SOMEONE PLEASE help me out with my D16!!!!!!!!
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 128
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From: AL, USA
SOMEONE PLEASE help me out with my D16!!!!!!!!
Ok,,,here's my problem. First off, i'm not the smartest person when it comes to the inside of my 98 civic EX. But, i do have a pretty good grasp on things, and have got the money to do it. SO, my question is THIS:
What would be ANYONE'S recommendation to nicely hop-up my SOHC d16. I've by all my friends to go with a turbo, or a whole engine swap to an SI motor. But i don't wanna spend $3000 or MORE.
So, SOMEONE with some experience with the d16's tell me if this package i'm fixing to go with is actually gonna make a difference, AND how much it might make. Or, am i just simply wasting my time on my Lil' ol SOHC motor?
I was going with :
The complete Wet Zex Nitrous kit
The Jet performance chip that you have to send your CPU to them to do
And a set of AEM Pulleys.
So, i can get all of this around $1300...and how much of a difference will all this make on my 98 EX??
ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED! THANKS!
What would be ANYONE'S recommendation to nicely hop-up my SOHC d16. I've by all my friends to go with a turbo, or a whole engine swap to an SI motor. But i don't wanna spend $3000 or MORE.
So, SOMEONE with some experience with the d16's tell me if this package i'm fixing to go with is actually gonna make a difference, AND how much it might make. Or, am i just simply wasting my time on my Lil' ol SOHC motor?
I was going with :
The complete Wet Zex Nitrous kit
The Jet performance chip that you have to send your CPU to them to do
And a set of AEM Pulleys.
So, i can get all of this around $1300...and how much of a difference will all this make on my 98 EX??
ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED! THANKS!
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
turbo is a bit pricey, and more unreliable, but makes good power, is upgradable, and makes cool sounds 
hehe
nitrous is very cheap, make about the same power as a turbo, and does not wear down your motor as fast *if properly installed and tuned*.
An engine swap is the best and most reliable way to make big power, but is more expensive than the other options.
If you're not going for big power, and don't wanna spend a lot of money, I would get an intake, header, exhaust, maybe pulleys, and a decent shot of nitrous.
Screw the chips, they're trash.
hehenitrous is very cheap, make about the same power as a turbo, and does not wear down your motor as fast *if properly installed and tuned*.
An engine swap is the best and most reliable way to make big power, but is more expensive than the other options.
If you're not going for big power, and don't wanna spend a lot of money, I would get an intake, header, exhaust, maybe pulleys, and a decent shot of nitrous.
Screw the chips, they're trash.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,665
Likes: 0
From: Tri Cities Diddy, IL
Re: (LudeyKrus)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LudeyKrus »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">turbo is a bit pricey, and more unreliable, but makes good power, is upgradable, and makes cool sounds hehe
nitrous is very cheap, make about the same power as a turbo, and does not wear down your motor as fast *if properly installed and tuned*.
An engine swap is the best and most reliable way to make big power, but is more expensive than the other options.
If you're not going for big power, and don't wanna spend a lot of money, I would get an intake, header, exhaust, maybe pulleys, and a decent shot of nitrous.
Screw the chips, they're trash.</TD></TR></TABLE>
turbo is more unreliable than nitrous? hah
hehenitrous is very cheap, make about the same power as a turbo, and does not wear down your motor as fast *if properly installed and tuned*.
An engine swap is the best and most reliable way to make big power, but is more expensive than the other options.
If you're not going for big power, and don't wanna spend a lot of money, I would get an intake, header, exhaust, maybe pulleys, and a decent shot of nitrous.
Screw the chips, they're trash.</TD></TR></TABLE>
turbo is more unreliable than nitrous? hah
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 319
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From: USA
Re: SOMEONE PLEASE help me out with my D16!!!!!!!! (Dave01)
There are a few guys here in Seattle that are using the greddy turbo and laying down good track number. One of them trip the clock at 13.9 with a stock motor and with basic bolt on's.
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Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (BoostRotter)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BoostRotter »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
turbo is more unreliable than nitrous? hah</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yep, you heard me right!
Most of the uneducated crowd will say otherwise, but looking into things will give you a truthful answer.......
....and besides, what answer would you expect from a turbo civic owner?
Nitrous is your best bet. You will have a completely reliable all-motor car 90% of the time, and you will only incur the extra wear of pushing higher HP when you're spraying, no other time. W/ a turbo'd car, you are always beating on your car, even if you keep it out of boost most of the time, it's going to wear more quickly.
