As mentioned in a few other posts, I am doing an all motor buildup this winter. I didnt bother to search this cuz I am pretty sure noone really cares about torque. But the point of this motor is really to over engineer those parts that create HP, and use specific parts to put as much torque into the system as poss. from what I have been told, the biggest differances will be in the header, exhaust and cams. I want to know what are the best of these to keep my torque curve as flat as possible. and if there are other parts i am missing that will help, let me know. the motor is totally in discussion phase right now, but the main goal is to go over 210 Hp, and spin relatively high.

thanks in advance for any help.

 

Because people who modify Honda motors have no interest in sacrificing top end power for greater low end torque, the aftermarket really does not make parts that do this. Besides forced induction, the only things you can do to increase torque are to increase displacement and compression.

 

well, i have heard (from people, not sites) that toda headers and cams (spec b i think) do a good job of maintaining midrange... just looking for a cheaper alternative. running a stroker assembly is one of the options we are bouncing around for more torque

:::EDIT::: I also read from the toda website that the ITB's make better midrange, but I know that is a joke

 

I hate to say it but there is no replacement for displacement (in the all-motor terms). Just get a K20A2 motor and the K24 CRV block. Looking at the current HP #'s that are coming out of these new motors and comparing the HP #'s that are coming out of the B-Series after all of the work and expense it kinda makes me frustrated after all of the hard work and money I've spent on my own motors to get the #'s that I haveand have seen! LOL!

 

If it is a B series motor, use the Buddy Club Spec III+ cams. The midrange of these things is quickly becoming legendary. PM Kteller8 for details.

As far as headers go, any 4-2-1 arrangement generates good midrange. I have seen great results from DTR and SMSP 4-2-1 designs, but they aren't the only ones out there.

 

My experiences with Toda cams and mid range power have been very positive. The Toda cams (B,C,D) have bigger non-VTEC lobes than most other cams, and there can be no question about the mid range benefits. The quality of the Toda cams is second to none. Toda is the only cam maker (including OEM cams) that I know of that makes their non-VTEC lobes as wide .
For good torque numbers, there is no replacement for displacement. 84, 84.5, or 85mm motors produce very nice torque numbers (for a Honda). Hytech and SMSP headers are the best out there (IMO), but they do come with a high price tag and substantial wait time.

 

so how about a balanced stroker kit?

 

I'll vouch for the awesome midrange of the Buddyclub 3's, and a good header to consider is the Edelbrock 2 piece.

My car has a gang of midrange: Me likee.

 

Toda cams + Toda header =

 

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ILuvJDMITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so how about a balanced stroker kit?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Because Honda motors are already undersquare and typically have a short rod ratio, stroking is not most people's first choice. It is typically MUCH better to increase displacement with a bore increase via resleeving first. If you still don't have enough displacement, then try stroking. Just remember that with Hondas, stroking is something better used in addition to boring rather than instead of boring.

 

If you want to use a stroker kit, use one that has raised wrist pins on the pistons. This allows the use of longer rods to help the rod/stroke ratio.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by OLM-02R &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Toda cams + Toda header = </TD></TR></TABLE>

Toda=Midrange

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StorminMatt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Because Honda motors are already undersquare and typically have a short rod ratio, stroking is not most people's first choice. It is typically MUCH better to increase displacement with a bore increase via resleeving first. If you still don't have enough displacement, then try stroking. Just remember that with Hondas, stroking is something better used in addition to boring rather than instead of boring.</TD></TR></TABLE>

can we elaborate on this a little more?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by goPHAST &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I hate to say it but there is no replacement for displacement (in the all-motor terms). Just get a K20A2 motor and the K24 CRV block. Looking at the current HP #'s that are coming out of these new motors and comparing the HP #'s that are coming out of the B-Series after all of the work and expense it kinda makes me frustrated after all of the hard work and money I've spent on my own motors to get the #'s that I haveand have seen! LOL!</TD></TR></TABLE>

ok, what if i have an s2000 block (Ido)? she is a k24 correct? and a jdm k20 head would make for some killer HP? WHO THE HELL IS GONNA WIRE IT?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ILuvJDMITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

ok, what if i have an s2000 block (Ido)? she is a k24 correct? and a jdm k20 head would make for some killer HP? WHO THE HELL IS GONNA WIRE IT?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Nope, sorry
S2000 block is an F20C------K20 head won't work.

 

frikin shat forgive my ignorance there, not up on the S2's

is it possible to get the f20 in? I have it here, i may as well use it

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ILuvJDMITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">frikin shat forgive my ignorance there, not up on the S2's

is it possible to get the f20 in? I have it here, i may as well use it</TD></TR></TABLE>

It rotates in the opposite direction of the B/H series era of motors, so no.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rochesterricer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

It rotates in the opposite direction of the B/H series era of motors, so no.</TD></TR></TABLE>

so i have a REALLY valuable paperweight on my hands, maybe i can trade it for something useful

 

back to this whole torque issue, how about the intake side of things?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ILuvJDMITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well, i have heard (from people, not sites) that toda headers and cams (spec b i think) do a good job of maintaining midrange... just looking for a cheaper alternative. running a stroker assembly is one of the options we are bouncing around for more torque

:::EDIT::: I also read from the toda website that the ITB's make better midrange, but I know that is a joke</TD></TR></TABLE>


You want to look for a cheaper alternative than headers and cams so you look at a stroker kit???? how is that cheaper?

If you want torque sell your f20c, your current honda, and go buy a mustang. From what you have so far posted, you will have a much better time modding a stang anyway.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SuperSlow &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


You want to look for a cheaper alternative than headers and cams so you look at a stroker kit???? how is that cheaper?

If you want torque sell your f20c, your current honda, and go buy a mustang. From what you have so far posted, you will have a much better time modding a stang anyway.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

was that even necessary? i meant a cheaper alternative to TODA. the whole rotating assembly is being done anyway... the only question is rod ratio