current setup: P&P B16 head crower valve train, crower 63403 cams, 66 MM TB,
Victor X manifold, Fully built bottom end 12:5.1 compression, Oringed block, eagle rods, Fidanza flywheel, ACT clutck kit, modified DC 4-1 header, full 2.5 inch exhaust, skunk2 cam gears,CAI, ACCEL DFI.

NOW THE QUESTION, I just bought a turbo kit, was gonna swap out my pistons,sell the crower cams, and rebalance the rotating assembly.

I noticed alot of people are goin back to all motor, Am I making a mistake.

 

i usually see people going back to allmotor due to the fact that it IS more realiable. but the turbo will give you more power, or course. if you are going to buy a turbo, selling those cams is a good idea, but you could get turbo or custom cams. geting pistons is also a good idea. i would recommend re-sleeving it and something to deliver more fuel

 

ya Im gonna get some 550 or 660 injectors, the car already has a walboro pump.
But I mean how reliable is all motor compared to turbo. Properly tuned the should be as reliable as you make it.

 

i heard that high revving engines tend to be less reliable because of their rotation velocities adding extrenuous strain on engine parts, i.e. crank shaft, pistons, bolts, etc.. The shear velocity is enough to make it unreliable.

Alas, the turbo, gotta love it, the most efficient way to get power, by using unspent energy and reusing it to power the vehicle more. What more could an environmentalist want?

get rid of the 12.5 cr pistons, and go with something like 9.5 or 9.8 depending on teh amount of boost you want to make. 9.0 cr i've heard safely booost up to 28 psi.

all applications have their faults, however, if you go turbo, I've heard that turbonetics are not very reliable, therefore go with a greddy (street turbo), garret or Precision.

 

Turbo is fun to play with, but I prefer a NA daily driver. Turbo charged cars can give you a nasty surprise from time to time. You'll encounter these less often with an all motor teg. What kind of power you getting from your NA setup anyway?

 

well Iwas makin 231whp,and 147 ft. lbs with Jun III's, havent got the car Dynoed yet with the crowers.


[Modified by lsvtecvx, 8:16 PM 3/8/2003]

 

ttt

 

I'd stay w/ what you got. That's some nice power and w/o turbo lag or the headaches that sometimes come w/ turbo setups.

 

Yeah. You've got some good numbers and it would be a waste of money to have to get rid of the intake, header, cams, and pistons.

 

ALL motor is about the same reliability, if not less. as turbo

 

LMAO...puhlease explain.

I like turbo setups, but they have more parts, more heat, they're harder to tune, and they're always at risk from "boost junkies" cranking up the boost.

 

thats what i thought too until Jeremy at InlinePro told me what i told you so if ud like to call him and ask then have fun...but ill take the word of a nationally known shop and one of their founding employees over anyone on this board...

 

with all motor, you wont have to worry about detonation, turbo lag, maintenance, and just regular problems with a turbo

 

Dude.. just because you work at McDonald's dont mean you have a degree in Hotel & Restaurant Managemant. Not to dis him, but he works at a shop doesnt mean he knows it all. Thats like saying because I pump gas at a gas station I must be a chemisty wiz.
People on this board know there shitz.. Mista Bone, Cheetah, Pacman, GZR4DR, BlownHatch.. etc etc tec. . I would trust their opionion more so then that of a shop.

 

That's your choice. I'm sure Jeremy will be receiving a call from NASA any day now, but I still contend that your average turbo charged setup will tend to experience more wrinkles than a NA setup.

 

maybe we're on a different level here, i was talking about fully built NA vs. full build turbo..and Mcdonalds is a bad simile ***...he has been into this **** for a long time...and is the driver of their allmotor car...so i would say he knows his ****...and NASA..ur an idiot

 

just wondering why did you shitch from the juns to the crowers?

 

wouldent you think that honda would have designed reliability into their motors that rev out to more than 8k skock? I'm sure they have made provisions in the construction of their engines to ensure they would last as long or longer than the competition. They seem pretty durable to me. even modified ones with high miles.

on the turbo or NA question i say stick with the original breathing design from the factory if you really want reliability = NA hondas

 

Very eloquently stated mam, and yes I agree we are on different levels. You're passing on some hearsay opinion while I'm discussing my experience. I also fail to see how the reliability of some methanol burning 16:1 compression all motor dragster has anything to do with the current discussion. We are after all discussing lsvtecvx's car...remember him? He started this post. Are you suggesting that if he throws out his Crower cams, lowers his compression, and installs the turbo setup he already has he'll somehow GAIN reliability? I think not, though both cars could prove fun.

 

i wa talking like built lscrvtecs... with 12-13 comp. on pump gas...both motors i was talking about were "streetable"...and the same goe for turbo, i dont see how a crucially built turbo setup with some crazy **** could be reliable either...

 

To answer SKUNK2WHORE I went to the crowers because of the lack of Midrange power the Jun's provide, very nice crossover on the Jun's , but the Mid isnt that great.

Now onto the main subject Im not lookin for an all out reliable car, I live 10 min. from my job, and I drive my girl's car on weekends.
I started with a turbo car anyways an Eclipse, then a Talon, and last was a Mirage.
So I know how to control myself as far cranking up the boost.
Eclipse made around I would say 450 Hp(never Dynoed but my friends car was and I used leave him in 4th). Talon made I would say 240 HP. Last was my 89 Mirage, made 380 WHP then started fallin apart, suspension went to ****.
I switched over to FWD cause I was sick of AWD drivetrain failures, and when I tried goin to FWD Mitsubishi, the car couldnt take the abuse. Nothin like a Honda!

I went All motor with High expectations, plans of runnin 12:5.1 compression, with an occasional 100 shot. Well from what Ive been reading its a no no, so the most I sprayed was 80, and just prayed she would hold together. I got away with it a couple times but I feel like Im pushin the limits. and the 230 horses my car puts out all motor just isnt cuttin it, so this is why I wanna make the switch.

 

Its a tough decision the 230 horses you got now is pretty nice for na and would love to have that na haha even though im sure i wouldnt be happy with it after a while either cause no matter what you do it dont seem like your ever satisfied. Ill have to say if that isnt cutting it for you then boost is your only option, and thats gonna cost you some time and money cuz to get where your wanting to go your best bet would be to send the block off and sleeve it cause i wouldnt trust the stock block with the amount of boost your gonna run to get 9 comp pistons to 300 to 350 horse range you sound like your looking for not to mention the other things youll need fuel, fuel management, traction etc,etc. Just my opinion.

 

If 230WHP isn't cutting it for you NA teg and you already have the turbo and you're confident you can do it right then lower your compression, sell your cams, increase your fuel supply, get Hondata, and go turbo. You're not going to get all that much more out of your car NA on pump gas.

 

The car already has a good fuel system, and a DFI. So as far as fuel management
Im pretty much set.

Walboro 255 HP pump
STR Fuel rail, Paxton Regulator, -8 lines.
MSD 6A, Msd Blaster SS coil for ignition

 

Is your block already sleeved? (I saw you said o-ringed but was not sure)

If your block is not apready sleeved I would sell at least the whole bottom end to someone looking for a proven all-motor set-up and buy a GSR block and send it out for sleeving then build it up. I would think you could get a nice amount of $$$ for your set-up already put together then snag a block, sleeves and other parts on the loot.