This has been a problem plaguing me for a couple of months. During a track weekend at Mid-Ohio during T8 or T9 (which ever is the Madness...hard left downhill) my engine completely shut off, and would not start for about 30 seconds.

Now it dies at every autocross since (3 of em), every single run. I'm stranded on course looking like a moron, or I must use my momentum to slowly crawl back to grid (naturally, the anouncer claims that I need to passenger since I keep getting lost on course ).
I realized today that it happens only on left turns. I was railin' through the first section of right handers, but as soon as I hit the left hand sweeper, car shuts off. It doesn't really bog; the revs drop to zero and there's suddenly no throttle response followed by lack of power steering/brakes (pretty annoying mid-way through a run). During my last run, I went into this same left hander a good deal slower, and I could definitely feel it beginning to die, but it straightened out (engine kept running) when the corner was finished.

I am having issues with my Main Fuel Relay, where my car occaisionally won't start when its hot out. I'm not certain this is the culprit, however, as the relay should pretty much be stable once the engine is running. Other things I've checked:
-Coil is good.
-Plugs/wires are good.
-No faulty connections at igniter, yet I'm not sure how to check it (resistance?).
-Fuel filter replaced (I mention this because I believe it could be fuel starvation). I usually have a half tank at least (about 2/5 today).

Other suggestions? Didn't Shultz have an igniter issue? I cannot find a thread regarding that unfortunately.

Edit: the engine is usually running at least 4500+rpms at corner entry.

Thanks for your responses.


Modified by GSpeedR at 8:10 PM 8/26/2003

 

Does the engine 'stutter' before it dies?

It might have something to do with the fuel pickup/intank pump. When we run enduros, we will run the car until it stumbles sometimes. There is still fuel in the tank but because of the fuel sloshing, the pick up is momentarilly uncovered.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civicrr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Does the engine 'stutter' before it dies?

It might have something to do with the fuel pickup/intank pump. When we run enduros, we will run the car until it stumbles sometimes. There is still fuel in the tank but because of the fuel sloshing, the pick up is momentarilly uncovered.</TD></TR></TABLE>

When I increase the throttle, the tach continues to drop (which is why I think it's fuel starvation), but it doesn't stutter or try to recover. It's a pretty steady drop, but not extremely rapid. The engine is kept spinning (until the car stops or I disengage the clutch) since it occurs when the clutch is engaged.

 

I would suggest checking the fuel relay & intank pump. The pumps have been know to fail. You could have gotten a bad replacement relay.

Good Luck

 

Crank Walk?

Dan

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by zyg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Here's an idea that just struck me ... maybe your motor is moving around so much that you're losing grounding (broken ground wires/straps, broken engine mounts, etc...)</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's an easy one to check.

Hmmm...another suggestion, I've received: oil in the PVC valve. It should be followed by some decent smoke, which I'm detecting none of.

goes to make sure he's properly grounded...and then will check the car

 

You mentioned a problem with the relay. I used to have the same problem in my 91 Si, wouldn't start when it was hot. Turned out to be cracked solder on the relay board. Easy fix with a soldering iron.

Somthing to look into.

 

in some hondas (including the 88 and 89 civic's i've had), there is a fuel pick-up issue. Try running a full tank of gas and see if you can get the car to do it. I have to run my tank absolutely full in my 88 hybrid in STS to keep it from starving for fuel. In fact, I ran a Pro Solo and starved, and when i went to fill it, I was only able to put in 4 gallons. So, definitely try running full to see if that helps.
Chris Shenefield
1988 Honda Civic (99 STS)

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Lt. Dan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Crank Walk?</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's a new one. I don't see how a left hand turn would cause this vs. a right hander, though. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

I'm going to remove the MFR today and crack it open and try to resolder it. I don't think this will solve my problem on the track/autocross course, though.

I will run a full tank, but unfortunately, I won't be able to test that until the 14th (the next OVR autocross). This is something I can't (and shouldn't) test on the street either as it requires some decent lateral g's.

 

You in the Teal (or close to it) Teg?

I was working the course at the time when you were running.

Just curious.

I drive the EP white hatch with a sweet black hood.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Eee Pee &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You in the Teal (or close to it) Teg?

