Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring?
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Joined: Dec 2003
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From: orlando, fl, 32826
Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring?
Just got the turbo done yesterday, took her for a spin tonight, nothing major 5 PSI at most.
Got 3 CEL's - all for misfiring (cyl 2, 4, and multiple). Few questions:
1. Could this be due to running lean or is it rich?
2. Will running 93 octane help?
I am already running 1 step colder plugs - but only on 89 octane. I need to limp to the gas station and fill up with some premium....
Anyone have any ideas?
Got 3 CEL's - all for misfiring (cyl 2, 4, and multiple). Few questions:
1. Could this be due to running lean or is it rich?
2. Will running 93 octane help?
I am already running 1 step colder plugs - but only on 89 octane. I need to limp to the gas station and fill up with some premium....
Anyone have any ideas?
Joined: Nov 2002
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From: Utah, foo, usa
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (opto_isolator)
List your setup. Are you running hack, fmu, standealone?
1. yes it could be either lean or rich
What is your spark plug gapped at?
Do you have access to wideband or a/f gauge to see if its in rich when in boost?
2. maybe
1. yes it could be either lean or rich
What is your spark plug gapped at?
Do you have access to wideband or a/f gauge to see if its in rich when in boost?
2. maybe
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2003
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From: orlando, fl, 32826
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (racerxfear)
Its a 2001 civic LX, with the greddy emanage - that's really not going to matter however, since I can add / remove timing, and fuel.
I think it just needs to be tuned - but I want that extra piece of mind knowing that 93 octane will help...
I've gone through the RPM band vs boost on the emanage and added a few % points of injector duration, just in case.
Tell you what tho - 5 PSI is wicked, I can't wait to get tuned and feel 9!! I am def going to be addicted to boost!!!
Pictures are here for the lazy:
http://www.msoe.edu/~bruehlt
I think it just needs to be tuned - but I want that extra piece of mind knowing that 93 octane will help...
I've gone through the RPM band vs boost on the emanage and added a few % points of injector duration, just in case.
Tell you what tho - 5 PSI is wicked, I can't wait to get tuned and feel 9!! I am def going to be addicted to boost!!!
Pictures are here for the lazy:
http://www.msoe.edu/~bruehlt
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2003
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From: orlando, fl, 32826
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (opto_isolator)
Until I can get it to a tuner - I've been keeping an eye on my wideband (PLX)...its hanging around 14-15 A/F.....but the thing about these damn OBII ECUs is that they will cut injector duty cycle to 0 upon throttle closing - so the car runs inherantly lean when you take your foot off of the gas! 
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From: carlisle, pa
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (opto_isolator)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by opto_isolator »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Until I can get it to a tuner - I've been keeping an eye on my wideband (PLX)...its hanging around 14-15 A/F.....but the thing about these damn OBII ECUs is that they will cut injector duty cycle to 0 upon throttle closing - so the car runs inherantly lean when you take your foot off of the gas! </TD></TR></TABLE>
well ibelieve that 14-15 is normal at idle.
</TD></TR></TABLE>well ibelieve that 14-15 is normal at idle.
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From: The Swamp, FL
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (opto_isolator)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by opto_isolator »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Until I can get it to a tuner - I've been keeping an eye on my wideband (PLX)...its hanging around 14-15 A/F.....but the thing about these damn OBII ECUs is that they will cut injector duty cycle to 0 upon throttle closing - so the car runs inherantly lean when you take your foot off of the gas! </TD></TR></TABLE>
i sure hope you are talking about running 14:1-15:1 AF while cruising and not in boost.
running anything less than 93 is a bad idea
5 psi at 14:1 or higher and the car will go boom....
also, a lean misfire sounds different that a rich misfire, you say u have a wideband, what does the AFR go to before the misfire condition?
</TD></TR></TABLE>i sure hope you are talking about running 14:1-15:1 AF while cruising and not in boost.
running anything less than 93 is a bad idea
5 psi at 14:1 or higher and the car will go boom....
also, a lean misfire sounds different that a rich misfire, you say u have a wideband, what does the AFR go to before the misfire condition?
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From: Raleigh, NC
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (Mase)
good luck w/the e-manage... obd2 ecu's dont like those things
too rich or lean can cause a missfire.. and wtf are you running 89 for?
turbo anything = 93 octane
too rich or lean can cause a missfire.. and wtf are you running 89 for?
turbo anything = 93 octane
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From: orlando, fl, 32826
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (JDogg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDogg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">good luck w/the e-manage... obd2 ecu's dont like those things
too rich or lean can cause a missfire.. and wtf are you running 89 for?
turbo anything = 93 octane</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah I know, I didn't have a chance to fill up before installing the turbo. I think I'm going to get a bottle of octane booster to put in the tank until I can get to the gas station.
