have to be that strong.