Now I know that honing adds texture to the cylinder walls to help break in the rings. However, the Helm's says that it isn't necessary to hone the block unless there is enough scoring to catch a fingernail. So, do I pull the motor and hone the block or just drop the oil pan, check the cylinders, and toss the type S pistons in if everything checks out? TIA

 

okay so we were talking about this and I don't have the experience to give a definitive answer. You can answer so questions though.

Miles on the block?

I think the main factor here is measuring the bore to see if anything is out-of round. a hone may be in order just to promote some seating, and clean it up.

I have always wondered if you can avoid this by using the same rings?

 

75k on block. I've got mics and telescoping gauges to check the cylinders. What I'm worried about is the seating.

 

so is there no one in your area you trust to do a hone? What's stopping you?

 

I live in arkansas. Need I say more?
Basically, I'd have to go to TX to get the work done. The funny part is that if I have the motor pulled, then my car won't run, so getting to TX would be very difficult. My other option is building my spare bare block, but it needs to have some nicks in the deck(the it received from shipping) filled before I can use it. I'd prefer to sell it, use the cash for type S pistons, and then put them into my current running block over a weekend.

 

Send Blake (junbb1) a PM and ask him the specifics of doing it yourself to a FRM lined cylinder. In the passed I have seen the 'dingleberry' tool used a few times on my buddies b16's/b18's with no problem. but then again this was for a plain jane set-up.

Is the block still in the car or is it out of the car and bare?

 

I've got one in the car and one that's bare.

 

Those dingleberry hones will not work,it needs to be a fine non ferrous hone,like 600 grit or so.I say just check to see if its out of round and if there is much of a taper.If not,then just use them as is with new rings.

 

I've been wondering the same thing.

IMO, it may not NEED to be honed, but I am a firm believer in having the rings seat correctly thie first time, so I may end up running a very fine hone over each cylinder to help seat the rings; I just don't see how a fine hone could hurt anything.

 

I think his main concern here is that there is no one skilled in the area to do it.

Are you sure? have you checked around fully? There must be some built hondas around somehwere?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by satan_srv &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Are you sure? have you checked around fully? There must be some built hondas around somehwere?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've been to the races here. There's nobody worth running here(ie. nobody's built, no turbo'd hondas, nothing) I scared these kids with just a small shot of nitrous. I know that I could find a shot that would do it, but they wouldn't be experienced with Hondas much less H22s. If I could just drop the pistons out and put new ones in that would make life much easier. However, I won't half *** it either. If honing the cylinders will help the motor's performance and longevity then I'm taking my motor on a roadtrip somehow.

 

this is how i look at it. do it right the first time, it'll cost you a little more to get a machine shop to hone out the cylinders but it'll save you time and money in the long run. what will you do if your car is out of commission for weeks or even months while you have to there down the block again and get it honed cause you didn't have good compression in all 4 cylinders.

 

Have you rebuilt an h22 before?

 

If you want to ship your block to me I can have it honed at the machine shop that does all of my machine work. They do a great job and the prices are very reasonable. Do it right the first time, or you'll end up doing it again very soon. I am not a fan of the dingleberry process for built motors personally...

 

I have never seen a motor that didn't need to be honed when you replaced the rings, but then again I've never built a motor w/ FRM.

I'm trusting most people's opinions on here that FRM doesn't NEED to be honed, but it just makes sense to me that doing a slight hone can't hurt anything, and SHOULD help, if just a little.

Most places will charge about $10 per cyilnder to hone. For that money, you can go get a hone yourself and the stones you need, and do the job correctly. It's not hard at all, and you don't have to worry about somebody doing a bad job.

 

doing ANYTHING to the sleeves of an H22 besides replacing them is asking for trouble. If there is a question of to do it or not to do it, don't do it. Anything you do to the FRM coating only weakens it, and it's not strong to begin with.

I had a piston overheat from either not oiling or the heat from the JRSC I used to run and the piston went right through the FRM and into the sleeve material. When we removed the piston, the FRM looked like tiny pieces of thin aluminum foil on the side of the piston.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nocturnal &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">doing ANYTHING to the sleeves of an H22 besides replacing them is asking for trouble. If there is a question of to do it or not to do it, don't do it. Anything you do to the FRM coating only weakens it, and it's not strong to begin with.

I had a piston overheat from either not oiling or the heat from the JRSC I used to run and the piston went right through the FRM and into the sleeve material. When we removed the piston, the FRM looked like tiny pieces of thin aluminum foil on the side of the piston.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Were you running forged pistons, or stock?

The FRM is a fairly thick lining that should withstand a hone job. Although, my experience with FRM is very limited... every block I've ever owned was sleeved before it even went near my car. LOL Sooo, I guess I'm the wrong person to ask.

Almost ANY machine shop (V8 or otherwise) should be able to do it if they deal with motors at all. If you really want to know, why not call a Honda dealership and ask one of the older mechanics? See what they do.

Why don't you just sleeve that bastige and get it over with?

 

FRM is actually quite durable for NA if the correct pistons are used (Type-S, stock (JDM, USDM), Jun). However, it sucks for FI. Also, there are very few machine shops that are Honda authorized to bore out or hone FRM. Apparently, Honda does not trust most machine shops to do the job correctly.

 

My motor in my prelude was rebuilt recently with Type S pistons, rods, pins, etc.... I had some slight scratches in my sleeves on cylinder 1 (from burnt piston ring), so my mechanic did a slight hone to remove scracthes on cylinder 1 and honed the other sleeves equally. I have had no problems since.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by littlechoppab20 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My motor in my prelude was rebuilt recently with Type S pistons, rods, pins, etc.... I had some slight scratches in my sleeves on cylinder 1 (from burnt piston ring), so my mechanic did a slight hone to remove scracthes on cylinder 1 and honed the other sleeves equally. I have had no problems since.</TD></TR></TABLE>
how many miles ago was that, and what kind of treatment does you car receive on a daily basis.

this is a hard question to answer, on one had you don't want to half *** it but it very hard to find some one experienced enough that you would trust doing this close by.
and on the other hand, the majority of people and the helms says if its not messed up don't hone or bore. also i remeber this topic coming up in the past and a "supposed" old honda machinic was said to have older legends and other cars with FRM come in and they would just drop in new piston and rings and thats that.

and come to think of it , the hone that would be done to a FRM block would have to be done right. i mean every h22 and h23 block that i have looked at has a VERY smooth silky feel to the cylinder walls, and on NONE of the cyclinder walls even where the rings don't ride, i can't find and indication of past hone. neway that just my .02 cents. if it were my motor im not sure what i would do. i think i would call my local honda dealership and ask around there.

 

It has been about a year since I've had the work done now. The car is still running in excellent condition. On a daily basis, I drive every car I sit in pretty hard (even when I have to go borrow my parents mini-van), so I think it has stood up to the test. The mechanic that did the work on my car stated that if I hadn't scratched the sleeves, he would be able to drop in the pistons and new rings, but since I did, he would have to do a slight hone to get them out.