Hi Guys, 1st post, just found this forum.
I'm about to take delivery of a Superformance S1 and have hopes of finding a low mileage F20C1 w/trans& ECU to install----anyone have a good lead?
Also, I have found a JDM F20C1-----the owner wants more than I'm willing to pay, but he claims that it has a much higher output than the American market version-------is it worth the extra bucks & where do I find the specs? Thanks

 

JDM has 11.7:1 compression vs usa at 11.0:1 (i think), so it is something like 247hp for the JDM vs 237hp (rounded up to 240) for the USA version.

Normall the F20C is too tall for most Super 7's. There is some semi shitty place in texas that is make replica's...WCM..they try to sell them on ebay...they cost about $30-$35k..... No resale value has steered me away from these.....

Caterham & Westfield or a real 60's Lotus......

superformance, birkin, loocust......

 

Too late, S1 is on it's way. I had seriously considered Caterham, but there are no contacts nearby. I live less than 30 miles from Superformance's southeast dist. I have been looking also for good technical drawings of the F20C1 to be able to determine if it will fit. Any engine will be tight. The S1 the dealer was preping for a customer on site had a Miata engine and that's what they recommend----mostly from a cost standpoint. I opt for more power but the choices is I-4 RWD are limited.

 

You will be very happy with the superformance cars, I have helped install motors and do general maintince on several of the cobra's and there products are very well put together. The F20c does fit in the superformance as far as the last rep that I spoke to, which was ~4 months ago. Your best bet is http://www.s2ki.com and to search the classifieds, plus they have a sponser that parts out motors/cars.

the JDM version is a rip you are much better off finding a USDM motor as they are much more plentiful plus shipping will not factor into play. Last I saw they were going about 4-5K with tranny for a really low milage example.

 

might not be cheap, but it would be fast. put in a 13b twin turbo mazda rotary. i believe those engines are rather small, and they definately have potential.

 

Thanks for the info. I believe that the S1 is very well built from what I've seen. Initially was going to do the Cobra bit, but have liked the 7 ever since watching "The Prisioner" as a kid.

Do you recall any remarks about having to modify the shifter? Or interference on the intake side of the engine?

About the JDM, most are asking 6-7K for a low mileage combo, ouch!

Also I need to set up the ECU, etc. as a closed loop---any suggestions?

I've been out of the performance "loop" for a long time, although twenty five years ago I was into turbocharging my street car and building 600hp 2,300 pound modified racers--------things have changed somewhat.

 

I have considered that option. Still up in the air, but leaning hard to the F20C1. Read a recent article about a S1 with a Rotary, impressive performance.

 

The final S1 with F20C will weigh.......1300lbs-1400lbs.???

Should still move out quickly. It will end up costing you about $30k though by the time it is all done unless you are building it yourself...in which case you will give up and sell the pieces that are in your garage in 2 years. (joking).

anyway.... have fun with it..... the resale scared me away and the unreliability of the things..... when they stay together they go like mad, but i think there is too much custom work to be done.

 

Fedora,

Is your S1 right or left hand drive?

Who is responsible for building engine mounts / installing the engine?

If your S1 is right hand drive, you may want to consider using a CBR 929RR motor.

It's a little trickier than a car motor, but the problem has already been solved by many kind folks in the UK.

http://www.stuart-taylor.co.uk
http://www.mkengineering.co.uk
http://biketransplant.tripod.com/

I believe that dwarf car racers also use big bore sportbike engines -- I know you can buy driveshaft adapters pre-fabricated. ($75?) I presume that you may do the same for shifters, pedal linkages, etc.

Oh, and to the lotus purist: locost =

 

I hope to be under 1,400 wet.

The custom part doesn't bother me. We used to build modified circle track cars starting with a pile of tubing and a roof section-----everything else was hand made.

 

Mine is left hand drive. I will be doing all the fabrication and installation.

I am not familiar with that particular engine----why will it not work in left hand drive cars?

