Ok so I've changed my tune a little, thinking of doing a F20B swap on my accord (F22B1 is the stock engine) because it's a little cheaper. Unfortunately the Tranny won't be swapped any time soon which leads me question if the transmission will shat out in the next few months if I go with the F20B.

This is my DD so it's not about going to the track, as if there was a legal one around me anyways and doing 1/4 miles but I do want something with a little more umph behind it. I know a H22A might be optimal but due costs its getting up there and leaving the f22 trans won't get me the most from that engine (from what I've read). I can get a F20b for 700 and the H22a is 1000+.

My stock engine isn't in the best shape, has multiple oil leaks. It doesn't leak a lot but it does leak but she's old, has 275K.

I tried searching, even read a couple have a f20b on a f22 trans but I have no idea if that was long lasting.

Thanks in advance

 

Should be fine but you're not going to get the benefits of an F20B with an F22 trans. IIRC you're auto so it's likely to be more of a downgrade because there's really no way to raise the shift points of the auto. Even if it's manual the F22 gears are incredibly long. F20B likes RPM and favors close, tight gearing. It peaks torque very late(around 6600rpm) and wants to be in the 7500-8500rpm range(depending on which model engine and other mods) for maximum power and efficiency.

I believe I told you before about the H23A VTEC. It's the middle ground price wise and better for your purposes. Makes more torque and power than both and isn't as high strung so it will work better if you're adamant on sticking with the F22 transmission.

 

You did recommend the H23A. I just don't have deep pockets. I plan on swapping out oil pump, water pump, timing belt due to being japanese and not the same standards as the US. Need an ECU too. I was trying to find the best for my money so I am kicking around options. I may just have to go with the H23A after all. Not adamant about staying with the f22 tranny just can't afford that in addition to a new motor now. Plus I just literally swapped out the tranny less than a year ago.

 

You don't need to swap out the oil pump if you have a 94-95. I don't think you will like an F20B with your setup. It will feel like a downgrade. You won't get to experience the full potential of the engine and you will lose a lot of low end and mid-range torque which is what you'll feel most in a daily driver. I have had pretty much every H/F series and I can tell you that the F20B is pretty lazy below 4k rpm in comparison to it's bigger displacement brothers. The engine does really shine at high RPM though.

 

It's a 94 Accord. I just want more power than the stock F22B1. It's slow off the start but it does move at higher speeds. I spend most of my driving on the highway more than on the city streets.

 

is the tranny a manual or auto ?

 

Unfortunately Auto.

 

then unless youre in a state with no emissions testing you will need to convert to a 97-01 prelude ecu because the 92-96 h22's didnt come in an auto

or you can do a manual swap while youre at it

 

Most counties in Nevada don't require Smog except Washoe and Clark county. I would do a manual but I just don't have the funds. Not really swapping my engine out of fun. It's kinda become a pending necessity due to the amount of leaking it's doing. While I could address those issues, I believe the amount of time and effort and even to a lesser extent the cost on an engine with 275K+ and climbing doesn't seem worth it. It is starting to dog when driving plus having to constantly watch the oil. I figured I would swap it with something a little more powerful and lower miles. Tranny was just replaced last year due to it slipping so I went with one for the f22. Regrettably I didn't think about having one put in with the intent of a more powerful engine in the future. Also this car is my daily so any 'track' racing is out of the question. Besides not sure of any decent and legal tracks in my neck of the hillbilly woods. I understand there is an area where the teenie boppers like to go drag but they can have it.

 

I would follow aradin advice and go with h series engine. Coat a bit more but will work with ur tranny and last with your tranny

 

Yeah, going with his advice on the H23A.

 

It's worth the few extra hundred for the H23A. Especially if you manage to get a 00-01 engine with the good head. They typically do about 210whp right out of the box. Probably a little less through the automatic but still a good bit more than an F20B would put out with the same setup.

 

if you don't have a lot of money, you can just swap out all of the seals to fix the leaking

 

So will this one work below? It's out of a Wagon SiR (CH9)- I believe an 01. I assume it will but I know there are nuances between the different engines. 94 Accord Ex Auto trans would be it's new home.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/98-02-HONDA...gAAOSwl8NVbiaN



I could but as I said, why bother with the time and energy and the money. I think it would be better to swap the engine, lower miles, with more. I can upgrade the tranny in a few months when I have the funds to do so. Over all, after reconsidering I do think this is the better option between the F20B, H22 and the H23. Especially since I want something with a bit more torque and a touch more horsepower.

Plus, a blue top, dual cam would like nice in my USDM accord

 

The one pictured in that listing is a 98-99 engine. The 00-01 engines will not say PGM-FI on the intake manifold. The sellers tend to use generic photos though. You would probably have to specifically ask for an 00-01 engine when you were ready to order. It is a desirable engine and most importers usually sell out of the 00-01s first so you may have some issues obtaining one. At the end of the day the 98-99 engine will suit you just fine. The difference between the two is only a few hp.


Edit: I forgot to add that even with your auto you should be able to rev the engine out to at least 7k if you manually select the gears. I know the TCU will shift around 6k if you leave it in D4 but will allow you to rev the engine out if you use 1-2-3-4 manually. Also you may want to invest in an aftermarket external transmission cooler to handle the extra heat/stress generated by the new engine as well. They are not expensive and are relatively easy to install. Cheap insurance.

