Got got my car aligned and I just want to make sure this looks OK. It's a 97 Civic Hatch. I requested 1/16 toe out per side, 1/8 total and I do not have a camber kit (just the rear washer trick). What do you think? Any suggestions?

Front

camber Left -1.7 Right -1.4
caster Left 2.7 Right 2.5
toe Left -.16 Right -.16
total toe -.32

Rear

camber Left -1.6 Right -1.3
toe Left -.00 Right -.01



[Modified by 6ghatch, 3:08 PM 9/18/2002]

 

If your total toe is .32, you need to go back and get the front re-done. A 1/16 total toe out should be .08

 

dont you guys mean 1/16 and 1/8? not the same as .16 and .08.

 

So I have over 1/8 toe out per side?

Edit: so I should shoot for somewhere between -.04-.08 per side and -.08,-.16 total toe out?

factory max spec is -.04 per side


[Modified by 6ghatch, 3:22 PM 9/18/2002]

 

{ dont you guys mean 1/16 and 1/8? not the same as .16 and .08. }


As a special education teacher (science, math, history)I am shocked and appalled!
Fractions and decimals do not simply relate to one another like that....

Remember 1/4 of an inch is .25 Use money as a reference. If 25 cents is 1/4 of a dollar then it could be written $0.25.

Another simple way to do this is to take your fraction. Divide the numerator (top number) and divide it by the denominator (bottom number). 1/8 of an inch if you divide 1 by 8 will show up on the calculator as .125. If you have -.32 for the front you have over a 1/4 inch total toe out. I'll admit I run -.22 total toe out, but if you didn't intend for that to happen then you need to go back and get it dialed back in. The number you may be looking for is -.06 to -.08 per side.

And shame to the alignment guy for not knowing this either. It could be dangerous for the "Point A to Point B driver" to get some wild *** setting. Holy **** that's scary.

Anthony "Mario" Crea


[Modified by honda93, 11:49 AM 9/18/2002]

 

As someone who works around an alignment machine five days a week, I'll trust myself and my techs

 

While that was a good math lesson, let's all remember that the toe measurements of -0.16 on each side are in *degrees* not in inches.

I forgot even the most basic trig long ago, but if you use that basic trig you will find out that o-man is correct, 1/8" is about equal to 0.16 degrees of toe.

Scott

 

That is why I posted this up. I got the alignment sheet back and the first thing I questioned was the conversion. I know how to convert fractions to decimals! But I don't know how to work an alignment machine. That is why I questioned these specs!


[Modified by 6ghatch, 3:05 PM 9/18/2002]

 

(While that was a good math lesson, let's all remember that the toe measurements of -0.16 on each side are in *degrees* not in inches.
I forgot even the most basic trig long ago, but if you use that basic trig you will find out that o-man is correct, 1/8" is about equal to 0.16 degrees of toe.

Scott)


i'm lost here. how did you trig that out.
|\
| \
|_ \
|_|_\
.062
how did you get the angle. don't you need at least one other side or one other angle, this is basic trig to me



[Modified by Sloth, 2:43 PM 9/18/2002]


[Modified by Sloth, 2:43 PM 9/18/2002]

 

You sure? That's pretty confusing, since the shop manual specifies toe in mm or inches.

 

Guys, trust me on this. If the specs are written like they came off the printout on the machine, the car has WAY too much toe out; something between 1/4-1/2 inch. My Hunter machine has a conversion chart sitting next to its printer for fractions, MM, and decimals. Take the car back to the alinment shop and have them correct it. If they have any questions, have them call me at 919-942-4413 between 7:30am and 5pm eastern time of course.

 

that's defenitly too much, ur car will understeer like a bitch on slow corners..

jsut go back and get it to the real 1/16 to out per side in front

maybe 1/32 toe out epr side in the rear would be enough as ur car is not very long!!

also keep in mind that when u dropped the car, u also changed the geometry of the suspension so when the outside will compress on a turn, u will get even more toe out but the inside will go back to 0 or toe in for some time depending on ur body roll
this is somehting that a lot of people forget to thing of ( bump steer VS height of toe control links in front ) and it cuases alot of weird stuff to happen


also don't forget to reset ur factory bushings if you are still on them ( that is if you haven't change the bushings

 

Won't understeer, will actually turn in VERY quickly...but on the street will burn the tires to the ground and be VERY dangerous and twitchy...Those higway tractor trailer ruts in the middle of ever road could literally turn the car sideways if hit wrong...

As Mario said......08 total out up front...0 in the back...You can run .04 total out in the rear if you want some more oversteer. But with anything bigger than a stock rear bar, you'll want zero..

Trust him...he makes me do his perfect, every time...(down to the hundreth)

Jeff

 

Thanks Jeff for making me sound all ****! Bitch

Jeff didn't point out that the Hunter can do the measuring in inches or degrees. I figured all my calculations in decimal inches as they were more accurate than fractions.

Anthony "Mario" Crea

 

Thanks Oscar! I'm going over later today for them to fix it. I'm thinking either -.06 or -.04 per side.

 

.04 each side
0 in the rear

I would also say a little less camber in the rear , around 1.2 or so

I see that you have 1.6L / 1.3R .......... we need to get your car on the scales Chris

did you check the alignment with you in the car ?


[Modified by Doctor CorteZ, 4:52 PM 9/19/2002]


[Modified by Doctor CorteZ, 4:52 PM 9/19/2002]

 

Well, I just got back and they put it at -.06 per side and -.12 total toe out. For now this should work.

Jamie your right about the corner weighting, I would love to get it done but I don't know of anyone around here who has a clue what they are doing. The alignment was done at Tire's Plus.
-and no, I was not in the car.


[Modified by 6ghatch, 5:32 PM 9/19/2002]

 

well I havent ever run anything over max factory spec , it may eat tires and follow the road real bad

could they not put .04 on each side on it ?

get your car down to Ben's we'll cornerweight it on a Saturday or something.....

:EDIT - does it feel any better Chris ? quicker turn in ?

BTW - Tim,Mal and Jay Smith are going to the Auto-x today ,should be hooked


[Modified by Doctor CorteZ, 8:27 PM 9/19/2002]

 

Well, the full story is that this is the second place I got it aligned. The first place did it on an old machine and did not give me a print out (shady). The alignment felt like crap and I knew something was not right, so I took it to Tire's Plus. The toe settings from the first place were a joke, like -.18 left and -.23 right!!! (this I found out from the base printout at Tire's Plus)

So basically it feels much better then before. But I know there is still a lot of room for improvement.



[Modified by 6ghatch, 3:58 PM 9/19/2002]

 

1/16" toe out up front each side
no more no less.

thats what you want.