I have a 00 Si and I need yet another set of wheels since I stuck A032R-S's on my former autocross wheels for open track events.
I'm going to get 13x8's, but I'm not sure exactly what backspacing I need, or who to buy from for that matter.

I talked to a guy at the Peru National Tour with a GSR, the guy who drives the Redshift Motorsports DSP car, and *I think* he said they used 4.5" backspacing. The Rota RB-8 is something like 4.675" which might be too far into the fenders to fit.

Anyway, anyone have any experience doing this size wheel on a 6th gen (or 5th gen)? Brake clearance shouldn't be a problem with most racing wheels, at least according to the measurements I've taken.

 

Volk TE37 (13x8) $320
Panasport C8 3-piece (13x8, 13x8.5, 13x9) ~$250?
Lenso VPD "Tom Slicks" (13x7.5) $120

These wheels will fit OTS. If you are looking for something custom I believe you need 5" backspace.

The guy you spoke with was probably Matt Watkins.

 

That's the guy. Yeah, I also talked to Chris Raglin about his SM Civic with the VPD's and thought hard about those. I might still do that. The extra .5 inch isn't going to be important, except to help keep weight down. I'm just running DSP next year as a lark to mess with some of the guys who usually top the Index around here. SM index was a little hard to overcome last year, heh.

Anyway, thanks for the input. I thought the factory backspace was 5" and you need to use a smaller backspace to fit the 8" rim without interfering with the suspension? I'm not worried about staying within the fenders so much.

Speaking of DSP...

How are you liking the GSR? My car really needs some more spring rate and more damping as well before I'll feel like I'm anywhere close to getting the setup right. 400/500 just doesn't cut it with Hoosiers on the car. Matt said he really liked the Advance Designs but I'm thinking of just revalving the Konis, since I'm not swimming in money just yet.


EDIT again:

You autocross in SFR, have you noticed a guy with a red E46 M3 running street tires in SM? I used to autocross with him before he moved out there from STL.


Modified by SiLooksStock at 1:10 AM 11/14/2003

 

I have a set of 13x8 Willamette lightweights for sale with 5" backspace. I just haven't got around to posting a 'for sale' thread. They fit 5th gen Civics with no brake clearance issues. I can't comment about the 6th gen's though.

These are the wheels. The tires stay with me.

 

Hmm. the DX's had the 9.5" fronts right? Any chance you have a friend with a GSR or Si whose car you could try them on, and/or could you do some measuring for me?

Could use dims from hub face to inside wheel face where it is closest to the caliper, and radius from the center of hub to the narrowest point at which the shell might interfere with the caliper, if that makes any sense.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SiLooksStock &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> if that makes any sense. </TD></TR></TABLE>

No, but I'll find a GSR to test fit for you.

 

A 1/2" is a big deal on a car as heavy as yours when discussing 13" wheels.

If not, then everyone would be running the cheaper 13x7.5" Lensos. Keep in mind that most guys run 13x8.5" wheels.

 

It's not a big deal when I'm not serious about competing nationally in a car that's already seriously handicapped compared to the other cars in the class, namely the 3-series. I'm just running DSP for fun this year since I'm focusing on getting my competition license within the next two years.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">No, but I'll find a GSR to test fit for you.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks man. Question: Do you have ITA on the side of the egg because you have a SOHC VTEC drivetrain sitting around to swap in and out for the switch to ITA from ITC?


Modified by SiLooksStock at 4:57 AM 11/14/2003

 

ITC is a Solo-I classification. Plans are to run ITA next year.

 

Damn, owned by reading skills, didn't even see your sig.

Just checked my 03 GCR, I imagine I should probably tell my friend he's going to have run ITS in his 92 Si. woops.


Modified by SiLooksStock at 6:07 AM 11/14/2003

 

dammit rich, i thought we already decided that the 13's would offer no advantage over the 15s.

come on man, make your mind up already.

 

Ok, not really OT, but i keep seeing people on here mention that the stock Honda 13" backspacing is 5". Think about that... 5" backspacing on a 5" wide wheel????

AFAIK, the 13x5 offset is like 40ish-42mm. If we do a little math we can come up with the following

Stock wheel is 5" wide x 25.4 = 127mm
Wheel center line is 127/2 = 63.5mm
Adding 40 offset gives us 63.5+40 = 103.5 backspace in mm = ~4inch backspace

The reason 4.5-5.0" BS on wide wheels works is that the stock wheel leaves a good inch or so room on the inside. And what we want is to get the wide-*** wheel as far inboard as possible...

Hope this made sense now.

 

Stock Si wheel is 6" wide = 152.4mm /2 = 76.2mm +42(stock offset) = 118.2mm/25.4 = 4.68" backspace. I guess it's easier to round up when talking about backspace so that's why people say that rather than typing out 4.68, heh.

 

I love driving the GSR in DSP. It's an underdog, no doubt about that, but give me another 5 years of car/driver development and I think I'll stand a better chance at Nationals. Regarless of how competitive the car is nationaly it a ton of fun driving on tiny 13s with race tires.

