Spark Plugs and Oil Change
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From: tallafizzy, FL state
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (B18C-IVIC)
i use ngk's
http://www.monarchproductsinc....00483
as far as oil, pretty much any good synthethic brand,shell syn. is very good. i wouldnt recommend mobil 1.
http://www.monarchproductsinc....00483
as far as oil, pretty much any good synthethic brand,shell syn. is very good. i wouldnt recommend mobil 1.
Mad Scientist
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From: tallafizzy, FL state
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (rsbad454)
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Pasadena, CA, USA
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mmuller)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mmuller »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">nope, not any more...</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's an old, old discussion from before there were actual oil analysis results comparing Mobil 1 SuperSyn to the old Tri-Synthetic formulation.
Since that time, there have been many excellent analysis results from SuperSyn, in almost all cases superior to Tri-Synthetic.
In my case, lead (indicating bearing wear) improved from 35-45 ppm/10,000 miles to 19 ppm/10,000 miles when I switched to SuperSyn, despite the car being pushed harder on the SuperSyn interval. Most other people are seeing similar results.
That's an old, old discussion from before there were actual oil analysis results comparing Mobil 1 SuperSyn to the old Tri-Synthetic formulation.
Since that time, there have been many excellent analysis results from SuperSyn, in almost all cases superior to Tri-Synthetic.
In my case, lead (indicating bearing wear) improved from 35-45 ppm/10,000 miles to 19 ppm/10,000 miles when I switched to SuperSyn, despite the car being pushed harder on the SuperSyn interval. Most other people are seeing similar results.
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Mad Scientist
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From: tallafizzy, FL state
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (AllmotorJunkie)
so...mph6563 what the hell is that pic supossed to mean?first of all that thread is 4 months old if that is not old old. second you have no proof in what your saying, third you can use whatever oil YOU want to use, dont bash on me for not liking mobil1 anymore;mobil one is all i used to put in my car until that thread. dont tell me im wrong when you have nothing to back it up.
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Pasadena, CA, USA
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mmuller)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mmuller »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">first of all that thread is 4 months old if that is not old old.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You mean 16 months? It's 2003 where I live.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">second you have no proof in what your saying, third you can use whatever oil YOU want to use, dont bash on me for not liking mobil1 anymore;mobil one is all i used to put in my car until that thread. dont tell me im wrong when you have nothing to back it up.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Whatever. I have spectrographic oil analysis results for both oils in my car from Blackstone Labs, showing fewer wear metals from the SuperSyn than the Tri-Syn, even when the SuperSyn was driven harder. I posted them. So have plenty of other people on that same message board. If that's "nothing," then what have you got? Where's your lab results?
You mean 16 months? It's 2003 where I live.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">second you have no proof in what your saying, third you can use whatever oil YOU want to use, dont bash on me for not liking mobil1 anymore;mobil one is all i used to put in my car until that thread. dont tell me im wrong when you have nothing to back it up.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Whatever. I have spectrographic oil analysis results for both oils in my car from Blackstone Labs, showing fewer wear metals from the SuperSyn than the Tri-Syn, even when the SuperSyn was driven harder. I posted them. So have plenty of other people on that same message board. If that's "nothing," then what have you got? Where's your lab results?
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Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mmuller)
i use to use mobil 1 when i used synthetic and never had any problems, since imo synthetic is really just a waste of money I go with regular castrol gt (the one in the green and white bottle)
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From: tallafizzy, FL state
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mph6563)
mph6563, then post them, if your right i would like to see. i dont have lab results....if i would be able to analyze oils i wouldn't drive an integra.im going for what the post sayd.DO not bash me unless you post your analysis
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From: Pasadena, CA, USA
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mmuller)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mmuller »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">mph6563, then post them, if your right i would like to see. i dont have lab results....if i would be able to analyze oils i wouldn't drive an integra.im going for what the post sayd.DO not bash me unless you post your analysis</TD></TR></TABLE>
I did. Follow the link in my original post. That's what it's there for. (But I described the most relevant part, lead ppm, in my post, anyway.) There are lots of other analyses from other people's cars there as well; it's not just my car--the trend is there.
I did. Follow the link in my original post. That's what it's there for. (But I described the most relevant part, lead ppm, in my post, anyway.) There are lots of other analyses from other people's cars there as well; it's not just my car--the trend is there.
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From: tallafizzy, FL state
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mph6563)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mph6563 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I did. Follow the link in my original post. That's what it's there for. (But I described the most relevant part, lead ppm, in my post, anyway.) There are lots of other analyses from other people's cars there as well; it's not just my car--the trend is there.</TD></TR></TABLE>
so i know your saying that SuperSyn is better that trysyn, what about compared to other brands?
