Is it possible for valve springs to be too strong for a cam(s)? I know if u buy cams u should buy the recommended spring and retainer set too. This is just a question asking if its possible. What could it cause to happen if it is possible?

 

No i dont beleive you can buy springs too strong. Ferrea or crower will have the strongest springs and i know a lot of people that have used itr cams or skunk2 cams or toda C cams. They should be fine as long as its for that motor.

 

Yes i think there is...it can wear out you cam lobes.

 

stable high rpm valve control at the cost of cam wear, depends on app. to be effectively used, but most spring designers have allready thought of that so you shouldn't worry about too high of a rate.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">No i dont beleive you can buy springs too strong. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Some of the first springs on the market for K-series were too strong, and wore the cams quickly. K-series are roller rockers, and simply don't have as much oil being sprayed on the cams as the B-series. They don't like overly stiff springs.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2000ekhatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">stable high rpm valve control at the cost of cam wear, depends on app. to be effectively used, but most spring designers have allready thought of that so you shouldn't worry about too high of a rate.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Could you elaborate? It sounds like you're saying that spring designers designed their springs to never be too stiff, when really I don't think that's the case.

Like others have said, too stiff of springs will cause cam wear, and I think extra stress on the timing belt, but I'm not sure about the latter.

 

it can actually casue premature wear to the valve seats as well as reduce power output...so i hear.

 

What about breaking cams? I heard some people talk about snapping cams, and usually its because they didn't torque all the bolts on the cam caps or cam covers to what there supposed to, so i hear. Can too strong of a spring cause cams to break? Or when that happens is it usually just poor installation or a bad set of cams?

 

im not saying all spring producers the perfect spring, just some of the most prominent, skunk2, rev and such take into consideration additional cam wear as a side affect of higher rate springs, if they didn't honda would have made them that stiff from the factory for obvious reliablity issues, plus stiffer springs MAY also only wear down aftermarket cams more than stock cams because of the way some are made, thats why you see , "cast and chilled blanks just like oem" on some (not all) aftermarket cams, some custom cams are just welded and re-cut for a cusotm grind and the problems with that should be obvious i.e. inconsistency of weld quality and inconsistency of welding material and the millions of other inconsistencs that come with heating and cooling of an already finished cast piece.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alfaaay &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Could you elaborate? It sounds like you're saying that spring designers designed their springs to never be too stiff, when really I don't think that's the case.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Notice that valve float on most motors (especially high revving ones) starts very early after hitting the rev limiter, like only a couple hundred rpm. There's very good reasons (discussed here: wear, efficiency) why they give you such a low safety factor.

 

i jok low spring rate valvespring itr outer portflow inners. would lighter valves help the spring not work as harder make it have not as much vavle float compared to stock would it even be noticable....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by zad5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i jok low spring rate valvespring itr outer portflow inners. would lighter valves help the spring not work as harder make it have not as much vavle float compared to stock would it even be noticable....</TD></TR></TABLE>

Don't quite understand what/if you're trying to say/ask...

But, I think....yes, lighter valves mean your springs don't have to work as hard and so you can use softer springs and/or rev higher. Also, you can use softer springs with milder cams.

 

Ideally you want as LIGHT a spring as possible, because a heavier spring robs horsepower, but you do need it stiff enough to prevent float. It's a compromise.

The lighter your lifters and retainers are , the softer the spring you can run (the spring will accelerate the lighter mass more easily).

 

I posted this before and no one really answered straight on, and it goes with the topic, why don't people lighten thier rockers (spoon excluded) I had my local machine shop wieght each rocker arm and using the lightest of each set (3 diff. sets for the lamen) shaved three grams off of the lightest one and had them balance them all to what they thought was acceptable balance (not sure of exact specs, but sure its close to the hundreths or thousanths, so no flaming). Its such a simple concept that I am suprised to hear that no one here knows much about it. It goes along with the the lighter the spring the better for wear and efficiency. Sorry just had to throw that in. ohh and for those who are lost, the less drag a spring causes on the cam, the less energy lost to parasitic loss. And if everyone does do it and isn't telling me then im sorry for the waste of 1011010010.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2000ekhatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I posted this before and no one really answered straight on, and it goes with the topic, why don't people lighten thier rockers (spoon excluded) I had my local machine shop wieght each rocker arm and using the lightest of each set (3 diff. sets for the lamen) shaved three grams off of the lightest one and had them balance them all to what they thought was acceptable balance (not sure of exact specs, but sure its close to the hundreths or thousanths, so no flaming). Its such a simple concept that I am suprised to hear that no one here knows much about it. It goes along with the the lighter the spring the better for wear and efficiency. Sorry just had to throw that in. ohh and for those who are lost, the less drag a spring causes on the cam, the less energy lost to parasitic loss. And if everyone does do it and isn't telling me then im sorry for the waste of 1011010010.</TD></TR></TABLE>

DPR has been doing this for some time now...

http://www.dpr-racing.com..

 

I know that most of the pro builders do stuff like that, but i ment for the everyday tuner, it only cost me like $50 at a machine shop and shaved 72 grams off of the valve train,thats a lot (should be) more than a set of titanium retainers and you dont even have to have a lot of experience with motors to do it, if you can install a cam you could do this. I am not sure if he just sells the valvetrain, the site looked underconstuction or re-construction and the valve train section didn't work, But by the way it looks the only head package he advertises it with is the super duper expensive one that has more than most street enthusiasts would like to pay. Hey maybe ill do it to a head and post a step by step of how to do it, and what to ask for at the machine shop, would that be helpful to anyone?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2000ekhatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I know that most of the pro builders do stuff like that, but i ment for the everyday tuner, it only cost me like $50 at a machine shop and shaved 72 grams off of the valve train,thats a lot (should be) more than a set of titanium retainers and you dont even have to have a lot of experience with motors to do it, if you can install a cam you could do this. I am not sure if he just sells the valvetrain, the site looked underconstuction or re-construction and the valve train section didn't work, But by the way it looks the only head package he advertises it with is the super duper expensive one that has more than most street enthusiasts would like to pay. Hey maybe ill do it to a head and post a step by step of how to do it, and what to ask for at the machine shop, would that be helpful to anyone?</TD></TR></TABLE>

sure it'd be helpful.