done before but not for me...MIG WELDERS...
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3
Likes: 1
From: banned NC
done before but not for me...MIG WELDERS...
OK...i read all the searches i could find and most dont apply to what i want one for...
MIG WELDERS...
what its used for::::
1. exhaust piping and mufflers (aluminum, stainless)
2. IC charge pipes
3. 1/4" STEEL brackets MAX...
4. "attempted roll cage" lol my dream...so i think its like 1/8" chromoly...
5. in accordance with a pipe bender the above mentioned, and i would like to start tryin some strut bars, etc..just for me and friends for fun...
SO:
i would need the welds to look good on some apps (assuming i dont suk at it) and also strong on
most apps.
ive looked at a few and would LIKE to have a 115v house plugin one but realize that cant always be possible so i can go with 230 if necessary.
gas is BEST right?
A:what kind of output would you recomend...for the above jobs
B: and experience with these jobs all off of ONE welder
C: i know what duty cycle is, but what should i be shooting for for the jobs i need done..?
whats the diff. between a welding torch and gun? i know what a gun is but is a torch the same thing?
I want to spend around 4-800 bux..total..
is this one decent for my needs?
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...er=39495people recomend the lincoln 135..but that doesnt seem like it would suit my needs...
or this one? http://www.daytonamig.com/mig_145.htm
[Modified by hybridvteceg, 8:32 PM 3/6/2003]
[Modified by hybridvteceg, 9:09 PM 3/6/2003]
MIG WELDERS...
what its used for::::
1. exhaust piping and mufflers (aluminum, stainless)
2. IC charge pipes
3. 1/4" STEEL brackets MAX...
4. "attempted roll cage" lol my dream...so i think its like 1/8" chromoly...
5. in accordance with a pipe bender the above mentioned, and i would like to start tryin some strut bars, etc..just for me and friends for fun...
SO:
i would need the welds to look good on some apps (assuming i dont suk at it) and also strong on
most apps.
ive looked at a few and would LIKE to have a 115v house plugin one but realize that cant always be possible so i can go with 230 if necessary.
gas is BEST right?
A:what kind of output would you recomend...for the above jobs
B: and experience with these jobs all off of ONE welder
C: i know what duty cycle is, but what should i be shooting for for the jobs i need done..?
whats the diff. between a welding torch and gun? i know what a gun is but is a torch the same thing?
I want to spend around 4-800 bux..total..
is this one decent for my needs?
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...er=39495people recomend the lincoln 135..but that doesnt seem like it would suit my needs...
or this one? http://www.daytonamig.com/mig_145.htm
[Modified by hybridvteceg, 8:32 PM 3/6/2003]
[Modified by hybridvteceg, 9:09 PM 3/6/2003]
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
From: RI, USA
Re: done before but not for me...MIG WELDERS... (hybridvteceg)
Mig will weld everything you're talking about, but it will take a good bit of practice to become good at it on stainless and aluminum (stainless being a bit easier). Shielded gas welding is what you need to use for all of the things you want to do. The only one that I wouldn't do with mig is welding a chromoly cage, I'd tig it carefully and properly stress relieve the joints after welding. You can mig a regular mild steel cage though.
For power, 230v welders are generally higher output which is more useful usually, but there are more 115v welders out there nowadays that'll do what you want. I'll try to explain a bit more here about mig welder outputs:
There are typically 3 different "types" of welding done with mig, short arc, globular transfer, and spray arc; short arc being the lowest amps, globular being in between, and spray being the highest amps. Of those 3, the easiest are short arc and spray arc, and are by far the most useful. A smaller welding machine will probably only be able to do short arc and globular transfer, and lack the power to perform spray arc. When you get to the bigger machines near the 200 amp and above range, you'll be able to do spray arc. Spray arc pours down a ton of metal very quickly and uses a lot of heat, but generally does a very clean, very strong weld, but because of the heat is suited more for thicker metals. Short arc tends to lay down a little less metal slower and have much reduced heat and be better suited for thinner metals. Globular transfer is a very spattery, hard to control transfer that literally drops globs of metal into the weld pool, and isn't really useful for anything you're going to be doing.
For what you're doing, short arc is probably going to be how you're going to be welding. The machine you listed would do what you want, as well as lincoln 100, 125, 135, 175, miller 135, 175 and hobart (same as miller, same company). I have never used a century welder, only lincolns, millers and hobarts (and a few others), but would suggest a lincoln or miller/hobart over that one as parts may be easier to come by for a more common welder (not to say century may not be common, it just isn't around where I am, and I don't know what parts they're using, they might be universal though).
As for duty rating, only be concerned with it if you're doing this as a job where time is money. You probably won't exceed the duty rating of any of the machines with anything you're doing unless you're practically mass producing stuff.
As for making good looking beads, that is the result of practice and knowing your machine, so just spend time practicing if you want to improve your welds. One thing that is critical in making good beads is making sure the metals you're welding are very clean. The cleaner the base metal the cleaner the bead will be (this is EXTREMELY critical on aluminum.) Also make sure you use the proper shielding gas and flow rate for what you're doing.
A torch can sometimes refer to a mig gun, but most of the time a mig gun will be referred to as a gun. Torch usually refers to either a gas welding torch (ie oxyacetylene) or a tig welding torch. A stick welding electrode holder is referred to as a stinger, although again I've heard people call a mig gun a stinger as well (rare though).