I did. Follow the link in my original post. That's what it's there for. (But I described the most relevant part, lead ppm, in my post, anyway.) There are lots of other analyses from other people's cars there as well; it's not just my car--the trend is there.</TD></TR></TABLE>
so i know your saying that SuperSyn is better that trysyn, what about compared to other brands?
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Pasadena, CA, USA
Re: Spark Plugs and Oil Change (mmuller)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mmuller »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
so i know your saying that SuperSyn is better that trysyn, what about compared to other brands?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
In general, all of the true (PAO/ester, aka Group IV/V) synthetics perform quite well in used oil analyses. This includes Mobil 1, Amsoil synthetic, and Redline. The jury is out, to some extent, on Redline. Many of the analyses show more wear metals than M1, for example, but some people claim that it's because Redline is primarily ester-based, which results in a strong detergent action. Thus, they say, for the first couple of runs on Redline, you get junk in the oil from it cleaning old deposits. On the plus side, Redline has tons of moly, which is an effective antiwear agent. I couldn't say for sure that any of these oils is better than the others. Some engines will like one better than the others.
Among the dino oils, Chevron Supreme, Castrol GTX, Pennzoil, and others consistently do well. The dino oils will tend to deteriorate in measurable ways (viscosity, ability to neutralize acids) faster than the synthetics. If you'd be doing very short (3-4,000 mile) drains on your oil, it's not really clear whether synthetics are beneficial, especially for normally driven vehicles. It is pretty clear that synths win for long drains, or in highly stressed applications, like turbocharged cars.
Then there are the Group III "semi-synthetic" oils, which include just about every other US-market "synthetic" from the big names (Castrol Syntec, Valvoline Synpower, etc.). These oils are not build from the ground up like Group IV/V oils, and tend to fall somewhere between dino and IV/V oils in their properties. I don't know a lot about them, because most oil analysis junkies aren't too interested in them. In part, because they fall closer to the M1 price range than the dino price range, and in part out of anger for Castrol diluting the meaning of the word "synthetic." (They were the first to use it to mean this type of oil.) In Germany, for example, these oils cannot be marketed as "full synthetic."
There was concern at first that M1 SuperSyn had become Group III (I think this was brought up in the discussion you linked to). This fear was without merit--it's still a PAO-based oil. The other concern in that discussion was that it was short on ZDDP and would have poor antiwear protection. That concern also has not been borne out; it looks like other additives, like moly, have more than made up for any ZDDP deficiency.
These are general conclusions I've drawn from reading people's analysis results as a hobby; don't take them as gospel. All I'm willing to say for sure is that M1 SuperSyn is better than M1 Tri-Syn in my engine, and for the time being I'll stick with it.
so i know your saying that SuperSyn is better that trysyn, what about compared to other brands?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
In general, all of the true (PAO/ester, aka Group IV/V) synthetics perform quite well in used oil analyses. This includes Mobil 1, Amsoil synthetic, and Redline. The jury is out, to some extent, on Redline. Many of the analyses show more wear metals than M1, for example, but some people claim that it's because Redline is primarily ester-based, which results in a strong detergent action. Thus, they say, for the first couple of runs on Redline, you get junk in the oil from it cleaning old deposits. On the plus side, Redline has tons of moly, which is an effective antiwear agent. I couldn't say for sure that any of these oils is better than the others. Some engines will like one better than the others.
Among the dino oils, Chevron Supreme, Castrol GTX, Pennzoil, and others consistently do well. The dino oils will tend to deteriorate in measurable ways (viscosity, ability to neutralize acids) faster than the synthetics. If you'd be doing very short (3-4,000 mile) drains on your oil, it's not really clear whether synthetics are beneficial, especially for normally driven vehicles. It is pretty clear that synths win for long drains, or in highly stressed applications, like turbocharged cars.
Then there are the Group III "semi-synthetic" oils, which include just about every other US-market "synthetic" from the big names (Castrol Syntec, Valvoline Synpower, etc.). These oils are not build from the ground up like Group IV/V oils, and tend to fall somewhere between dino and IV/V oils in their properties. I don't know a lot about them, because most oil analysis junkies aren't too interested in them. In part, because they fall closer to the M1 price range than the dino price range, and in part out of anger for Castrol diluting the meaning of the word "synthetic." (They were the first to use it to mean this type of oil.) In Germany, for example, these oils cannot be marketed as "full synthetic."
There was concern at first that M1 SuperSyn had become Group III (I think this was brought up in the discussion you linked to). This fear was without merit--it's still a PAO-based oil. The other concern in that discussion was that it was short on ZDDP and would have poor antiwear protection. That concern also has not been borne out; it looks like other additives, like moly, have more than made up for any ZDDP deficiency.
These are general conclusions I've drawn from reading people's analysis results as a hobby; don't take them as gospel. All I'm willing to say for sure is that M1 SuperSyn is better than M1 Tri-Syn in my engine, and for the time being I'll stick with it.
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