All of you EP-3 haters are just plain ridiculous. This car is a sweet car.

The honda wheels are not the greatest; I'll admit that. But with a new set of rims, fog lamps(stock or aftermarket), and maybe some tint on the windows this car is a cool rice rocket out of the box.

Honda could have made it a bit lighter and bumped the horses a bit, but other than that this car cleaner lines and better style than any other car in its class, IMO.

My EP-3 is a daily driver. Great freeway passing speed, best seats I've ever had in a car, and the stock susp has the perfect balance between handling and not giving you the buck board ride. It's also put together better and is better engineered than the other makes-no one can argue that.

Sorry to babble.......................

 

Love the shifter too

 

You make a post about how great the EP3 is and all you have to back it up are some vague opinions about styling?

What about the inferior suspension (do you even know what a MacPherson strut or a trailing arm is), the unnecessary mass, the high centre of gravity, the cable shifter, the lousy brakes?

I'm not an EP3 fan, but I can think of quite a few real things about it I do like. And just as many things I don't like.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MK Ultra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You make a post about how great the EP3 is and all you have to back it up are some vague opinions about styling?


What about the inferior suspension (do you even know what a MacPherson strut or a trailing arm is), the unnecessary mass, the high centre of gravity, the cable shifter, the lousy brakes?


I'm not an EP3 fan, but I can think of quite a few real things about it I do like. And just as many things I don't like. </TD></TR></TABLE>


Uh, ok... and your vague comments about its weakspots proves what?

EP3s rock ....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by taikahn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Uh, ok... and your vague comments about its weakspots proves what?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Look up.

See that?

That was my post flying over your head.

All I'm asking is for people to discuss the car's technical merits as opposed to saying something is good or bad because they like it. I'm not here to say the car sucks.

 

so far the posts in this thread are weak suace.

I dont think they understand the criticism with the EP3.


-they already understand it looks fuglly from the factory.
-then they defend that it looks *bling* if you lower/tint/and add other parts that do nothing for peformance

-someone points out, that the car lacks in the realm of performance and driver rewarding fun.
-still stuck on the deep fact that lays in the back of their head "this car looks fugly"

yeah, hello people! We are talking about performance and drivabiltiy.

more direct questions:
-why do you think that the EP3 is a good performing car?
-what areas do you believe it is good at? (braking, cornering, accleration)

looks are just opinions from one jacknob to another. style is subjective. performance and speed are not.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MK Ultra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
What about the inferior suspension (do you even know what a MacPherson strut or a trailing arm is), the unnecessary mass, the high centre of gravity, the cable shifter, the lousy brakes?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Inferior suspension <U>in theory</U> . In reality, most people (including you and me) can't tell the difference in handling. Not to mention, the wrx and mr2 spyder both use machperson struts...Unnecessary mass is a given on a production economy car. Lousy brakes? This is a civic, not a porsche. The brakes are no worse than the brakes that came on any of the previous generation SI's.

The US finally gets a civic hatchback with an integra motor...

Oh...and this post is useless because there shouldn't BE any ep3 haters in an Ep3 forum! If there are, they're just wasting their time.

If you want to hate ep3's, go start your own forum and hate over there, your attitude isn't wanted here.


Modified by EF'n Fast at 9:59 AM 4/17/2003

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bob-DC2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
more direct questions:
-why do you think that the EP3 is a good performing car?
-what areas do you believe it is good at? (braking, cornering, accleration)
</TD></TR></TABLE>

How many civics produce 145lb/ft of torque stock?

For some of us, driving is more than just a numbers game. If it wasn't, we'd ditch the si's and drive the SVT, which outperforms on paper.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EF'n Fast &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
If it wasn't, we'd ditch the si's and drive the SVT, which outperforms on paper.</TD></TR></TABLE>

..and definately schools the ep3 on the asphalt too .. dont forget that. The Ep3 is much slower than even my rsx, which is the same motor! i have test driven ep3's many times to feel out the cars differences ..and imo, im disgusted with the mini-me odessey, but insanely jealous of its seats ;-) I take the Si for what it is .. a civic out of the box from honda. however, spray it, boost it and then .. the car becomes something to say "damn ... thats an Si" ... until then .. it more like "bwahaha, honda sold another mini-van"

..my .02

 

I was an Ep3 Hater. I didnt like the styling or performance. I own a 1.8T GTI and actually am on the market for an Ep now. Why? I now see the potential for a nice all motor car which is what I want to get back too.
With so many people modding these now and as more info comes out it seems to be building popularity because of the "performance" aspect. (more parts coming out, people trying new things, swaps, turbo's, cam's are in the works) Now don't get me wrong I still think the styling on it kinda sucks, but I am willing to deal with that for the "funfactor" of tuning and modding at a much cheaper price than my GTi. I have always been a fan of Honda's (owned 2 2000 Si's) and now see the potential this car can have and I want it to last me a long time. Honda gives you that which no other car (aside from Acura's) give you.
True it will take a lot of money in the long run to get it as fast as my GTI is right now (motorwise), but it will be more reliable and will end up costing less after all is said and done since the GTi is much more $$$ to begin with. I don't know what my point was in this but.... I guess bottom line is I was a hater and now I can't wait to get one.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EF'n Fast &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Inferior suspension <U>in theory</U> . In reality, most people (including you and me) can't tell the difference in handling. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Not theory, engineering fact. And I most certainly can tell a difference, especially during quick transitions and hard cornering at the edge of grip (the lateral scrub is intolerable).

