a friend has 2 hes selling would they pound hsder than 2 12 inch comp vrs on the same amunt of power?

2 12 inch in a ported box on a 1100D getting about 350rms each be enough or do they need more?

 

my friend said i can get them brand new for less, sop maybe a single 15 inch he2 would pound??

 

haha i guess not thanks i get the silence won't buy em

 

i would not suggest getting 15's because when they hit they are not clear

 

it depends how you wire the subs. the he2's are not as efficient as CVRs.
both are dvc's but the he2 are only dual 4 ohm. the cvrs can be had in dual 4 ohm and dual 8 ohm. the he 12's are made to handle 400w rms while the cvr 12's handle 250-300w rms.
15''s are too sloppy only get them if you are going for spl. If you want something for everyday listening get 12's if you only listen to r&b and rap, and if you listen to rock all or some of the time get 10"s.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by incubus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">15''s are too sloppy only get them if you are going for spl. </TD></TR></TABLE>

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by skrewdriver88 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i would not suggest getting 15's because when they hit they are not clear</TD></TR></TABLE>


are you guys drunk?


i love how 15s sound and 18s, sloppy and not clear do not come into the equation unless you don't know what you are doing


15s sound just as clear as tens, as long as its in the right enclusre and set up, dammit i can't believe im having this argument

 

it really depends on the notes, I have heard a 15" phoenix gold x-max sound sloppy on fast paced notes and that is one precise 15" sub it is a fact a bigger cone means the speaker has to travel further which means its travel time is longer which equates to it not being able to keep up with fast paced notes.
the best subs for sound quality and presicion are subs with small voice coils and small magnets.
if you think about the the physics of a 10" sub vs a 15" sub it makes perfect sense.

 

Making a motor that is capable to handle large amounts of moving mass will allow it to have a nice transient response, so that completely dispells one part of your theory.

Also, having a large mass is not the end all to transient response- you still have many factors that need to be taken into consideration when it comes to transient response...

Also take into consideration the inductance of a coil, which plays a large role in transient response...

This theory of larger diameter subs not being able to keep up with their smaller counterparts needs to be dispelled already...

 

uhh guys, you are all idiots sorry

http://audioforum.termpro.com/...00009

so far ive asked this question on 3 top audio forums and they all say the same thing...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Originally posted by McFrosty:
[QB] Don't worry. There all idiots.

15s, 18s, doesn't matter. If they are in the right enclosures and given the right amount of power they can sound just as good as any other size sub.

People who say they are "sloppy" and "not clean" probably run them in poorly designed boxes with crappy amps and installations. [/QB]</TD></TR></TABLE>


guys, you need to know WTF you are talking about...

before you talk

 

bassislife...if you love 15's and 18's so much why you running 2 10's???

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bassisliffe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">uhh guys, you are all idiots sorry </TD></TR></TABLE>

lol...thats like george W calling sadam a war criminal Hypocrisy at its finest.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by scrolanky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">bassislife...if you love 15's and 18's so much why you running 2 10's???</TD></TR></TABLE>

cause 15s and 18s are sloppy!

ok i do NOT LOVE 15s or 18s ive neve rused them, i just wanted to point out that the stuff that was posted about 15s and 18s sound sloppy is GARBAGE as ive heard many and EVERYONE on EVERY audio site agrees...


i giess they are all wrong and you guys are right huh?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EBP_SI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

lol...thats like george W calling sadam a war criminal Hypocrisy at its finest.</TD></TR></TABLE>


lol, i was ONLY calling the guys who said 15s are sloppy idios not you 'all' ok?

 

any sub in the right enclosure and with the right amount of power is going to sound good if it didn't why would they make 15's and 18's

 

15's and 18's were mainly maid for big trucks, not for cars.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by skrewdriver88 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">15's and 18's were mainly maid for big trucks, not for cars.</TD></TR></TABLE>

15's and 18's were produced to put out lower frequencies than a 10 or a 12. its simple really if you think about it. theres home audio subs contain 2 18" drivers and will play down to 16hz. bring on a 12" that can do that at the same volume.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by incubus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">it is a fact a bigger cone means the speaker has to travel further which means its travel time is longer which equates to it not being able to keep up with fast paced notes.
the best subs for sound quality and presicion are subs with small voice coils and small magnets.
if you think about the the physics of a 10" sub vs a 15" sub it makes perfect sense.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

you must have failed physics class.....

A larger cone, to produce the same ouput travels a SHORTER distance then a smaller one.

It is the note that determines how "fast" a cone moves. Remember, notes are defined by their frequency = # of cycles/second.

What is of true concern is not how fast the cone moves, but how fast it starts, stops and gets moving in the other direction. The larger the cone (given the same constuction methods) the heavier it will be. This means the larger woofer cone will have more momentum and more inertia - making it more difficult to control. Also, the larger the cone (again given identical construction methods) the less rigid it will be. As stated above, these issues can be handled by motor strength, material choice, TS parameters, etc.

There is no reason why a small vc, that I can think of, would give it any advantage. It reduces power handling, and that limits you on system dynamics...essentially, the more power the better. Dynaudio mids are considered to be excellent SQ speakers, yet they have large 3" coils IIRC.....and now you want small magnets to limit the power of the motor - so what you are telling me is that any speaker with a neo magnet is the best

Yes, if you think about the physics behind it, it does make perfect sense that you can have awesome SQ drivers that are very large - if you design them properly. Most people now-a-days use subwoofers for midbass frequencies as is...but that's a whole other can of worms.

