I ran through a quart of oil every 20-minute session at a HPDE this weekend. A couple corner workers and other drivers told me I was puffing white smoke out my tailpipe, but strangely, it only happened at 1 particular turn.

I'm running about 6lbs of boost right now. Last week, I checked my compression #'s, and they were 250,250,245,250. Does this sound like bad rings? I have not done a leakdown test.

 

Are you using a baffled oil pan?

The only instance I have ever had of white smoke coming out of my tailpipe was in a skidpad with R compound tires due to oil loading up on one side of the engine. It sounds like you may also be experiencing oil starvation in a high g corner.

Do you think this may be the culprit?

 

I agree with Reid - cuz those compression dont show #'s of wear on rings or valve seals it looks like..

 

If you are tracking the car - DEFINITELY get a baffled pan or suffer the consequences (i.e. spun crank bearing)

 

I don't have a baffled oil pan, but that's high on my wish list. The one turn where I experience white smoke goes like this: fast entry (90mph), hard brakes, blip to 2nd at 40mph, hard late apex right, hard accel. I do not know exactly where in the turn the white smoke comes out.

It's a tight turn, but not real fast. I don't think I'm generating tons of corning g's because I'm still on azenis. Would oil sloshing around w/o baffles cause such an extreme oil consumption?

 

Just think of what you car is doing man. You're likely revving to 8000+ rpm - very few cars in the world can do this. This is very hard on motor oil. Add that the heat of track usage as well as the heat soak created by your forced induction - you are simply operating the car in an envelope most passenger car motor oils aren't designed to function in.

Your oil is simply turning to vapour from all the heat. Add on G forces - what oil is left is super heated, super low viscoscity and sloshing around.

 

I'll add, I'm reving to 9k now. In my (weak) defense, after the 1st session where I noticed the oil loss, I switched from Mobil 1 5w30 to Mobil 1 15w50. I didn't expect it to make a big difference, but it was something I could do to solve the immediate problem.

If (when) I get a baffled pan, should I still expect such a drastic oil loss? It really caught me by surprise. I've never lost more than 1/2 quart over two 20-minute sessions before.

 

Jim - Try switching to a different brand oil all together. Some of us have seen less consumption with anything other than Mobil 1. I am really pleased with the cost and performance of Amsoil and there are plenty of other options.

 

Oil use seems to me to be related to heat and crankcase pressure. Less so for the type of oil. Oil consumption is common in both bone stock cars and heavily modified ones.

Anything you can do to lower the heat production of the motor should be done. Running thicker oil also helps (i use 15W-50 Motul) but does not eliminate the problem altogether.

Getting my header ceramic coated made a huge difference in underhood temps and oil consumption.

I'm planning to run some sort of catchcan system (like the Endyn one) to further help with high crankcase pressures and oil consumption issues.

 

BPR,

This still brings up the question that none of us seem to be able to answer which is why do some R's burn and some don't all with stock motors. It seems it is a hit or miss problem.

I stopped the problem in my 2000 R by changing from Mobil 1 to Amsoil and have never had the problem in my 98 R but never run anything else but the amsoil. This isn't to imply it is a direct relation to the oil brand but more the question, why some and not others . . . .

 

Trey, what weight Amsoil do you use? Switching to Amsoil and installing a mugen baffled oil pan sounds worthwhile if that would fix my problem. Still, a quart every 20 minutes seems symptomatic of something more than high temps and oil sloshing around at high G's. Then again, that could be exactly my problem. Are there any other opinions?

Edit to add: an oil cooler is also on my wish list, but seeing that I only track the car 4-5 weekends a year, it's harder to justify the price of a good system.

 

I run 5W-30. I would say try using any other brand as a test. Amsoil has to be ordered or a dealer found (Makes it exspensive) so if you don't like it you don't want to be stuck with it.

I'd even suggest trying castrol GTX oil and running the crap out of it to see if it burns.

 

Bat, you have IM.

Trey and Bat, you guys need to become Preferred Customers from Amsoil to get it at a good price. $10/6 months or $20 for 12/months and you can get Amsoil for dealer cost. I paid just over $5/quart for Amsoil when I used it in my GS-R about a year ago. 10w30 Amsoil eliminated my oil consumption in my 147k mile GS-R after using and consuming 5w30 Mobil1 for a couple years.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Asahi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BPR,

This still brings up the question that none of us seem to be able to answer which is why do some R's burn and some don't all with stock motors. It seems it is a hit or miss problem.

I stopped the problem in my 2000 R by changing from Mobil 1 to Amsoil and have never had the problem in my 98 R but never run anything else but the amsoil. This isn't to imply it is a direct relation to the oil brand but more the question, why some and not others . . . .</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

I'm wondering if this could be the reason why?

