leejoy

question

my girlfriend just picked up her Honday CR-V from the dealer. I think it's a 2005 or 2006. The check engine light was on. They said it was because the gas cap was not sealing, or something like that, but now it's ok, and they wanted $100 to connect an electronic device to the onboard computer to clear the diagnostic code and make the check engine light turn off.

Is this legitimate or was she ripped off? Could she have taken it to any reputable service shop and had the same thing done for much less (or free) or was the Honda dealer being honest and accurate?

thanks

Lee

92eg_h22

Most auto parts stores will clear a code for you for free....especially if its just a gas cap

steveo135

you could do it using and scan tool or by removing the negative battery cable for a couple min but i dunno if that would mess with the ecu in a crv

srmofo

well to be honest, they dont know what the code is until they scan it, so they charged for a diagnostic fee, usually around 1 hr at whatever rate they charge ( my shop is 84$/hour). The code was probably for an EVAP code. A faulty gas cap can trigger that light because it is part of the EVAP system.

Question? did they do a smoke test on it also? If so, then she did not get ripped off.

But when I get a situation like this. I will usually tell the customer to buy a new cap, I will clear the code and if the light comes back on then we need to do a smoke test. I will never charge a customer to tell them they have a bad gas cap unless I have done a smoke test to verify where the leak is coming from. She did kinda get taken. I would demand to know what the exact code was asap, and have it documented on their paperwork. If the light comes back on, they should do the diagnostic they charged you for the first time for free, IF the code is the same. It may take a few days or a few weeks depending on driving habits.

It still amazes me, that some shops will take advantage of people like that. The guy should get paid for working on the vehicle, but there is no way in hell it took him an hour to figure out the cap was bad if all he did was scan it.

Blown90hatcH

https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-civic-del-sol-1992-2000-1/how-pull-cel-d4-srs-abs-codes-code-lists-1901557/

KWayRacing

srmofo;39156018 in above post "well to be honest, they dont know what the code is until they scan it, so they charged for a diagnostic fee, usually around 1 hr at whatever rate they charge ( my shop is 84$/hour). The code was probably for an EVAP code. A faulty gas cap can trigger that light because it is part of the EVAP system."

1. True- Almost every shop charges a diagnostic or check out fee. 1 Hour at $92 we run.


"Question? did they do a smoke test on it also? If so, then she did not get ripped off. "

2. Agree, a smoke test is well worth an hour. But the dealer is able to run a function test on the evaporative system with out smoking the car. There is no need to make customers return for a complete diagnosis. The technician probably ran the evap function test and it passed or came back normal thus saying the car was ok. This test alone takes about 15 minutes. So scan for codes, clear codes, run evap function test. Maybe not worth money to you, but it maybe worth money to your customers that their car is ok. No need to wait in anticipation for the check engine light to come back on. Very much like a guessing game Not very technical. Honda pays the technician .90 to do the same thing while a car is under warranty. The tool alone to run the diagnostic test is 7k. The time for someone to write the customer up, communicate with the tech, the tech to pull the car in, connect the $7k tool, retrieve codes, test, make written notes about concern, someone type that and print that is all worth money.

"But when I get a situation like this. I will usually tell the customer to buy a new cap, I will clear the code and if the light comes back on then we need to do a smoke test. I will never charge a customer to tell them they have a bad gas cap unless I have done a smoke test to verify where the leak is coming from. She did kinda get taken. I would demand to know what the exact code was asap, and have it documented on their paperwork. If the light comes back on, they should do the diagnostic they charged you for the first time for free, IF the code is the same. It may take a few days or a few weeks depending on driving habits."

3. I do respect your posts and you seem knowlegeable, but really you are saying that you sell a fuel cap to all customers who have a P1456 code, clear the code, and have a group finger crossing/ prayer to hope that is the problem, but if they do have to return for the light then I will charge. Why wait to cut to the chase. Its not fair to you or customers. You work for free. Your customers buy fuel caps for nothing, leave unsure, and faced with added inconvenience of having to return to someone who can sit high and say "Well I didn't charge you"
I know that nothing is as cut and dry as the above scenario.