Turbo cars also demand more care, much more careful tuning, and many more expensive parts to do the same thing. But turbo's DO have some great advantages you just don't get w/ nitrous....
It really just comes down to your power goals and your budget.
Pick two, and only two: speed, reliability, cheap
and I'll tell you what's best for you.
turbo is more unreliable than nitrous? hah</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yep, you heard me right!
Most of the uneducated crowd will say otherwise, but looking into things will give you a truthful answer.......
....and besides, what answer would you expect from a turbo civic owner?
Nitrous is your best bet. You will have a completely reliable all-motor car 90% of the time, and you will only incur the extra wear of pushing higher HP when you're spraying, no other time. W/ a turbo'd car, you are always beating on your car, even if you keep it out of boost most of the time, it's going to wear more quickly.
Turbo cars also demand more care, much more careful tuning, and many more expensive parts to do the same thing. But turbo's DO have some great advantages you just don't get w/ nitrous....
It really just comes down to your power goals and your budget.
Pick two, and only two: speed, reliability, cheap
and I'll tell you what's best for you.
Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,347
Likes: 0
From: NL, CT, cuba
Re: (RyanCivic2000)
The jet chip is generally garbage. I'd go with a greddy kit, yes, you can get them for 1300-1400, NEW, and cheaper used.
Bottle-power is boring. I like power that doesn't need to be refilled...
-PHiZ
Bottle-power is boring. I like power that doesn't need to be refilled...
-PHiZ
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
From: Media, PA, usa
Re: (PHiZ)
jet chip sucks. I got one and they couldn't tune it for ****. car still doesn't run right. Might I sudgest a gude head kit. I got one for my car same year and such and it made a difference. I you can install it yourself you can have cams, bored t-body, ported polished head milled to add compression, port matched and polished intake manifold for around 1500. Throw in a header and intake and the car will be just fine. and some juice down the road and you could have high 12's with slicks. All this on your stock fuel system
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,820
Likes: 12
From: schooling kids in ny, usa
Re: (RyanCivic2000)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RyanCivic2000 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">LudeyKrus is right on point with that reply. </TD></TR></TABLE>
i agree
</TD></TR></TABLE>i agree
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Posts: n/a
Re: (LudeyKrus)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LudeyKrus »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Yep, you heard me right!
Most of the uneducated crowd will say otherwise, but looking into things will give you a truthful answer.......
....and besides, what answer would you expect from a turbo civic owner?
Nitrous is your best bet. You will have a completely reliable all-motor car 90% of the time, and you will only incur the extra wear of pushing higher HP when you're spraying, no other time. W/ a turbo'd car, you are always beating on your car, even if you keep it out of boost most of the time, it's going to wear more quickly.
Turbo cars also demand more care, much more careful tuning, and many more expensive parts to do the same thing. But turbo's DO have some great advantages you just don't get w/ nitrous....
It really just comes down to your power goals and your budget.
Pick two, and only two: speed, reliability, cheap
and I'll tell you what's best for you.</TD></TR></TABLE>
What are you talking about??? How are you putting more wear and tear on your car with a turbo when you keep out of boost?? If you shift at 3k your not going to boost much.
Nitrous or turbo, it really doesn't matter. The amount of HP it makes is what matters. Turbos require more tuning because they make power, easily.
Maybe you should get a turbo before you talk......?
Yep, you heard me right!
Most of the uneducated crowd will say otherwise, but looking into things will give you a truthful answer.......
....and besides, what answer would you expect from a turbo civic owner?
Nitrous is your best bet. You will have a completely reliable all-motor car 90% of the time, and you will only incur the extra wear of pushing higher HP when you're spraying, no other time. W/ a turbo'd car, you are always beating on your car, even if you keep it out of boost most of the time, it's going to wear more quickly.
Turbo cars also demand more care, much more careful tuning, and many more expensive parts to do the same thing. But turbo's DO have some great advantages you just don't get w/ nitrous....
It really just comes down to your power goals and your budget.
Pick two, and only two: speed, reliability, cheap
and I'll tell you what's best for you.</TD></TR></TABLE>
What are you talking about??? How are you putting more wear and tear on your car with a turbo when you keep out of boost?? If you shift at 3k your not going to boost much.
Nitrous or turbo, it really doesn't matter. The amount of HP it makes is what matters. Turbos require more tuning because they make power, easily.
Maybe you should get a turbo before you talk......?
