Just searched the archives and read the two posts about it, but they both failed to answer a question I've had for a long time. Through countless hours of research, I haven't found a specific yes or no to point me in the right direction on this, so, I turn to the enlightened of Honda Tech for possible answers.

Is there a way to adapt a FI propane injection setup (stoicheometric ratio & flow-rate based on boost PSI) to a N/A, high-compression motor, relegated to either input from the MAF sensor or a broad-band oxygen sensor? I'm quite shocked that more high-comp and boosting hondas haven't taken advantage of propane injection as it drastically chills the intake charge, adds a hellofalotta torque and acts as 104-140 octane depending on what you're filling up with.

Well, I'm going to continue doing research on this but would love input to help me out. A naturally-aspirated application would be a great, simple, bolton, cheap modification that would drastically lower ET's and make for a lot of fun.

The most popular FI kit is $300 (cheap ) from Import Power Online.

TIA fellas

 

Would like to know a little more as well....
I know NUTHIN about the burning of propane. Hot/cold burn? Is it a dry burn like ether, or like diesel? How does the combustion of propane influence the gasoline combustion process? Do you just plumb it up and hope for the best?
Interesting, interesting.....

 

I'm gonna do some research on this.....

I'll be back.

 

burns great and keeps engine and intake temps down (charge temps at like -60F ). additive to gasoline, so it works wet just fine. there's a lot of information on this on the internet...do some research and maybe we can help each other out.

 

i never heard of propane injection on a gasoline engine.....does it work?

i do know that the turbo deisel guys love running that stuff and it makes a huge diffrence......

 

i have heard of some people with turbo-fords spraying propane, but i dont really know anything about it.

 

Yes propane can be used on gasoline engines.....and there are turbo applications that I know of using it. The turbo-diesels are the most common users of propane injection but you really should ask some of those guys their experiences. And I mean guys that have "really" used it, not the fools that just have it installed for bragging rights. I've seen alot of it..........and I wouldn't touch it unless I was desperate. I work for a major diesel engine manufacturer, and yes we are awhere and test those sort of things.

Remeber that propane is a fuel...not an oxidizer like N2O.


[Modified by SLPR, 3:39 PM 11/22/2002]

 

Which is why I'd like to get something like this for my turbo setup on the ITR.
I'm definately interested, and I think Big Moose has some input on this subject ...

 

For FI applications, there's a $300 kit from Import Power Online that bolts on and makes a lot of power. It's rather safe and sprays dependent on boost pressure

 

Hi Zig!

Good to hear from you again. Then Grand National guys have been messing with propane for a bit longer than the import scene. I couldn't find my good url's on the propane, but this one will get folks started. http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/sho...5&pagenumber=1 (the problem when you use multiple 'puters in multiple locations, and you can't remember which one has the blasted data on it.)

My personal belief is that propane and high boost (18+psi) go together. It is a most satisfactory octane booster, but carries the complexity of an additional fuel system. In N/A systems you have to deal with the gaseous propane displacing good old burnable air, so there is a trade off. It may well have a place N/A if compression ratios increase near 2 points above current levels.

Don't overestimate the cooling effects. Liquid propane injection is tempramental because of flash vaporization and mixing anomalies. If you start introducing cylinder to cylinder air fuel ratio differences of significance you are again hurting yourself. Gaseous injection (current technique for which commercial kits are available) won't cool the intake charge to any appreciable degree.

Good luck! Propane is a tool to add to the go fast kit.

Regards,
BigMoose

PS: Sorry for the delay in reply, I was out of town for a couple of days.

 

what if you combined a N2 kit with a propane kit so that they automatically counter ballanced.....???? no worrying about rich/lean, it would just be one hell of a shot!
on the other hand, I could be way off... It just seemed like it might work mixing air and fuel before the combustion chamber.
anyone?

sohc

 

Thanks Moose!

I haven't been able to convince my tuner of the benefits as yet.
Just wait till we reach the limits on pump gas.

 

I did a quick search on this stuff ( at work )
My problem with it right now would be the fact that propane will have it's "sweet spot" just like 14.7:1 for gasoline. Would displace the air in an NA engine. AND it has less energy released for a given amount that gasoline(which would explain the effective octane).
Considering these factors, wouldn't water injection accomplish relatively the same, with less complexity and cost?
Not trying to shoot holes in the idea, just playing devils advocate.
Chris

 

If I'd need to compromise between the two, I'd run an alcohol mix as water injection.
If I was into making all available power I'd have to go with propane and high boost!

Oh well, back to the drawing board.

 

This is a riceboy post, DIRep's computer wont let me log him out.

Sorry guys, been busy with my engine swap this weekend, but I'm gonna hit up the library before I leave for thanksgiving on wednesday and try to do some reading on my long trip to Podunk East Texas. It's a 6 hour drive since I'm riding with my aunt, she takes speed limits seriously, that gives plenty of time to read, and considering all of my relatives are the super down home back woods shotgun carrying Ford F350 driving rednecks, I will have time to read there too, since I don't have the ability to carry on a conversation about John Wayne with them.

 

yes you can use propane injection on a na motor. primary use of propane it to be able to boost more on pump fuel, ie a richer mixture.

if your na it'll cool down air but make you run more rich which can work to your disadvantage.

 

boost dependant injection and a temperature control unit would be neccacary more than likely.

The temp control unit would need to read intake temp and maybe combustion temp or EGT to adjust accordingly.

Still havent had a chance to make it to the library, sorry.

 

didnt read the whole thing but go to SupraForums.com and seach there...i used to dream about Propane when i used to dream about Supras...