http://albums.photopoint.com/j/ViewP...226&p=50807989

 

to the point, huh?

 

okay, now you're just frightening the children...

 

Why even drive it in the street then?
People just have to learn to use their heads!!

 

It's not that easy. **** happens out there. Oil on the track, mechanical failures, deer, muddy runoff, and this is just the stuff I've seen before. All these can cause big accidents. On average I see at least $2000 of damage each weekend at driving schools. Sometimes that number becomes 5 digits.

The owner's name is Jeff, and his instructor Shawn was in the car too. They are both okay right now, and Jeff happened to show up on Audiworld when I posted this link. Shawn posted something on the competition board, and I suggest that you all read it.

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=47098

Warren

 

I've seen them (those posts) from the beginning, and even put a 4pt. rollbar in my CRX years ago when my driving was getting really agressive (both on and off the street).

And yes, I know **** (and accidents) happen(s).
But, as they say, ... safety is no accident.

Hell, I remember a session in my crx when I went out on 008s (first lap) and got it a bit out of shape going through 3 (tires were still cold)!!
All I'm saying is that you shouldn't try and drive at 10/10ths if you're not prepared to deal with the consequences.
Thanks for listening, I'm done. ed

 

It's interesting that that car has street tires. Perhaps if they had better rubber they would have stayed on the track. Guess it doesn't matter if you're going too fast for your ability.

 

"It's interesting that that car has street tires. Perhaps if they had better rubber they would have stayed on the track. Guess it doesn't matter if you're going too fast for your ability."

Actually, no. He would have just been going even faster before the tires broke loose, probably resulting in even more damage. I find it funny that people think race tires are safer.

 

Use a roll cage? Yeah, whatever.

I suppose next you will be telling us street racing is bad...

 

Well it looks wet that day - and my A032Rs are way better in the wet than street tires.

After reading the threads - my conclusion is that the track section this accident occurred on is very dangerous and perhaps should be modified with cones to slow inexperienced drivers down - i.e. those that may lift throttle mid corner (i.e. a very BAD thing to do in a RWD 50/50 balance car like the BMW) or apex too early.

BTW what the hell are TREES doing near a high speed dangerous corner?? WTF?

Or perhaps the cars tires were overheated and just broke loose - again this would not happen as easily with R compount <u> DOT legal </u> tires. I'm not advocating slicks here - which are strictly for advanced drivers - but a better tire like an A032R or Proxes RA-1 may have given the driver a chance.....I wasn't there...I don't know. Just commenting. Flame suit on. Wail away.


[Modified by Big Phat R, 10:24 AM 7/1/2001]

 

Yes you should have a roll cage, unless you don't value your life.

Yes, street racing is bad, unless you don't value your life or anyone elses.

If you disagree with my statements then your life and other's are now more at risk.

 

Wow, how did they both survive that and end up in good condition? That car is flat...atleast it wasn't a convertible. That's kind of scary, I was just in a class on thursday (911TT almost put it into the wall). When you're pushing yourself and your car, things can happen very quickly. Now I need to go to that Autopower page I suppose.
Where is Summit Point located, BC or somewhere up there?

 

Summit Point is in Jefferson County West Virginia, about 90 miles WNW of Washington DC.
http://www.bsr-inc.com/


[Modified by zygspeed, 4:19 PM 7/1/2001]

 

I totally agree that a rollcage is a must for competition driving or for people who drive to their max on lapping days. But for normal lapping days where it's just for fun, then an R with good pads, tires, dot 4 brake fluid and harness would most likely be enough.

I would like to offer my support to Big Phat R on the fact that DOT legal R compounds would be a good choice for the track and that it's not more dangerous than street tires. If you really think about it, the main difference between different street tires is that the high performance ones offer more grip. As a result, tires such as 032R and RA-1 would be better than street tires b/c of the extra grip that they provide. Plus they also offer the gradual breakaway charateristic that the street tires give (the squealing).

 

superman, a harness w/o a rollcage is deadly on the track. imagine if that guy in the BMW would have been strapped to his seat with a 4,5, or 6 point he would have never survived.

 

typeR158, good point. But I guess, i'm trying to say that using a harness gives the driver a better driving position during the cornering maneuvers. Hence a decreased chance of an "off" on the track. Of course i'm not talking about driving the car to the max, therefore the chance of rolling over is minimized. Even tho, there's still a chance of having the car roll over even if the car has not been over-driven.

 

I want to purchase the Chromemoly Autopower unit but were can I get it How much does it weigh and how much does it cost

 

I agree with ANDREW... R compound tires have more grip, which means you will be going faster, and little warning of breakaway... Street tires are much easier to control.. If you think its safer on R compound tires, then your going to slow..

 

Honda318dx, R compounds such as the R1 gives little to none warning before breaking away, hence, it's more "dangerous". But the 032R and RA-1 squeal like a biatch before breaking away, hence it gives the good charateristic of the street tire. However, if you want to say that R compounds are not good because they give too much grip, then I simply cannot agree with you. Basically your argument is suggesting that we should choose a tire that offer the less grip b/c it will have less grip therefore we can carry less speed into a corner. I think what i'm trying to say is that R compound is safer b/c we can potentially have a higher cornering speed. No one without a rollcage should drive to the max on a lapping day. Just want to have a friendly discussion.

 

My 80 treadwear yoko A008RS tires only squeal on certain surfaces.. I don't understand the point in using R compound tires if you arn't gonna use the full potential they offer.. Yes you do have greater speed with R tires, but what happens when that speed gets out of control? There will be less of a chance of your car slowing down to avoid disaster..

 

Hmm.. I'm not sure who runs the events you guys go to, but there have been *2* incidents combined in every single track event that I've ever BEEN to (driven in or not), and that's probably over 20 by now, at least. Hell, I've seen more sh$t happen at autocrosses.

Now by the above comment I am NOT disagreeing that you should at least have a 4 point bar for any serious driving on a road course, in fact, I agree with that comment... I just find it amazing that people are getting that much damage at every event.

I will agree that the A032R's break very gently and are EASY to control, unlike gforce R1s. IMO, A032R's are the best R compound tire for a novice level driver (including me!).

Another comment, having spun out in a R compound tire car (latest occurence.. TODAY.. thanks RS!!! lol) and having spun in a street tire equipped car, unless you're hitting wet grass I've found that R compound tires *seem* to stop quicker, even from higher speeds. This could just be perception, but that's what it's always *seemed* like to me..

 

Anyone remember way back when, when all you needed to race showroom stock was a roll bar, belts and a fire extinguisher?
Or am I REALLY dating myself?

 

Hi George.
Time for me to go home now and watch some of today's GP.

 

R compounds (ALL of them, including the Crapohama A032R's) mean more speed, which means you'll be going even faster when you screw up. When, not if.

R compounds are more dangerous, period. To say that more grip = more safety is completely wrong. It's a false sense of security. They also cover up a ton of minor mistakes, which slows the learning curve. Learn to drive fast on shitty tires, and you'll be a rocket on good tires.

The comment that makes me snicker the most is that r-compounds mean less sliding or wiggling. HAH! If it's sliding or wiggling less than on street tires, that just means you aren't going fast enough.

Warren