I was working the course at the time when you were running.

Just curious.

I drive the EP white hatch with a sweet black hood.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yep, that's me. I recognized your car, but I didn't see you. I would have said Hey otherwise. Your car is pretty quick (I worked during your heat), and I like the plates.

On my second run or so, I threw it into neutral immediately and restarted it, started moving and then it died again at the left hander right at the finish.

BTW the Airport course sucks! I'll probably be at the event on the 14th with a completely full tank of gas, replaced MFR, and (hopefully) a whole lotta luck.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSpeedR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BTW the Airport course sucks! I'll WILL be at the event on the 14th with a completely full tank of gas, replaced MFR, and (hopefully) a whole lotta luck. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Ackerman is 10x better.

See you there.

Good luck...

 

G2 integras fuel starve in right handers before they run out of gas. Sometimes quite spectacularly if you're coming out of the carousel at CMP in 3rd gear, WOT at about 6000 rpm.

So no, fuel starving isnt your problem. Check your fuel pump wiring though.

 

Coming out of NASCAR 2(left-hander) at Lowe's Motor Speedway, mine cutout with about 1/8 of a tank still left. Make sure you have enough fuel.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSpeedR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

That's a new one. I don't see how a left hand turn would cause this vs. a right hander, though. Anyone have any thoughts on this?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I remember when I was looking into buying a DSM that one way to check for crankwalk was characteristics of left or right hand turning. Found a link. Doesn't sound to be your problem, though. I have a crappy scan of the Helms if you want, too.

BTW, I saw you this weekend at the OVR event. Didn't get a chance to say hey, though. I should be up and running for the next event.

 

Has Karl been near your car?

 

This is something I can't (and shouldn't) test on the street either as it requires some decent lateral g's.



That's what big empty parking lots are for. And cops won't say a thing if you are doing something legit.

 

Eee Pee: well, I guess you talked me into it.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That's what big empty parking lots are for. And cops won't say a thing if you are doing something legit.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, there's one right next to my house. So I'll some "testing" later on today. Maybe I'll set up a mini course.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1gTeg90 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Has Karl been near your car?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Unless the virus has gone airbourne, I should be safe in Ohio.

clm: are you going to the Sept. 14th event?

So, I can probably count fuel starvation out, which was what I hoped was the problem. I cleaned out the area around the sending unit, but did not remove it. Unfortunately, I have to drop the tank to get to the pump, which will tank a while.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSpeedR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
clm: are you going to the Sept. 14th event?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hopefully. Need new LCAs and put the new coil-overs and shocks on.

 

Hopefully, I'll have the car sorted by then, cuz you don't turn very good times, when youexpcet the car to die on course...

 

Hmmm...I took it to an empty parking lot, and sure enough the car cut out during a hard left turn.

Note: it will not cut-out with the clutch disengaged (car in neutral). I find this interesting.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSpeedR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hmmm...I took it to an empty parking lot, and sure enough the car cut out during a hard left turn.

Note: it will not cut-out with the clutch disengaged (car in neutral). I find this interesting.</TD></TR></TABLE>

it probably doesn't happen when the clutch is disengaged because you aren't using as much fuel in this situation. what you are describing sounds very much like load induced fuel starve. ie, the gas is on one side of the tank, the pickup is on the other. it seems odd that you get this turning left instead of the typical right. however, shenefields car fuel starves in either direction with anything less then a 3/4 of a tank. tim aro also has fuel starve issues in his csp mr-spyder. try the same test with a full tank of fuel. if you still have a problem, i would check the fuel tank straps and see if the tank is shifting and pinching a fuel line/shutting off the fuel pump. the carbon canister might be another source for this problem. has anyone remarked that when this happens your exhaust smells funny/smokes/does other weird things?

nate

 

*sigh*

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">G2 integras fuel starve in right handers before they run out of gas. </TD></TR></TABLE>

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by solo-x &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
has anyone remarked that when this happens your exhaust smells funny/smokes/does other weird things?

nate</TD></TR></TABLE>

I remember when it died on himat Mid-Ohio he mentioned what appeared to be white smoke from the engine bay. I'm unsure of the exhaust, however.