Why is everybody who criticises the EP3/DC5 labeled a "hater?"

 

As for suspension sucking... I dunno ... recently, out of 89 people -- I got 12th in my second ever autocross in this car with springs/rims/wheels ---- I'd say the car can hold its own in suspension/handling.

Lots of focus's under me ... not many above ... I dunno, I think the suspensions rocks and isn't dumped to the floor like previous generation hondas.

http://www.rmsolo.org/results/03/0413nov.txt

 

Actually, for struts the handling is quite good, especially compared to other FWD cars with a strut-based suspension.

However, the car does not inspire the same level of confidence as the previous generation when I drive it. To be fair not all of that is due to the suspension, but I believe a lot of it is.

 

My local club gets regularly owned by an EP driver on stock struts/springs with thick swaybar in the rear, and stock brakes...hes a damn good driver with plenty of experience, and he doesnt have any complaints about the car.

 

Well, I have to say that I went from driving a '91 240sx with 17s, full suspenstion and I/E to a stock '02 SI and at first:
- I thought the car's center of gravity was too high
-The electronic steering was awkard feeling
-I couldnt get comfortable in the seats
-missed having a driver's arm rest, and....
-all the pedals were feather light

But after driving the car for 7 seven months, I have to say this car has grown on me. I love it. The engine is so smoth all they way to redline. I have an SRI installed with a rear strut bar w/ Neuspeed Race springs coming soon, but it handles well for stock, I have grown to love the seats and have passed out on them during lunch breaks. The overall quality of my EP is much better then any other sub $20k car I have ever seen. The only real lacking parts of this car are the tires and the height, IMO.
Ive seen the SVT Focus and its very hard to pick out of the other Focuses, they are basically identical from the exterior. And if you look at the comparison tests, most agree that if you put better tires on, the SI would improve its times on all measured tests.

 

Another idiotic EP3 love/hate thread that brings out the "know-it-alls" It just always cracks me up how many haters troll around the forum.

EF'n Fast had about the only intelligent comment. MKUltra has about as much competition seattime in an EP3 as I do in an F1 car.

The skinny:
The stock EP3 shocks/springs absolutely suck. The swaybars are way wrong. The tires bite a big one.

The engine is very restricted and needs about 2000miles on the clock to loosen up. I/H/E and Hondata flash adds about 20hp at the wheels and loses no torque.

I've changed all of these, and the car is entirely different now. Bring on the double-wishbone cars, because the gap has closed considerably. And I know, because I actually own both, unlike the haters.

 

It doesn't matter how you look at it......the ep3 is still a mini odessy, minivan, wagon, bus however you look at it.....

yes i would drive one if i had the money!

 

I'm awaiting the EP3-R (CTR?) to come stateside.

For $20K, i'm sold on one.

RJ

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm awaiting the EP3-R (CTR?) to come stateside.

For $20K, i'm sold on one.

RJ</TD></TR></TABLE>

Is 40hp worth $5000+ ?

 

Wheels, tires, suspension, etc as well. Oh and dont forget the stickers

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wheels, tires, suspension, etc as well. Oh and dont forget the stickers </TD></TR></TABLE>

and lack of sunroof...

EP3-R

 

Everybody seems to know so much. We have a lot of smart a$$e$ in here. Why don't you guys (who act like know-it-alls) go be car critics for a automobile magazine or something.

Let's just face it. Some people love the car, others don't. Everybody has a right to their own opinion.

But the following is a sad but nonetheless true statement. Many people who "hate" the car, probably have not even driven it, but they heard/saw comments from other so-called "experts" and repeat them in these forums.

I believe, that in reality, we are all just plain mad/frustrated why the Civic Type R has not yet appeared in North America, and most likely will not break the border of this continent. By the looks of it, we're stuck with the EP hatch until Honda designs the next generation of Civics.

In all, like it or hate it, it's probably here to stay. So quit the $hit, and get on with your lives.

 

if you guys dont like the suspension.... then do something about it. u guys lower ur cars for better handling and what not. do the same for the ep3. this car is no different than any other honda and acura and whatever else u guys drive. u guys strive for the best in performance and every car has potential to be more than anybody else would ever expect. lots of u guys can swap suspensions and go 5 lug or build ur brakes or whatever. it just takes time. give the ep3 a few more months to maybe a year. ittle catch up to u faster than u thought it would.

my .02

 

ep3

 

Let's get one thing clear: I don't hate the EP3.

I actually kind of like them.

However, there are some things about the car that disappoint me gravely, the most important being the suspension architecture. Oh, and Todd00, your assumption is correct: I have not driven an EP3 in competition. So what? I can feel a difference, and it is not a positive one. Period.