Richard Clark's/Speakerworks GN had 15 or 18" subs with little to no excursion and he still hit 140dB (on his sq curve back when you couldn't change your settings in IASCA) in an AP enclosure no less. His midbasses were 10 or 12" JBL units in PORTED boxes. The IDW15's and 18's are still consided some of the best SQ subs around, period.

So, in summary, and not to beat a dead horse any more then the poor thing has been already - you can get a good SQ sub that is large in diameter - you can also get one that sounds like ****. Choose wisely!

Remember, everything in car audio is a tradeoff - you can't have it all.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rcurley55 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


There is no reason why a small vc, that I can think of, would give it any advantage. It reduces power handling, and that limits you on system dynamics...essentially, the more power the better. Dynaudio mids are considered to be excellent SQ speakers, yet they have large 3" coils IIRC.....and now you want small magnets to limit the power of the motor - so what you are telling me is that any speaker with a neo magnet is the best
</TD></TR></TABLE>

small voice coil means more efficiency the longer the voice coil the further the signal has to travel which leads to increasing signal loss. All I stated was that a small sub is the most efficient, Im not saying I want a small magnet.
Yeah they cant handle the power of a larger sub but like u said curley everything in car audio is a tradeoff.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rcurley55 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

you must have failed physics class.....

A larger cone, to produce the same ouput travels a SHORTER distance then a smaller one.

It is the note that determines how "fast" a cone moves. Remember, notes are defined by their frequency = # of cycles/second.

What is of true concern is not how fast the cone moves, but how fast it starts, stops and gets moving in the other direction. The larger the cone (given the same constuction methods) the heavier it will be. This means the larger woofer cone will have more momentum and more inertia - making it more difficult to control. Also, the larger the cone (again given identical construction methods) the less rigid it will be. As stated above, these issues can be handled by motor strength, material choice, TS parameters, etc.

There is no reason why a small vc, that I can think of, would give it any advantage. It reduces power handling, and that limits you on system dynamics...essentially, the more power the better. Dynaudio mids are considered to be excellent SQ speakers, yet they have large 3" coils IIRC.....and now you want small magnets to limit the power of the motor - so what you are telling me is that any speaker with a neo magnet is the best

Yes, if you think about the physics behind it, it does make perfect sense that you can have awesome SQ drivers that are very large - if you design them properly. Most people now-a-days use subwoofers for midbass frequencies as is...but that's a whole other can of worms.

Richard Clark's/Speakerworks GN had 15 or 18" subs with little to no excursion and he still hit 140dB (on his sq curve back when you couldn't change your settings in IASCA) in an AP enclosure no less. His midbasses were 10 or 12" JBL units in PORTED boxes. The IDW15's and 18's are still consided some of the best SQ subs around, period.

So, in summary, and not to beat a dead horse any more then the poor thing has been already - you can get a good SQ sub that is large in diameter - you can also get one that sounds like ****. Choose wisely!

Remember, everything in car audio is a tradeoff - you can't have it all.</TD></TR></TABLE>


are you saying 15s don't sound sloppy?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by incubus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">All I stated was that a small sub is the most efficient, Im not saying I want a small magnet. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm not trying to pick on you, but small subs are not more efficient then a larger counterpart - the inverse is true. Given the same power, the larger driver will be louder, therefore more efficient.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bassisliffe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


are you saying 15s don't sound sloppy? </TD></TR></TABLE>

re-read the second to last paragraph and it will answer your question...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rcurley55 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

re-read the second to last paragraph and it will answer your question...</TD></TR></TABLE>

sorry!!!!!! didn't read that far!


ok so YOU are one of the more sensible audio heads here!

thankyou for setting the record straight, every other forum agrees with you so YOU SHOULD BE MODERATOR FOR THIS ROOM!

 

Efficiency is a product of BL and mms. BL= flux density in gap x length of wire in gap. Having a small coil will not do much if the gap is small. If you have a small coil, and a larger gap, this will result in nice efficiency. Because, a smaller coil will result in less mass, and a larger gap will result in more flux. (this being known as an 'underhung' motor.) Once that coil leaves the gap, however, due to exceeding the drivers xmax, BL falls off sharply. And overhung motor typically has a taller larger coil which doesn't all sit in the gap during excursion.

So, having a smaller coil doesn't mean much, unless the motor is designed to accomodate that coil...

Also, some of the best SPL woofers are the most efficient woofers out there, and have 3-4" coils...so what does that tell you?

incubus, I suggest you read up on motor topologies and some acoustics

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by snova031 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Efficiency is a product of BL and mms. BL= flux density in gap x length of wire in gap. Having a small coil will not do much if the gap is small. If you have a small coil, and a larger gap, this will result in nice efficiency. Because, a smaller coil will result in less mass, and a larger gap will result in more flux. (this being known as an 'underhung' motor.) Once that coil leaves the gap, however, due to exceeding the drivers xmax, BL falls off sharply. And overhung motor typically has a taller larger coil which doesn't all sit in the gap during excursion.

So, having a smaller coil doesn't mean much, unless the motor is designed to accomodate that coil...

Also, some of the best SPL woofers are the most efficient woofers out there, and have 3-4" coils...so what does that tell you?

incubus, I suggest you read up on motor topologies and some acoustics </TD></TR></TABLE>


this man registered on HT JUST to reply to this topic!