not really a comparison of which one is better but i want to know what are the pros and cons (if any) of both cams such as idle quality power band and what would be a decent rev limit

 

i thought toda made spoon cams?

 

Toda As & Spoons will both provide stock idles.

Spoons & Todas are both good to about 8800 RPM.

Both cams will like high compression.

Spoons are made by Honda.

Todas are made by Toda.

If you've ever looked at the 2 cams side by side, they are noticably different in metal color.

BTW, I have an extra set of Spoon cams for sale if anyone's interested.

Loc

 

Lrao,

What are some distinctive marks spoon cams have to defer from other cams? I heard they have the letters "G" and "B" between the center lobe. Do you have any pictures close up of markings or color?

Whatever information you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

Eric

 

The Spoon Cams have small grooves on the endwere the cam seal and distributor go Just like the CTR cams....as far as power goes they are nearly identical in Spec's ....but just a little bit more agressive lift and duration on the A spec's...

Anyone else..

 

Spoon and Toda are the same company I think.

STOCK GSR profile
INTAKE lift - 10.6 mm,duration - 230 @1mm
EXHAUST lift - 9.4mm, duration - 227@1mm

ITR profile
INTAKE lift - 11.5 mm,duration - 240 @1mm
EXHAUST lift - 10.5mm, duration - 235 @1mm

Toda A's
INTAKE lift - 11.6 mm,duration - 250 @1mm
EXHAUST lift - 11.2mm, duration - 240 @1mm

Spoon Integra VTEC cam
INTAKE lift - 11.53 mm, duration - 256 @1mm
EXHAUST lift - 11.13 mm, duration - 245 @1mm

 

thanks guys for some help peepss have told me that stovk compression is not good for the toda b's so i decided to go with something milder

 

Spoon and Toda are NOT the same company. What LRAO said is correct. The reason why I like the Spoons over the Toda A's is that the Spoons will give a lil more power and tq out of VTEC (nice for daily driving where I'm not trying to hit redline at every stoplight) and they usually require a lower vtec activation point. Both provide stock idle. Make sure to get the appropriate valve train to go along with the cams and a good reprogrammed ecu for fuel and ignition maps that are custom tuned to the cams and the other mods you have. Both would be a good choice. As for the B's not working with stock GSR compression, they work fine, but you won't realize their full potential without higher compression. They also take more tuning to idle ok (B's have a lil of a rough idle) and to smooth out the curve. They also require vtec points of above 7000rpm (spoons are usually around 5300rpm or so).

 

what!? a vtec x over of above 7 grand on a stock ecu how much fun are the toda b's if the fuel cut off on a stock gsr is 8100 still undecided but i think i am leaning more towards the spoons

 

who said to use the B's on a stock ecu?

that wouldn't be smart

 

A stock ECU won't handle Spec B's well. You could use a V-AFC/SFC-VTEC and an FPR to help with fuel and vtec, but it's still a bandaid method. Since all these cams (Spoon, Toda A, Toda B, etc.) continue make power past stock redline, that's why it's recommended to get a reprogrammed ECU or standalone to have the proper fuel and ignition maps (instead of just tweaked ones) and also to help transition fuel and ignition maps when vtec hits and to raise the redline...like you said, 7300rpm vtec and 8100rpm redline isn't all that fun...but 7300rpm vtec and 9300rpm redline...ah, now that's screaming fun! (just don't do that too often! )

 

i have a vafc as well as a jdm dc header, icebox, etc (i am trying to find a cat and cat back right now) the ecu is kinda hard to get cuz only a few peeps reprogram obd2's and i also want to know how much can a stock gsr bottom handle (rev wise)
8700? 8800?


[Modified by alexboy, 1:06 PM 8/28/2001]

 

The jdm dc header has a 2.5" collector right?, if so, SMSP cats are good (they use carsound cats) so contact him for cats. Have a custom 2.5" cat-back made if you don't want any bottle-necks. You want 2.5" all the way back. The only ones I know of that reprogram obd2's are Dan (godspeed), AJR, and Yoshio...and I think even they can only do first-gen obd2's (<99). As for the stock bottom end, it should be able to handle the 9000+rpms cuz B18C's have a block girdle, but you shouldn't be hitting that high an rpm all the time or be staying there constantly. If you're very concerned, have the bottom end rotating assembly balanced. I think Dan's ECU's default to 9300redline (but you can specify to him what you want or get his input for your exact setup) and AJR's ECU's are 9200redline. Shift at about 8800-9000rpm as the power starts falling off with the cams around there. Do a dyno to make sure and tune.

 

its not bottom end u have to be worried about its ur valvetrain
stock GSR valvetrain can handle up to 8200 that's stock ECU fuel cut off.
when u get a reprogramed ECU, usually u need to beef up ur valvetrain.
portflow inner valvesprings and ITR outer valvesprings with titanium retainers
can handle revs past 8500+
if u can do this, then Toda B's are doable.
my plan is to get A's and may consider spoons. well see since i have ITr cams
and alot of tuning potential for power

 

I assume he will be taking the proper measures for his valvetrain to allow him to rev past stock redline. As for the bottom end, they don't come balanced from the factory. Tho the block girdle helps a lot to minimize vibration, it still occurs in the block and can wear bearings if he's always at a high rpm. Balancing the rotating assembly would be good to do if you have the funds.

 

i will get the proper springs for the cams i choose. that isnt the concern. i mainly am deciding on the cams though i think the b's will be to agressive for what i want seing as though i am not planning serious engine work for this integra. i once considered the jun 2's also but didn't get much feed back i am interested in the hitech twin loop exhaust but it seems it is impossible to aquire one


[Modified by alexboy, 3:57 PM 8/28/2001]

 

You'll get very similar gains with the Jun 2's as you would with Spoon's. The Jun's typically require lower vtec points than the respective Toda's. They also tend to give more torque and are more peaky on HP (a lot of top end power) while the Toda's tend to be able to continue to make power at a lil higher rpms than the Jun's. I still like the Spoon's for their good non-vtec power/tq and very low (comparably speaking) vtec point. Either way, get a good ecu. Any would be a good choice and all have perfect idle.

 

spoon cams are made from the same core as CTR cams - they are rusty brownish in color (unlike the cams i got - ripped off). I think the cams should have what appears to be a hole in between lobes. i like spoons over toda cause they're made for spoon by honda. In most cases nobody makes better stuff for honda than honda HEY dragdc2 i have pics sent to me by A&J racing - I'll see if i can find them and mail them to you


[Modified by 2000-4DRGSR, 5:56 PM 8/28/2001]

 

About Spoon quality versus Toda, both are exceptionnal and have the appropriate price tags.

Go with Toda/Spoon valvetrain when raising limit (or using cams more aggressive than As).

 

so which cam is better? todas, juns or spoons?