Lightweight crank pulley?
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: North/West, IL
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (TurbodCX)
I should add that a balanced rotating assemby (crank, rods, pistons, flywheel, pulley, etc.) does not eliminate rotational vibrations.
Crankshafts flex slightly, cylinder pressures vary, crankcases vary in strength, amoung all else. To dampen these variables you need a rubber, viscous, or other dampening method to ensure long term reliability (street engines especially)
[Modified by SLPR, 7:13 AM 12/19/2002]
Crankshafts flex slightly, cylinder pressures vary, crankcases vary in strength, amoung all else. To dampen these variables you need a rubber, viscous, or other dampening method to ensure long term reliability (street engines especially)
[Modified by SLPR, 7:13 AM 12/19/2002]
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From: OUT OF THE BASMENT, US
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (fastbrakes)
It varies from person to person
I put up a post about this a while back and this is what i was told
Somepeople said that it tore up there bearings
and other said that they've been using it for a while and never had a problem
IMO:If one persons bearing got messed up because of a lightened pulley i wouldnt get it. Why ruin your motor for something that wount make that big of a differnece.
-Brian
I put up a post about this a while back and this is what i was told
Somepeople said that it tore up there bearings
and other said that they've been using it for a while and never had a problem
IMO:If one persons bearing got messed up because of a lightened pulley i wouldnt get it. Why ruin your motor for something that wount make that big of a differnece.
-Brian
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,052
Likes: 0
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (vtec69)
It varies from person to person
I put up a post about this a while back and this is what i was told
Somepeople said that it tore up there bearings
and other said that they've been using it for a while and never had a problem
IMO:If one persons bearing got messed up because of a lightened pulley i wouldnt get it. Why ruin your motor for something that wount make that big of a differnece.
-Brian
I put up a post about this a while back and this is what i was told
Somepeople said that it tore up there bearings
and other said that they've been using it for a while and never had a problem
IMO:If one persons bearing got messed up because of a lightened pulley i wouldnt get it. Why ruin your motor for something that wount make that big of a differnece.
-Brian
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Posts: 8,388
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From: Rochester, NY
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (sp)
The people that say they haven't had problems didn't look at their bearings. It's not like you put it on and your motor explodes instantly. It's over time it wears the bearings faster. For example stock the motor may last 200,000 miles. With a Underdrive crank pulley it will last less. How much less is the question. It could be 100K, 150K, or 190K.
my motor will receive nothing less than a lightened and balanced STOCK pulley
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From: Boise, ID
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (owen_the_soyboy)
It would seem to me that no matter which way you go, aftermarket or stock lightining, you would still want to balance the whole bottom end. It doesn't matter much if it's 1lb less or 1 oz less, it will still cause wear. Honda balanced the whole assembley, in theory, and that included the crank pulley. Therefore, if you were to take a N1 or a stock chopped and balanced pulley, you would still be eliminating weight from the crank and cause it to be out of balance. Does this make sense? So in conclusion I would imagine that you could get a pulley from just about anywhere and balance the WHOLE bottom end with that pulley. Then at that point everything would be designed to work with that pulley. Anyone??? I'mjust trying to put this together in my head as my new motor came with a lighter pulley and I'm debating on using it..
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,018
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From: North/West, IL
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (advanracing62)
Simply balancing the rotating assembly won't eliminate all rotational vibrations. Balancing is a vital step that should be done anyways for many other reasons.
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From: Irvine, CA, usa
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (SLPR)
The vibrations that are dampened cannot be stopped by a perfect balance job. If you think of the motor as the center of the universe, on one side there are the tires, wheels, rotors, axles, cv's, tranny internals, clutch and flywheel. On the other side of the universe there is what...the harmonic balancer. It counteracts the vibrations or harmonics of quickly accelerating and decelerating crankshaft. It's not about the engine shaking or a smooth ride. It just helps the crankshaft and bearings survive better.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,167
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From: Motor City, MI, usa
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (fastbrakes)
Payn Technologies has factory pulleys with the dampener intact and outer grooves/tracks for the p/s and a/c belts machined off. Lighter weight, but still have the balancer/dampener.
IM Matt(Dropspeed) or call Tom for more info.
http://www.payntechnologies.com
IM Matt(Dropspeed) or call Tom for more info.
http://www.payntechnologies.com
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From: CA, USA
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (TurbodCX)
ok guys,
i am going to throw something else into the mix..
i just bought a underdrive,lighted crank pulley...but here is the kicker..
i had my bottem end taken to a very,very, reputable machine shop that builds full race BMW's for the 24hr events, of lemans and ****. when the machinest tried t balance my bottem end with the stock crank pulley he couldnt!!! he said that every thing was great until he bolted the pulley on to the crank shaft, then he said it went off scale on the balance machine. yes this was with the crank,timing gear,flywheel, and all of the other rotateing stuff..
so any how i order this pulley and take it up to him so he can finish my bottom end, and what do you know, with this ONE PIECE CRANK PULLEY, NO DAMPNER BUILT IN, it cam out to .5 of a gram at 1in... it is perfet now..
all i saying is that they maybe bad for a stock bottem end ,but if you are getting it balnced to the rest of the bottem end,then there should be no problems at all..
