i'm about to do swaps in a 91 crx dx ( zc/z6 ) and 91 civic lx ( b16/b20 ). anyone in richmond w/ swaps in your similar car that would be willing to share wisdom and experience with me ? i'm mostly curious about feel of various motors in each car, hence .. learning from others mistakes . any help would be appreciated !!

 

I live in Northern, VA (Fairfax). Which car and what help do you need?

 

mostly i'm just wanting personal feedback on particular motors in particular chasis. i'm swapping either a zc or a z6 into the crx, its an auto so my options are limited, and a b16 or b20 into the sedan, so i wanna know the drivers opinions on what motor feels the best and potential problems ahead of time. plus would be nice to know someone close when the swap starts in case i run into unforseen problems.

 

well I've driven an dohc zc crx and owned a b16 crx. I've also raced the b16 crx vs the zc crx and punished it. All I had was an intake and he had i/h/e. If you have the money for the b16 do it, don't do the zc. I'd do it if money was an issue. The zc is no fun above 5k. My vote for both cars is b16, although torque is nice in the b20. But I've only been in a b20vtec so don't have any experiance with a straight b20.

 

yeah, i had and just sold a zc crx .. not alotta fun. but i don't want a difficult swap in that one and i want to retain the auto tranny. i just want it as a back-up car to my back up car ... which will be the sedan. that i want to have fun with so i want to go with a b16/b20, something with some more power to move the lard **** sedan. i really don't think i'm mechanically inclined enough to go inside the engine and do a vtec head at this point so i would prob just stay straight b20. i'm interested to ride in a b20 civic just to get an idea of what to expect.

 

Man stop bein lazy, read up on the b20vtec and do it yourself. It's really simple. Just take your time and don't half *** anything. It will be well worth it. The b20's redline is like 6500 so that won't be any fun. My friend has a stock bottom end stock head crvtec. Just a vtec head slapped on a b20 block and that thing kick's ***. It's in a del slow which weights alot but even a low compression crvtec he's chirpin the tires at 4th gear. Plug up the whole on the vtec, move the dowel holes, get a vtec water and oil pump and timing belt and run a line from the oil pressure to the head and your good to go. E-mail me for any questions. I'll be in richmond in aug (but not with my car )

 

im in the west end should u need a hand

 

what are your feelings for your cars set-up ? do you wish you would have done something different now or like what you have ?

 

ZC is a huge improvement over stock, not as fast as a B18C5 is but it is not much more expensive than the custom mounts alone for a B series swap., I have a ZC engine and tranny in my '89 DX hatch, and never regetted the swap. Its a daily driver, as reliable as the sun, gets me 34 mpg on the highway and is plenty fast. Two years after my swap I still never regretted it. I don't race it so its not an issue. But is 100% better than the stock lump that came in this car.

 

no regrets here b16a all the way but the zc is allright just better starting point w/b16a

 

this is what i want...a awesome daily driver..with the ambitions of turbo some day...

 

Well with a set of eagle rods you can do a real nice turbo on a ZC, its lighter and a lot cheaper than the B16 and the custom mounts needed to put it in. If you are going ***** to the wall and going racing the "B" may be a better deal, for a daily driver, and maybe turbo a ZC has a lot of advantages on the price front, and the fact you are 100+ lbs lighter than the B16 to start. Try to find 100 lbs to lose in the car somewhere else. It starts with a Hp disadvantage but has a nice weight advantage that offsets it somewhat. Eagle rods & junkward turbo are about the same as the extra you pay for a B16 and what the custom mounts and the custom shift linkage cost. If saving money matters ZC is best choice, if money is no option just go for the B18C5.

 

i would definantely consider converting that crx to manual when you do an engine swap. It would be so much better. Is the sedan auto too?

 

well, the crx i'm not going to worry with converting because it's my 3rd car. i picked it up real cheap about 2 years ago with a blown motor and just haven't touched it yet. i want to get it running now though because i miss my crx i just sold !! but just outta curiosity, how hard is it to swap to manual ???

the sedan is 5-speed though thank god .. just waiting on the shipping company to send it to me !

as far as a junkyard turbo ... what is involved and what kinda price are we talking ? i'm assuming i would only be able to run small boost amounts . or do the rods help that much ?

 

a 5 speed conversion probably won't cost too much if you are getting a new engine anyways with a 5-speed tranny. I'm not sure of the exact parts you need, but just do a search on H-T because there are plenty of topics covering that conversion on here.