"It still amazes me, that some shops will take advantage of people like that. The guy should get paid for working on the vehicle, but there is no way in hell it took him an hour to figure out the cap was bad if all he did was scan it"

4. I agree with you that technicians should get paid, but as full commision employees techs often have the freedom to make calls on charges. Taking things into account like customer history, actual time taken, special circumstances, general goodwill are all factors that I involve in making a decision on labor time/ customer charges daily. Since I don;t know any of these I can't say if the tech made the wrong call. Ultimately no one else does. But to say that someone was taken advantage of might be a bit overboard. To advise to someone that they demand things really sets the tone for a unpleasant event. How much better did they feel driving off knowing that nothing is wrong with their car? How much was that worth? Not all mechanics are rip offs looking for fresh prey to take advantage of. I hope you understand where I am coming from.

Scott_Tucker

A parts store may pull or clear the code for free but there are few parts store employees that would really know what the code means and how the systems work much less know how to diagnose the problem. So that option is really useless unless you just want the light turned off and the problem not fixed. Of course, if there is really a problem the light is just going to come back on in a few drive cycles.

srmofo

K WAY...
2.- You can run an evap function test with many scan tools, not just whatever the dealership is using these days. mine does it also. Scan tools can not tell you where the leak is. There is no debating that, it has to be smoke tested to find an evap leak. Although the gas cap is the most probably place to start looking, without a smoke test you are just guessing. And that rarely works out well for anyone.

If all they did was run the function test, how did they know the gas cap was bad?

3.- I should have been more clear, I leave it up to the customer if they want me to take it any further in the diag. I work in a city thats middle class and filled with backyard mechanic rednecks. If I can build customer relations and loyality by doing this, its a good situation for me. I dont want to see a post about my shop on the internet some day with someone asking if they got ripped off. I will still get paid .3 for pulling the car and checking it over and pulling the code.


And then somtimes you just get the customers that didnt tighten the gas cap all the way, what do you do with them? In my experience most of the customers are happy to try buying a $9 gascap before paying 90$ for a diag. Its not a situation where it will leave them stranded on the side of the road and I end up with a pissed off customer yelling in my ear, so I see no harm in leaving the option up to them if they want to smoke it now or later.

4- That code should already be on the paperwork, there is no question about that, if it isnt then something isnt right. If the car wasnt smoke tested the first time and the same code pops back up in a week, there is no question that he should demand to have it done for free this time, since he already paid for it last time. Just because you are asking for something, doesnt mean you have to be a dick about it. I personlly dont see anything wrong with asking for what you already paid for.

"How much was that worth? "appearently not 100$ since he is on the internet asking if he got hosed

"Not all mechanics are rip offs looking for fresh prey to take advantage of"
I know this, I am a mechanic myself. But too many times the dealership gets a free pass, solely on the basis that "they are a dealership and they know everything". When in truth they stick it to people harder and deeper than any other shop. Its not just honda dealers its all of them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-SK1-iILlY


I know all this is silly to argue over considering we dont know half of the important details, like wether or not it was even smoked? but I did state in my first post that if it was smoked, then all is good

shifty35

Pretty sure Autozone pulls codes / clears codes for free.

KWayRacing

Absolutely silly. I also live in a small town and customer relationships are important to build. I myself would have just cut them loose. N/C = no charge. Evap leaks are made to be this mysterious hard to diag thing but with a decent scan tool, a smoke machine, a handheld vaccum pump, and knowing how the system operates they are very easy to diag/ repair IMO. C U again on this interweb

fcm

I am a little confused, or am I missing something, girl buys car from dealer, cars CEL is on because of "loose cap", dealer wants her to buy a new gas cap then charge to fix/clear code?????

f#@%*n used car dealers!!!. 94