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (David555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by David555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">don't get any ****** pulleys upgrade, thats a waste of timing and money</TD></TR></TABLE>
this guy is amusing
The amount of horsepower does nothing in terms of reliability, in the sense you're using it. Really, go read up some on forced induction before spouting off like you're trying to.
Turbo's are harder to tune because they build boost throughout the rpm's, therefore more and more fuel must be progressively fed into the motor as the rpm's rise. It's very easy to get a rich or lean "spot" when trying to tune. w/ nitrous, you just turn a nut to bump fuel pressure, or just swap out a jet.
I've been around more turbo cars than you've prob. read about in magazines. If you're using a well-sized turbo, you should be boosting around 3k....and you do generate a bit of boost while in low rpm's.
this guy is amusing
The amount of horsepower does nothing in terms of reliability, in the sense you're using it. Really, go read up some on forced induction before spouting off like you're trying to.
Turbo's are harder to tune because they build boost throughout the rpm's, therefore more and more fuel must be progressively fed into the motor as the rpm's rise. It's very easy to get a rich or lean "spot" when trying to tune. w/ nitrous, you just turn a nut to bump fuel pressure, or just swap out a jet.
I've been around more turbo cars than you've prob. read about in magazines. If you're using a well-sized turbo, you should be boosting around 3k....and you do generate a bit of boost while in low rpm's.
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
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From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (David555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by David555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Nitrous or turbo, it really doesn't matter. The amount of HP it makes is what matters. </TD></TR></TABLE>
It does matter. Ever thought out a supercharged motor? Let's take the H22 for instance, since i'm more experienced w/ these motors.
Nitrous produced horsepower easier because it doesn't have to fight against heat that it produces itself. Nitrous cools the intake charge tremendously, and produces no extra heat. Nitrous is very efficient in the way it makes power, since it's forcing in pure oxygen and fuel instead of just compressed air.
Turbo's and superchargers use compressors to force air into the intake. There's two problems w/ this. First, as air is compressed, it tends to heat up a good deal. Second, the ultra high speeds the compressor reaches to force the air in causes a great deal of heat from friction. These cause the air to become very hot before going into the motor. In order to fight this, you must use a properly-sized charger to keep w/i the charger's thermal efficiency range; i.e.- where it actually makes power instead of just blowing in hot air and losing power.
The best way to cool down the air is to use an intercooler between the charger and the intake manifold. The only practical one to use on the street is the air/air intercooler, which usually causes a drop in pressure across it. If it's significant enough of a drop, the charger must work harder to produce the same amount of boost, therefore heating the air more.
This added heat from the charger is exactly why JRSC's for the H22 are notorious for blowing motors "out of the box"; a standalone FMU and good tuning are necessary to make the motor reliable, even at 6 psi. It's because it's unavoidable that these things make so much heat; it's just the nature of the blower. It makes great power, it's just making the power efficiently that becomes a problem.
As you can see, w/ chargers it becomes more complex to make horsepower, when compared to nitrous. You must also take into account tuning. A well-tuned nitrous motor making 300 whp is going to be much more reliable than a poorly-tuned 300whp turbo motor....obviously.
Settle down, don't take everything so personally, and try to learn something from this schooling; that's why we're here on H-T
Nitrous or turbo, it really doesn't matter. The amount of HP it makes is what matters. </TD></TR></TABLE>
It does matter. Ever thought out a supercharged motor? Let's take the H22 for instance, since i'm more experienced w/ these motors.
Nitrous produced horsepower easier because it doesn't have to fight against heat that it produces itself. Nitrous cools the intake charge tremendously, and produces no extra heat. Nitrous is very efficient in the way it makes power, since it's forcing in pure oxygen and fuel instead of just compressed air.
Turbo's and superchargers use compressors to force air into the intake. There's two problems w/ this. First, as air is compressed, it tends to heat up a good deal. Second, the ultra high speeds the compressor reaches to force the air in causes a great deal of heat from friction. These cause the air to become very hot before going into the motor. In order to fight this, you must use a properly-sized charger to keep w/i the charger's thermal efficiency range; i.e.- where it actually makes power instead of just blowing in hot air and losing power.
The best way to cool down the air is to use an intercooler between the charger and the intake manifold. The only practical one to use on the street is the air/air intercooler, which usually causes a drop in pressure across it. If it's significant enough of a drop, the charger must work harder to produce the same amount of boost, therefore heating the air more.