Brian
i am going to throw something else into the mix..
i just bought a underdrive,lighted crank pulley...but here is the kicker..
i had my bottem end taken to a very,very, reputable machine shop that builds full race BMW's for the 24hr events, of lemans and ****. when the machinest tried t balance my bottem end with the stock crank pulley he couldnt!!! he said that every thing was great until he bolted the pulley on to the crank shaft, then he said it went off scale on the balance machine. yes this was with the crank,timing gear,flywheel, and all of the other rotateing stuff..
so any how i order this pulley and take it up to him so he can finish my bottom end, and what do you know, with this ONE PIECE CRANK PULLEY, NO DAMPNER BUILT IN, it cam out to .5 of a gram at 1in... it is perfet now..
all i saying is that they maybe bad for a stock bottem end ,but if you are getting it balnced to the rest of the bottem end,then there should be no problems at all..
Brian
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From: Boise, ID
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (kb58)
OK so then I would want to get the Honda N1 pulley and then balance everything together... I currently have a JUN ultra light flywheel as well so I won't be taking too much weight off the crank correct?
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From: Winchester, Va, us
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (kb58)
No, both you and the machinist misunderstood what's happening. The fact that there's a rubber element in the assembly he's trying to balance guarantee's it won't balance in the "normal sense." The point of the rubber is to resonate with a particular rpm, and with a particular pulse frequency caused by the cylinder firings. The only thing that can be done is statically balance the pulley in that case, but there's nothing wrong with the rubber one... it's not out of balance
_______
That is the biggest bullshit i have ever heard.... you act like these guys have never done any balancing before....
do you understand what a BMW race shop is back by??? BMW!!!
i do beleive he knows what the **** he is doing.. i mean come on he only builds BMW's 4.0l , and the Inline 6 that turn 9000K Rpm for 24-48Hr events,but wait i forgot he doestnt know what he is doin, he misunderstood the whole concept of the combustion engine!!!!!! 
Brian
[Modified by TurbodCX, 1:31 PM 12/20/2002]
_______
That is the biggest bullshit i have ever heard.... you act like these guys have never done any balancing before....
do you understand what a BMW race shop is back by??? BMW!!!
i do beleive he knows what the **** he is doing.. i mean come on he only builds BMW's 4.0l , and the Inline 6 that turn 9000K Rpm for 24-48Hr events,but wait i forgot he doestnt know what he is doin, he misunderstood the whole concept of the combustion engine!!!!!!
Brian
[Modified by TurbodCX, 1:31 PM 12/20/2002]
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: North/West, IL
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (TurbodCX)
Actually that isn't BS.....
BMWperformance shop, yes your machinist may have never had problems with lightened/undamped pulleys. But consider that alot of those BMW engines are I6 engines. Different engine configurations have different reactions to these variables. Some engines show no signs of failures...some do imeadiatly...some don't fail for quite some time. Just be awhere that changing the engine systems may have an impact on the operation, lifespan, etc. That is all we are trying to convey here....just be awhere of it.
But drawing from what I do all day long....internal combustion engines need damped crank pulleys to operate correctly for the working lifespan of the engine. Race engines are just that......"race engines". They are not 200K mile powertrains.
[Modified by SLPR, 5:49 AM 12/20/2002]
[Modified by SLPR, 5:53 AM 12/20/2002]
BMWperformance shop, yes your machinist may have never had problems with lightened/undamped pulleys. But consider that alot of those BMW engines are I6 engines. Different engine configurations have different reactions to these variables. Some engines show no signs of failures...some do imeadiatly...some don't fail for quite some time. Just be awhere that changing the engine systems may have an impact on the operation, lifespan, etc. That is all we are trying to convey here....just be awhere of it.
But drawing from what I do all day long....internal combustion engines need damped crank pulleys to operate correctly for the working lifespan of the engine. Race engines are just that......"race engines". They are not 200K mile powertrains.
[Modified by SLPR, 5:49 AM 12/20/2002]
[Modified by SLPR, 5:53 AM 12/20/2002]
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From: Eindhoven, Netherlands
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (SLPR)
From what I understand, V6 engines are the best naturally balanced, smoothest engines. I'm not sure if it's the same with I6s, but I imagine so.
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From: North/West, IL
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (Lsos)
From what I understand, V6 engines are the best naturally balanced, smoothest engines. I'm not sure if it's the same with I6s, but I imagine so.
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From: South Beach and Chicago, FL, USA
Re: Lightweight crank pulley? (JeremyL)
When I get my motor together...I'm probably going to Dyno with a:
Balanced Stock Pulley, a Balanced CTR N1 Pulley, and a Balanced UR Race Pulley.
Show the Horsepower differences...if it's <5whp, It's not worth risking your engine.
Suprdave
Balanced Stock Pulley, a Balanced CTR N1 Pulley, and a Balanced UR Race Pulley.
Show the Horsepower differences...if it's <5whp, It's not worth risking your engine.
Suprdave
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