For a Junkyard turbo i'm sure you could piece a fairly nice one together for 1000-1500 dollars for the zc, z6, or whatever d series you use for the crx. I would read up on the turbo topic a lot before you go piecing one together though. There is also a wealth of information on this topic on H-T. Oh and you probably won't need rods unless you are running really high boost. I know on my y8 the stock bottom end can easily support 12psi with the right fuel managment. This is the key on building a turbo car. Fuel managment is everything.

Oh and if I was you i would keep the sedan as your daily driver and swap that b20 or b16 into the crx

 

Well if you go more tha 5-8 lbs of boost you need pistons and rods. If you go over 12 lbs boost you may want to sleeve the cylinders. Keep it under 10 and you will live on stock cylinders. Rods are the ZC's achillies heel. The crank and bottom end are strong and the head is nice but the weakest link are the rods. Put 12 lbs boost on them and they will bend. But Eagle make them for about $400 Do a search in the Forced induction forum, you will get much more info than I can possibley provide. there are various ways for fuel enrichment when you boost. its more involved that just bolting on a turbo. On ANY engine. And before you boost you want to do all the research you can. You want to do it right, or you will fry the engine. And thats true on ANY engine you do it too.

 

what size turbo are you talking about that you can't go over 8lbs. without getting rods, etc..? Maybe you are correct for the zc, but i know that with d series such as the z6 and y8 they can handle 12psi on the stock bottom end.

 

Connecting rods. Anything over 8 lbs of boost and you run the risk of bending or breaking the stock ZC CONNECTING rods. They are the weakest part of the ZC motor.

 

how strong are the other d series motors rods compared to the ZC's?

 

well, my daily driver is an '03 VW GTI 1.8 turbo ... which i love btw. the sedan and crx are just because i'm having trouble leaving the honda family i prob wouldn't go turbo with either honda because i love the feel of revving in a honda motor .. i've had 2 civic ex's, 1 '00 civic si, and 2 crx si's w/ zc's. you just can't beat the feel of a honda. my VW's power comes on so smooth i can't enjoy it because i don't realize its there most of the time ... so i want something to be able to get on backroads in south hill, spelled BFE, where my parents live and hear the motors scream .

 

nice daily driver

 

Well they are all about the same (D series rods). the Twin Cam ZC breaths far better than the rest, the 1.5 engines are pure junk. The ZC is safe to 7,200 RPM but its only safe to about 8psi boost, you may get away with more but if it blows you can kiss your block goodbye. Is the risk worth it? I don't think.

 

yeah, i love it. i wanna chip it but i'm scared because i have had a few problems with the car that has put it in for warranty work. and the APR chip voids the warranty for practically everything under the hood. i will do it sooner or later though ... the APR chip alone puts it ~14.1-14.5 in the 1/4 so that will be nice for the kid carrier

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by virginia_dude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well they are all about the same (D series rods). the Twin Cam ZC breaths far better than the rest, the 1.5 engines are pure junk. The ZC is safe to 7,200 RPM but its only safe to about 8psi boost, you may get away with more but if it blows you can kiss your block goodbye. Is the risk worth it? I don't think.</TD></TR></TABLE>

theres plenty people on this board going well over 8psi on stock internals with a D series and running pretty safely. All it takes is good tuning and fuel managment. It can easily be done with standalone systems.

 

A year ago I was seriously considering boosting mine, I got my information In the forced induction forum. I am sure some people are doing it. I am also sure some people have blown engines trying it. I was planning on doing this AND expecting it to last a long time. Any detonation during the tuning process and getting the fuel managent right and you will have piston damage. Cast pistons are very unforgiving. I highly recommend doing a search and spend a few days reading the threads. ZC rods are this engines weakest link. Followed by the cast pistons, third is cylinder movement under high boost. You will NOT be running 12+ psi boost AND expect the motor to last very long on stock internals. This isn't my opinion, this is the opinion of many on this board who have found out the hard way. If you can afford to blow an engine and buy another, then by all means do it. not all of us want to do that. I have toasted enough engines in my life due to bad luck, I don't care to do it because I did not do the prudent thing. Don't take my word on it do a search read the threads, then post a question in the Forced Induction forum and see what they tell you.


Modified by virginia_dude at 10:03 AM 6/20/2003