As far as the A/F - the wideband says around 14-15 as I go into boost. I've only done it a few times last night to test everything out. I don't plan on doing it anymore until I can get it tuned, because I don't want to blow stuff.
The emanage is a crappy hack - I know, however for these cars it is the only viable solution (besides a K20 swap, which is too much money and hassle for now). With the emanage, unlike the VAFC hack I can actually add injector duration, and modify the ignition timing. I also have a Split Second ESC1 installed to fool the car once it goes into boost - its not hooked up right now, because the A/F ratio would be way off than, but when I go to the tuner I plan on hooking it up.
My boost doesn't start to spool up until I get around 3-3500 RPM. If the boost gauge says that I'm in vac, is it alright to drive the car around until I get it tuned?
too rich or lean can cause a missfire.. and wtf are you running 89 for?
turbo anything = 93 octane</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah I know, I didn't have a chance to fill up before installing the turbo. I think I'm going to get a bottle of octane booster to put in the tank until I can get to the gas station.
As far as the A/F - the wideband says around 14-15 as I go into boost. I've only done it a few times last night to test everything out. I don't plan on doing it anymore until I can get it tuned, because I don't want to blow stuff.
The emanage is a crappy hack - I know, however for these cars it is the only viable solution (besides a K20 swap, which is too much money and hassle for now). With the emanage, unlike the VAFC hack I can actually add injector duration, and modify the ignition timing. I also have a Split Second ESC1 installed to fool the car once it goes into boost - its not hooked up right now, because the A/F ratio would be way off than, but when I go to the tuner I plan on hooking it up.
My boost doesn't start to spool up until I get around 3-3500 RPM. If the boost gauge says that I'm in vac, is it alright to drive the car around until I get it tuned?
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From: Raleigh, NC
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (opto_isolator)
the problem with the e-manage or any piggy back for that matter... the stock ecu will figure out that its there and compensate for whatever trims the piggy back give.
ie, you add 10% fuel, theh stock ecu will eventually figure it out and take out 10% fuel, so you are back to zero
ie, you add 10% fuel, theh stock ecu will eventually figure it out and take out 10% fuel, so you are back to zero
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From: atl
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (opto_isolator)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by opto_isolator »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
As far as the A/F - the wideband says around 14-15 as I go into boost. I've only done it a few times last night to test everything out. I don't plan on doing it anymore until I can get it tuned, because I don't want to blow stuff.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
14 x-15 afr under boost is going to melt something even under a high load in in vac thats playing it dangerous
As far as the A/F - the wideband says around 14-15 as I go into boost. I've only done it a few times last night to test everything out. I don't plan on doing it anymore until I can get it tuned, because I don't want to blow stuff.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
14 x-15 afr under boost is going to melt something even under a high load in in vac thats playing it dangerous
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From: Reading, PA, usa
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (b18cls1)
under a vac load thats fine. under boost is a no no though.
if you are getting those cels though. those are more of random missfires. check the injectors and plugs and stuff. make sure they are all firing right. FYI i had a random missfire code prob for a little and it was my diaphram in my FPR fluttering periodically.
if you are getting those cels though. those are more of random missfires. check the injectors and plugs and stuff. make sure they are all firing right. FYI i had a random missfire code prob for a little and it was my diaphram in my FPR fluttering periodically.
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From: orlando, fl, 32826
Re: Tuning question - will running lean or rich cause misfiring? (JDogg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDogg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the problem with the e-manage or any piggy back for that matter... the stock ecu will figure out that its there and compensate for whatever trims the piggy back give.
ie, you add 10% fuel, theh stock ecu will eventually figure it out and take out 10% fuel, so you are back to zero </TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah - I know. BUT the good thing about the emanage compared to the AFC-hack is that I can control timing +/- 20 degrees with it, and the ECU really isn't going to compensate (at least for the timing). ALSO - I installed the split second ESC1, which should send a mimic signal to the ECU when it senses boost, thus allowing me to tune my A/F better, without the ECU trying to compensate.
I appreciate all of the feedback guys - any amount helps!
All I can say is that I realllllly want to drive the damn thing - heck I didn't even get into 5 psi last night and I felt a kick in the pants. I am now addicted to boost!
ie, you add 10% fuel, theh stock ecu will eventually figure it out and take out 10% fuel, so you are back to zero </TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah - I know. BUT the good thing about the emanage compared to the AFC-hack is that I can control timing +/- 20 degrees with it, and the ECU really isn't going to compensate (at least for the timing). ALSO - I installed the split second ESC1, which should send a mimic signal to the ECU when it senses boost, thus allowing me to tune my A/F better, without the ECU trying to compensate.
I appreciate all of the feedback guys - any amount helps!
All I can say is that I realllllly want to drive the damn thing - heck I didn't even get into 5 psi last night and I felt a kick in the pants. I am now addicted to boost!
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