 

I checked out the Stuart-Taylor site, nice line-up, the Phoenix looks a lot like a kit car from the 1960's that is back in production here called the Cheetah.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fedora &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I checked out the Stuart-Taylor site, nice line-up, the Phoenix looks a lot like a kit car from the 1960's that is back in production here called the Cheetah.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Does look like the Cheetah in a weird way.

Do post pictures when you get done. I think I post pictures of my semi-tube 917 replica a while back but I don't remember if I did it on this site. The rotary that was suggested has been done quite a few times though. Closed loop running seems really odd, most people that I have seen use the F20c in unusual chassie's just go with the standard ECU or if upgraded with boost the AEM system.

Going through the same thing you are right now, I have been trying to find a way to get a EJ20 into a vintage 550 spyder for some time.

 

"EJ20 into a vintage 550 spyder " You have your work cut out for you on that one. I've toyed with the idea of one of the Beck 550's myself, apparently now they are only sold as complete cars.

I'll post photos when I finish my S1, it may be months though as I'm going into my busy season with my business. I'd like to see some pics of the 917.

 

It's a motorbike engine.

900cc, weighs about 150lbs, and I believe that includes the transmission.

You need to run right hand drive because of the location of the chain output, and angle of the motor.

You'll also need to install a reverse box between the motor and the rear end unless you can live with using the 'manual reverse' method.

The big plusses of using a bike engine in a seven are:

- light weight. Taking 300lbs out of a seven makes a *huge* difference.
- permits you to triangulate the engine bay -- look at the stuart taylor mounts.
- have you ever heard a superbike engine north of 10,000 rpm? Ever wondered why your car couldn't sound like that? Now it can.


If you're set on staying LHD, take a look at jaxports

http://www.jaxports.com

They make a 90 degree reverse box that can be mated to a big v-twin. You'd have to spend some time with a bike wrecker to see if everything would line up nicely.

With your fabrication background, you should be able to make a bike engine work without too much difficulty.

 

The motorcycle engine thing sounds interesting. The gearboxes seem quite well engineered. When I get tired of this car, that route is a definite possibility on the next one. Thanks for the imput.

 

if you look in the Long Block section of http://www.passwordjdm.com you can find the JDM version for 2100

if you call steve tell him alex @ efzero recommended you.

 

Thanks, will do, I'll see what he has. I'm really hoping I can find engine/trans complete.

 

It was gone already. As I said, I'm really needing a engine/trany combo with wiring, they said I'm looking at 6-7K. At that I'd be better off buying a whole car from a insurance salvage auction and then selling off what I don't need.

Thanks for the lead

 

My Superformance S1 has arrived. As soon as I figure out what I did with my digital camera and how to post the photos-----I will. It may be October before I get it on the road due to heavy work load and delays finding exactly what I want in the way of a powertrain.


Modified by fedora at 10:57 PM 7/29/2003

 

Here's some pix of a nice kit:

 

What about resale on that bad boy????

There is a hell of a lot of performance in a 1300lb car with 240 reliable hp!

 

nice

 

That car is a WCM Ultralite. I thought about one of those, but with lack of convertible top would nix the joy of driving it to the beach or the mountains for a weekend. WCM has some impressive performance figures, but as often as we have sudden rain showers here in the southeast, I opted not to be locked into having to sprint to the house very time it thundered.

 

I trust that you have taken a good look at the measurements of the transmission in this configuration as well as the engine/intake/exhaust requirements. The transmission is no small unit and may require you to take some special steps.

It is my understanding that Baker Racing in Massachusetts is installing the F20C into Birkin chassis successfully but that they have been modified at the factory to accommodate the S2000 tramsmission.

If you are going to run naturally aspirated, you will be able to successfully use the stock ECU together with an Apexi VAFC to manage the closed-loop operation where you'll be most of the time if you track the car.

If you go FI, you may wish to contact http://www.torquefreaks.com about installing an AEM EMS and wide-band O2. They have recently been very successful in tuning two semi-exotic FI setups on S2000 on the east coast. Both owners are very happy.

If you go FI, consider using a beefier rear assembly and drive.