SM Red E36 M3? I think I recall seeing one at the last event. What's his name?

 

It's an E46 SMG, his name's Jason Sams. I think he's still using 46 SM as his number. He's been running with stock wheels and BFG KD's, but I believe he wants to run his SSR's and some Kumho r-comps all the time now.

I agree about the possibilities, I think both our cars could be competitive in the class with the right setup. Would need some serious hot shoe-ing to get the job done at Nats though, it's hard to argue with all that displacement and right-wheel-drive in the Bimmers.

The Si will be under 2400 lbs sans driver next season, weighed in at 2450 in Peru before I did my seats/wheels/AC delete, so maybe the H/A's could get them with weight.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SiLooksStock &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Stock Si wheel is 6" wide = 152.4mm /2 = 76.2mm +42(stock offset) = 118.2mm/25.4 = 4.68" backspace. I guess it's easier to round up when talking about backspace so that's why people say that rather than typing out 4.68, heh.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ok. You were talking about the stock 15x6. Ok. I was referring to another post where someone mentioned the stock 13" backspacing is 5".

 

John,

I called Willamette back when they were still around and they said that their 13s wouldn't fit over GSR calipers (I believe 6th gen Civics are the same). However, I would like to see it tested regardless.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SiLooksStock &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I talked to a guy at the Peru National Tour with a GSR, the guy who drives the Redshift Motorsports DSP car, and *I think* he said they used 4.5" backspacing. The Rota RB-8 is something like 4.675" which might be too far into the fenders to fit.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hey, sounds like you talked to me! All this talk about wheels and DSP and I missed it completely! Any-who... 5" backspacing is what I'm using currently. I'm so late to this conversation you guys have probably already resolved this. You're big concerns are as follows... A) clearing the calipers with the actual Diameter of the wheel and B) clearing the suspension components with the proper back space.

 

If I recall correctly a 14" rim has about 2mm of clearance... so i see no way possible that a 13" will work unless your pullin some major spacing..

 

/\/\/\/\/\ but, but, but... both of the teg drivers above are using 13"x8" wheels over stock 4-lug, 10.x", Integra front brakes (GSR/LS/RS/SE).....

I too look forward to using 13x8's over Integra brakes...
but I will have to go back to 'GSR' rotors and calipers (or forget it and stay with the 15x6.5's since they are cheap)

anyhoo, civics on 13x8 Rcomps are fast around these parts

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by owen_the_soyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">/\/\/\/\/\ but, but, but... both of the teg drivers above are using 13"x8" wheels over stock 4-lug, 10.x", Integra front brakes (GSR/LS/RS/SE).....
</TD></TR></TABLE>

13x8.5 thank you very mooch!

If only I could find 245s that wern't too much taller then stock then I might give up the small wheels... unfortunatly 24.5" overall diameter of a 245/45/16 (smallest 245 hoosier autocross tire out there) vs 20.7" of the 225/45/13s is tough to justify.

 

matt, do what rodney did....run 225's stretched over 15x8.5's

 

I have some Circle Racing 13x8's w/5"BS and 1/4 spacers and they won't clear my Si calipers. Since we're both running DSP, we can't touch the calipers and shave them a bit.

So what wheels are you guys using that do clear the calipers in a 13x8 size?

 

Read the second post

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by carl_aka_carlos &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">matt, do what rodney did....run 225's stretched
over
15x8.5's</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah... unfortunatly that won't get me any more rubber on the road. Then we get back into the traditional arguement of overheating a small tire versus vs the worse gear and added weight of a large tire. Just what I want... to discuss this AGAIN. No... seriously, lets discuss this again.

You got the 225/45/13 Hoosier
- 8.6 Tread width (from Hoosier stats)
- 20.7 Diameter (from Hoosier)
- about 15lbs measure on my scale
- mounted on panasport 13x8.5 wheels (9-10lbs)
- Total measured weight 25lbs

You got the 225/45/15 Hoosier
- 8.6 Tread width (from Hoosier stats)
- 22.8 Diameter (from Hoosier)
- &gt; 15 lb
- Diamond 15x8.5 wheels (~15lbs if I recall)
- Total Guestimate weight of 30+ pounds

Assumptions
- later then 1994 GS-R tranny
- We'll assume stock 8200 fuel cut-off

Gearing differences between the two
With the 13s we have :
1st 35.5
2nd 60.4
Slow Corner Speeds (5000 RPM)
1st - 21.7
2nd - 36.8

With the 15s we have :
1st - 39.1
2nd - 66.5
Slow Corner Speeds (5000 RPM)
1st - 23.9
2nd - 40.6

Just some thoughts...
Short tires are equivalent to having a 4.850 final drive on the car.
Less likely to need 3rd gear with the 15s.
More Likely to need to go to 1st with 15s for a slow corner.
Shorter tires are more prone to overheating.
Take longer to get the taller tires up to temperature with only 3 runs
Tall tires have more rotating mass and it is farther from the center of the wheel