This added heat from the charger is exactly why JRSC's for the H22 are notorious for blowing motors "out of the box"; a standalone FMU and good tuning are necessary to make the motor reliable, even at 6 psi. It's because it's unavoidable that these things make so much heat; it's just the nature of the blower. It makes great power, it's just making the power efficiently that becomes a problem.
As you can see, w/ chargers it becomes more complex to make horsepower, when compared to nitrous. You must also take into account tuning. A well-tuned nitrous motor making 300 whp is going to be much more reliable than a poorly-tuned 300whp turbo motor....obviously.
Settle down, don't take everything so personally, and try to learn something from this schooling; that's why we're here on H-T
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (turbod96ex)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbod96ex »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">jet chip sucks. </TD></TR></TABLE>
and yes, these things suck. all they do is advance the ignition curves...basically. It will produce a slightly stronger motor, like a few horsepower maybe, but you can't use them when doing anything major...i.e-nitrous, turbo, supercharger, etc....
if you're gonna screw w/ the ecu, get a piggyback, like a AFC, or a standalone and get it tuned. those generic chips are not optimized for you specific car.
and yes, these things suck. all they do is advance the ignition curves...basically. It will produce a slightly stronger motor, like a few horsepower maybe, but you can't use them when doing anything major...i.e-nitrous, turbo, supercharger, etc....
if you're gonna screw w/ the ecu, get a piggyback, like a AFC, or a standalone and get it tuned. those generic chips are not optimized for you specific car.
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (PHiZ)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PHiZ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I dont' think ludeykris is giving you very good information on alot of things, do some more research.
-PHiZ</TD></TR></TABLE>
please tell me what you think different.
-PHiZ</TD></TR></TABLE>
please tell me what you think different.
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (PHiZ)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PHiZ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I dont' think ludeykris is giving you very good information on alot of things, do some more research.
-PHiZ</TD></TR></TABLE>
come on, share the knowledge!
-PHiZ</TD></TR></TABLE>
come on, share the knowledge!
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 405
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From: Minot, ND, USA
Re: (LudeyKrus)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LudeyKrus »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> and try to learn something from this schooling; that's why we're here on H-T </TD></TR></TABLE>
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,334
Likes: 1
From: Raleigh, NC
Re: (FourceFed)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FourceFed »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
turbo is more unreliable than nitrous? hah</TD></TR></TABLE>
Turbo is NOT unreliable as long as you do your maintenance, don't abuse your setup, and ave good tuning. Anyone who tells you otherwise does'nt know a damn thing. There are turbo trucks that run millions of miles on a fully spooled turbo all damn day long.
turbo is more unreliable than nitrous? hah</TD></TR></TABLE>
Turbo is NOT unreliable as long as you do your maintenance, don't abuse your setup, and ave good tuning. Anyone who tells you otherwise does'nt know a damn thing. There are turbo trucks that run millions of miles on a fully spooled turbo all damn day long.
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,768
Likes: 1
From: Flowery Branch, Ga
Re: (Ricey McRicerton)
true, but those trucks were built to be turbo'd. Hondas were not.
We are talking about throwing some sort of power adder onto a mostly stock civic motor. It is not built, and more than likely will not be professionally tuned. In this case, there's a lot more room for error in a turbo setup than w/ a nitrous setup, and w/ normal driving the turbo motor will not last as long and will require more TLC than a nitrous motor, simply b/c the motor was never intended to take either.
We are talking about throwing some sort of power adder onto a mostly stock civic motor. It is not built, and more than likely will not be professionally tuned. In this case, there's a lot more room for error in a turbo setup than w/ a nitrous setup, and w/ normal driving the turbo motor will not last as long and will require more TLC than a nitrous motor, simply b/c the motor was never intended to take either.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,334
Likes: 1
From: Raleigh, NC
Re: (LudeyKrus)
I would agree to what you have to say with very little argument. The only thing that I would have to disagree with, is that with a turbo, you are more concious of engine maintnence, so therefore you would be more likely to take better care of it. Plus, I have a turbo so I have to stick up for it. True, that the motors from Honda were not designed for turbo, as the motors in the trucks are, but there are members on this board who have run 12psi on a 15g kit for over a year with no problems whatsoever. It all depends on the condition of the motor and how well you take care of it.
Edit: Nice sig buddy.
True, that the motors from Honda were not designed for turbo, as the motors in the trucks are, but there are members on this board who have run 12psi on a 15g kit for over a year with no problems whatsoever. It all depends on the condition of the motor and how well you take care of it.Edit: Nice sig buddy.