Does anybody know if it would be worth fitting Accord Type R cams to a JDM H22A Prelude? I have the chance to get some pretty cheap, but didn't know if it would be worth the time and cost to fit them. Possibly more worthwhile with adjustable cam gears at the same time?

 

If the rumors about the Accord Type R cams being the same as the Prelude Type S cams then I would think that it would not help that much. If you went with higher compression and a header then it might be worth it. Otherwise If you can get them for real cheap then sure give it a shot. I suggest that you upgrade the valvetrain though. in the Prelude Dyons Page thread there are 2 people getting 19X hp from Type S cams on JDM 10.6:1 CR H22's. Not bad IMO

the Pirate

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Demonlude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Does anybody know if it would be worth fitting Accord Type R cams to a JDM H22A Prelude? I have the chance to get some pretty cheap, but didn't know if it would be worth the time and cost to fit them. Possibly more worthwhile with adjustable cam gears at the same time?
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how do you know they are real? and is that the h23 vtec?

 

the JDM Accord SIR wagon had the H23A VTEC, automatic tranny.
The destroked JDM Accord SIR-T was the F20B manual tranny w/ LSD (200ps).
The destroked JDM Accord SIR was the auto tranny detuned F20B (180ps).
The Accord Type R was a European Accord with 212ps H22A 5 sp w/ LSD and single runner Intake Manifold..

good for reference (prelude FAQ sticky):

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=641555

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PirateMcFred &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The Accord Type R was a European Accord with 212ps H22A 5 sp w/ LSD and single runner Intake Manifold..

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H22A7 to be exact. What's more an ATR pistons are the same as Type S ones. And it has nice headers too.

 

Accord Type-R Cams = Prelude Type-S cams

 

what do they look like and how do you know if they are real?

 

you can tell if they're real by gapping the lobes.

 

I know they're real, as I know the car and its owner. So do people think that the cams will be a worthwhile investment?

 

well...you can just use 5th gen ludes cams...i've read somewhere that the 5th gens cams are only like 0.2 mm lower than type s cams. Both the base and SH cams have the same part number so i would assume their the same too....

Here is a quote from a fellow H-T member...forget where i found it but i kept his info for my records:

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Stock H22 Cam specs

and helms says:

4th gen vtec and fifth base (info taken from 2 different publication Helms manuals)
intake gross lift: 11.4 mm .449"
exhaust gross lift: 10.6 mm .417

Fifth SH
intake gross lift: 12.0 mm .472
exhaust gross lift: 11.18 mm .440

But there is some contention about wether or not the cams between 5th base and SH are the same since the part numbers are the same. Same part numbers = same part so they may not be different.

Crowers SH lift info seems to be too close to the Helms' lift numbers for there to really be a difference.

Based on Crowers info and the part number fact I think that they are the same with potential minor differences between earlier USDM H22 models and later USDM models, where they might have changed the ramp speed and whatnot.
hope this helps
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so the 5th gen cams (base and SH) is = 12.0 and 11.8
Prelude Type S's cams are =12.2mm intake and 11.2 exhaust side

 

from hondaautomotiveparts.com the base and SH cams have the same part number

wonder if there are any dynos on Type S vs SH vs Base cams

 

Base and SH cams are the same. The myth about the SH having more aggressive cams is untrue.

 

Upgrading the valve springs and valves is always a good Idea but not nessasary when switching to type s cams. Both motors use the same valves and springs.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93H22ACX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well...you can just use 5th gen ludes cams...i've read somewhere that the 5th gens cams are only like 0.2 mm lower than type s cams. Both the base and SH cams have the same part number so i would assume their the same too....

Here is a quote from a fellow H-T member...forget where i found it but i kept his info for my records:

so the 5th gen cams (base and SH) is = 12.0 and 11.8
Prelude Type S's cams are =12.2mm intake and 11.2 exhaust side</TD></TR></TABLE>


Exhaust for base is 11.18 you missed a 1 there. Also duration is unknown

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by satan_srv &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Exhaust for base is 11.18 you missed a 1 there. Also duration is unknown</TD></TR></TABLE>

ahah yeah i did..oops..thanks for the correction

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by satan_srv &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Also [Type-S] duration is unknown</TD></TR></TABLE>

not true. It is 240 degrees (5 degrees more than stock) intake and exhaust @ 1mm. I have a source at work, I posted it before but if anyone is interested I can dig it up.

93H22ACX, there is virtually NO difference between the USDM 4th gen VTEC, 5th gen base and SH cams. That is what the quote you posted above says. Helms is wrong.

just to clear some stuff up.

the Pirate


Modified by PirateMcFred at 8:14 PM 7/3/2004

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PirateMcFred &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
93H22ACX, there is virtually NO difference between the USDM 4th gen VTEC, 5th gen base and SH cams. That is what the quote you posted above says. Helms is wrong.

just to clear some stuff up.

the Pirate</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was under the impression that the 5th base and SH models had higher lifts and the 4th Gen VTEC's have less lift.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93H22ACX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I was under the impression that the 5th base and SH models had higher lifts and the 4th Gen VTEC's have less lift.</TD></TR></TABLE>


No way.

 

so all of the preludes have the same cams? okay thanks....

 

yeah all the cams are the same for the basic h22s

 

H22 cam Part Numbers:

14111-P13-000 4th intake
14121-P13-000 4th ex

14111-P5M-A00 5th SH in
14121-P5M-000 5th SH ex

14111-P5M-A00 5th Base in
14121-P5M-000 5th Base ex

14111-P5P-J00 5th Type-s in
14121-P5P-J00 5th Type-s ex


In the 1993 Helms and the 1998 Helms for Honda Preludes
the cam specs are the same. Helm's info on Type-SH cam specs are WRONG (observe same part numbers above). If you just cannot believe me look at Crower.com measurements for JDM stock Vs. SH specs .002" is NOTHING.

Cam degree cards are the same for the vtec lobe in both 4th and 5th gen USDM (does not include the Type S) Helm manuals.
Measured at 1mm lift:
Intake opening (BTDC)
15°
Intake closing (ABDC)
40°
Duration: 235°

Exhaust opening (BBDC)
40°
Exhaust closing (ATDC)
15°
Duration: 235°

Overlap 30° (@ 0,0)

Gross Valve lift w/1.55 rocker ratio
Intake:
11.5mm, 0.453"
Exhaust:
10.5mm, 0.413"

Long story short: Virtually NO diference when comapring 4th, 5th base and 5th SH Hp/Tq numbers.

 

DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks man!

 

BTW, this was all info I found in the archives here.

I just have the PhAt SkIlLz Fo dAt SeEoich PhUnCtIoN!! You should practice too.

the Pirate

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PirateMcFred &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BTW, this was all info I found in the archives here.

I just have the PhAt SkIlLz Fo dAt SeEoich PhUnCtIoN!! You should practice too.

the Pirate</TD></TR></TABLE>

yes ....practise makes perfect. Thanks for the info man

 

Just to clear something up, the European Accord Type-R that makes 212 hp is different from the JDM Euro Accord Type-R that makes 220. What I was wondering is if the cams are different accounting for the less HP, or is it other parts that make the JDM one higher hp?