I have good comp numbers and good leakdown numbers, and yet my oil consumption is right up there with the best (or worst however you wanna look at this) of them.

I run a catchcan now, which has helped a little, will get the PCV replaced soon, and also try and relieve some of the crankcase pressure a la Endyn later on...or even drilling the valve cover and make some uh...holes everywhere....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BrewCityR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Bat, you have IM.

Trey and Bat, you guys need to become Preferred Customers from Amsoil to get it at a good price. $10/6 months or $20 for 12/months and you can get Amsoil for dealer cost. I paid just over $5/quart for Amsoil when I used it in my GS-R about a year ago. 10w30 Amsoil eliminated my oil consumption in my 147k mile GS-R after using and consuming 5w30 Mobil1 for a couple years. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Double A I am a preferred customer. I pay a little over $5 a qt shipped for my Amsoil as well.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RagingAngel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

I'm wondering if this could be the reason why?

I have good comp numbers and good leakdown numbers, and yet my oil consumption is right up there with the best (or worst however you wanna look at this) of them.

I run a catchcan now, which has helped a little, will get the PCV replaced soon, and also try and relieve some of the crankcase pressure a la Endyn later on...or even drilling the valve cover and make some uh...holes everywhere.... </TD></TR></TABLE>

I had oil consumption issues with my stock motor and again when I re-bored the block, changed pistons and broke the rings is again very carefully.

 

has anybody tried the "mototune method" of breaking in the motor?

ie. build it, warm it up fully and dyno the crap outta it?

sgT? Hello? Cheetah? All the big playas??

 

Damn man, I forgot you guys were getting together this past weekend. Hope it was fun and hopefully I can hang sometime. As for your compression #'s, that doesn't mean that your oil control rings are still good. I went through 1 1/2- 2 quarts a week and my compression numbers where within spec. (this was with or without driving hard and right after I had bought the car with 627 on the odo). After complaining to Acura about my oil consumption issue and taking the car in twice a week for a month, they replaced the rings and I haven't lost a drop since.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm running about 6lbs of boost right now</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sounds like you've got some bad turbo seals. You are probably going from boost, off, then back on really quick in the corner and it's letting alot of oil get pushed inside the turbine or compressor.

Take off your charge pipe going to your compressor and see if there's any oil in it. Also check your bearings for radial and/or axial play.

This makes even more sense when you look at the fact that your compression numbers are great. It might not be an engine problem, but a turbo problem.

Fortunately, turbo rebuilds aren't nearly as expensive as engine rebuilds.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Def &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Sounds like you've got some bad turbo seals. You are probably going from boost, off, then back on really quick in the corner and it's letting alot of oil get pushed inside the turbine or compressor.

Take off your charge pipe going to your compressor and see if there's any oil in it. Also check your bearings for radial and/or axial play.

This makes even more sense when you look at the fact that your compression numbers are great. It might not be an engine problem, but a turbo problem.

Fortunately, turbo rebuilds aren't nearly as expensive as engine rebuilds. </TD></TR></TABLE>

He's running a Jackson Racing S/C

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Asahi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

He's running a Jackson Racing S/C</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ok... there goes my theory.

If your compression is fine, you can still have bad oil control rings, but that is very unlikely.

I'd bet valve guides. You are probably pooling oil on one side of the engine in that particular corner and the bad guide/guides are allowing it to seep out and then it gets burned when you get on the throttle.

Does that particular corner turn the opposite way from most other corners on the track?

 

Sorry I'm not very active in my own thread, my home internet access crapped out, and I can only get online at work. Yet, the corner where the oil puff occurs is one of the few right-handers (track runs CC). Actually, I was told that I'm puffing right before the turn, when I'm braking real hard and downshifting into 2nd. I approach the turn around 85mph, brake real hard, blip and down to 2nd, turn in around 45mph at a late apex, pretty tight turn, and hard on the throttle.

I hadn't thought about the valve guides leaking. Is there some way to check them, or is it a cheap/easy replacement?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Batoutahell &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> where the oil puff occurs is one of the few right-handers </TD></TR></TABLE>
I saw "trackrat's" ITR puff a few times yesterday at Lowes Motor Speedway dring a fast right hander.

I went thru ~1.25 quarts yesterday in only ~180 track miles.
That is the worse I have ever experienced.

I overfill my oil level a little bit. I wonder if that and the excessive G-forces made my car burn a lot more than normal.

 

Willard, what oil are you using?

 

Mobil 1 10w-30