Hope this helps
For power, 230v welders are generally higher output which is more useful usually, but there are more 115v welders out there nowadays that'll do what you want. I'll try to explain a bit more here about mig welder outputs:
There are typically 3 different "types" of welding done with mig, short arc, globular transfer, and spray arc; short arc being the lowest amps, globular being in between, and spray being the highest amps. Of those 3, the easiest are short arc and spray arc, and are by far the most useful. A smaller welding machine will probably only be able to do short arc and globular transfer, and lack the power to perform spray arc. When you get to the bigger machines near the 200 amp and above range, you'll be able to do spray arc. Spray arc pours down a ton of metal very quickly and uses a lot of heat, but generally does a very clean, very strong weld, but because of the heat is suited more for thicker metals. Short arc tends to lay down a little less metal slower and have much reduced heat and be better suited for thinner metals. Globular transfer is a very spattery, hard to control transfer that literally drops globs of metal into the weld pool, and isn't really useful for anything you're going to be doing.
For what you're doing, short arc is probably going to be how you're going to be welding. The machine you listed would do what you want, as well as lincoln 100, 125, 135, 175, miller 135, 175 and hobart (same as miller, same company). I have never used a century welder, only lincolns, millers and hobarts (and a few others), but would suggest a lincoln or miller/hobart over that one as parts may be easier to come by for a more common welder (not to say century may not be common, it just isn't around where I am, and I don't know what parts they're using, they might be universal though).
As for duty rating, only be concerned with it if you're doing this as a job where time is money. You probably won't exceed the duty rating of any of the machines with anything you're doing unless you're practically mass producing stuff.
As for making good looking beads, that is the result of practice and knowing your machine, so just spend time practicing if you want to improve your welds. One thing that is critical in making good beads is making sure the metals you're welding are very clean. The cleaner the base metal the cleaner the bead will be (this is EXTREMELY critical on aluminum.) Also make sure you use the proper shielding gas and flow rate for what you're doing.
A torch can sometimes refer to a mig gun, but most of the time a mig gun will be referred to as a gun. Torch usually refers to either a gas welding torch (ie oxyacetylene) or a tig welding torch. A stick welding electrode holder is referred to as a stinger, although again I've heard people call a mig gun a stinger as well (rare though).
Hope this helps
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3
Likes: 1
From: banned NC
Re: done before but not for me...MIG WELDERS... (spikius)
Hope this helps
does anyone else have some comments i need to know what to get...please also explain the chromo thing to me in more depth if you can..ynot MIG and lol whats stress relief
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
From: RI, USA
Re: done before but not for me...MIG WELDERS... (hybridvteceg)
I'm not an expert on metallurgy or anything, but here's what I know about chromoly. I'm pretty sure it's accurate, but if anyone has more detail, by all means correct me.
Chromoly for cages needs to be stiff yet still flex in a collision. Chromoly is also rather heat sensitive, so if you heat it up too much you can create hardspots in the metal, which can make it more susceptible to cracking. Mig welding metals it's rather difficult to control the heat of the weld and it's not always possible to really contain the heat. With tig welding you can very precisely weld chromoly joints and you have great control over the heat input.
Surprisingly, for welding chromoly cages, you don't use chromoly filler wire, for the simple fact that it won't flex adequately in a collision, it will probably crack. What is generally recommended for welding chromoly is ER80-D2 filler rod, or sometimes ER70-S6 or ER70-S2, which are all typically fillers used for mild steel, but work and are recommended for proper strength and flexibility required in a chromoly cage.
Stress relieving chromoly joints after welding is also to reduce the chance of hardspots and hardened areas. You don't always have to stress relieve after tigging chromoly, but it's a good idea for safety. What's generally recommended is using a 900deg tempilstik and marking about 1" away from the joint and heating the joint with torch being careful not to hotspot until the tempilstik melts (tempilstiks are kinda crayons that have very specific melting points). Then just let it cool naturally (always let welds cool naturally if you can).
To kinda summarize what I mentioned before, for equipment, I'd get the biggest welder you can afford and have the power for. You'll also need a gas cylinder and gas (duh
), so find out the prices of the cylinder and the gas when figuring out what you can afford (cylinder will probably be between $100 and $200 depending, but it can vary a lot). Again, I'd recommend either a lincoln or a miller/hobart welder over other welders due to support and known quality.
Chromoly for cages needs to be stiff yet still flex in a collision. Chromoly is also rather heat sensitive, so if you heat it up too much you can create hardspots in the metal, which can make it more susceptible to cracking. Mig welding metals it's rather difficult to control the heat of the weld and it's not always possible to really contain the heat. With tig welding you can very precisely weld chromoly joints and you have great control over the heat input.
Surprisingly, for welding chromoly cages, you don't use chromoly filler wire, for the simple fact that it won't flex adequately in a collision, it will probably crack. What is generally recommended for welding chromoly is ER80-D2 filler rod, or sometimes ER70-S6 or ER70-S2, which are all typically fillers used for mild steel, but work and are recommended for proper strength and flexibility required in a chromoly cage.
Stress relieving chromoly joints after welding is also to reduce the chance of hardspots and hardened areas. You don't always have to stress relieve after tigging chromoly, but it's a good idea for safety. What's generally recommended is using a 900deg tempilstik and marking about 1" away from the joint and heating the joint with torch being careful not to hotspot until the tempilstik melts (tempilstiks are kinda crayons that have very specific melting points). Then just let it cool naturally (always let welds cool naturally if you can).
To kinda summarize what I mentioned before, for equipment, I'd get the biggest welder you can afford and have the power for. You'll also need a gas cylinder and gas (duh
), so find out the prices of the cylinder and the gas when figuring out what you can afford (cylinder will probably be between $100 and $200 depending, but it can vary a lot). Again, I'd recommend either a lincoln or a miller/hobart welder over other welders due to support and known quality.
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