 

This is on their description. This is why I assumed it was an 01

THE ENGINE WE HAVE IN STOCK WAS REMOVED FROM A HONDA ACCORD WAGON SiR (CH9) IN JAPAN AND IMPORTED DIRECTLY TO US WITH APPROXIMATELY 45K-65K MILES ON IT!


Also, I assume there is no difference between Auto and Manual with linked engine?

Edit: Also I remember you saying I need a P75 chipped ECU? Can't seem to find that on Xenocron. I was looking over Hondata and this is what I found for the the P75

• P74/75: 92-95 OBD-1 Integra LS/GS
• P75 : 96-00 OBD-2 Integra LS/GS

Forgive my ignorance buy why out of a teg?

 

There was no manual H23A. They all came automatic.

I believe I told you before about the ECU. To put it simply, any chipped ecu will be capable of running the engine but none of them have the ability to interface correctly with your Accord's transmission control unit(TCU), with the one exception being the P75 ECU. The TCU is an small additional ECU that is required to control the automatic transmission in your Accord. The P75 is not required to get the swapped engine to run but it is required if you want your transmission to function correctly.

The auto OBD1 P75 is the ONLY ECU you can run that has the ability to be chipped and work correctly with your factory TCU. The Accords and Integras of those years both used a separate ECU/TCU setup so they are mostly interchangeable. The Civics of that gen which used the P06/P28/etc ECUs did not use a separate TCU and had the transmission control functions integrated directly into the ECU itself. You will need to contact Xenocron via email, or specify during your order, or call them and tell them exactly what you intend to do and what you need. If you get in touch with them, they will help you out with that. I know for a fact that the auto P75 does work with the Accord TCU because I ran one years ago myself.

If you attempt to use a chipped P28/P06/etc ECU with your automatic transmission setup, you will be throwing transmission codes and the transmission will either work very poorly or not work at all. The Civic ECU cannot communicate effectively with your transmission control unit since they are not designed to look for it or interact with it. There was a thread on here just recently where a guy did an H22 swap in an Accord just like yours that was automatic. His transmission only had one gear and was throwing codes because he was attempting to use a P28 Civic ecu.

This is the link you want. You will need to specify that you want a chipped AUTO P75 and for it to remain auto.

 

Alternatively HAMotorsports has a listing ready to go for a chipped AUTO ecu. But I have never dealt with them.

You would still need to send them an email and be sure it is an auto P75. Some research will go a long ways. You will have to do some digging to find the necessary wiring diagrams you need as well. There are few ECU/TCU related wires that need to be swapped when using the P75 ECU. The Accords had some swapped pins for this generation that were different from the other models.

 

This is part of where I start getting confused. In another thread I came across someone with an H23A running a P13. Holmesnmanny said a USDM P13 will run it just fine just don't go above 7500ish RPMs. Which I don't think I've ever done in my current stock set up anyways. And yes I see you said it would run, just not correctly which tells me that is room for possible issues/failures down the road. I can contact Xenocron but there has to be a reason they don't have any on their site? Seems this ECU is not as readily available as some of the other popular ones.

However when I see conflicting I start seeing things as anecdotal. Peoples personal experiences and not a general consensus, a YMMV type scenario. This isn't me doubting you, you've been a tremendous help.

I did check out that HAMotorsports last night before you sent that link, I couldn't find a P75 so the one your link is very non descript- just says chipped auto ECU with Basemap. That's why I over looked it (my lack of knowledge of what I am looking for exactly).

On the other hand, there's a member in another thread who has the P13 on his H23A, also has a chipped P06 converted to VTEC w/ OBD2-OBD1 harness that he's willing to sell for 150

 

A P13 would run it but good luck finding an auto one. You can't use a manual one because again, it can't interface with your TCU.

You're going to find a lot of misinformation because not a lot of people have experience swapping automatic Accords. It's just not done frequently. There are also 2 different H23 engines which can make it even more confusing. I did all the legwork and research almost a decade ago and found out what worked and what didn't because I, like you, needed a tunable solution for my then automatic 95. I have been doing this for well over 10 years and there are very few people on this forum that are as knowledgeable about these Accords. The auto P75 is the ECU that you need for everything to work correctly and that's the last time I'm going to say it. If you decide to buy xyz ecu instead, be sure to post back so that people can learn from your mistake in the future.

 

I get it.. I really do. Sorry I asked for additional clarity. Sorry I asked about what another individual said and it turns out he's not very knowledgeable(your inference not mine).

Seem to be having the same issue finding the P75 auto with VTEC capable
But for what it's worth I have contacted HAmotorsports and in the process of contacting Xenocron now.


Edit:

from Xenocron
"None of the chipped based tuning software supports the automatic platform. Some Honda's have an external trans controller and then a chipped ECU should work but no guarantee. Others like the P75 have it automatic parameters built into the ECU and it is our standard practice when shipping and ECU to remove the components. We can leave the auto components intact if you request it when purchasing on the site by leave the request in the comments box during checkout. It is only something we have only done for customers that have done research on if it will work and were will to take the risk that it may not work correctly and we do not offer any refunds on ECU's.



Joe Johnson

Wholesale/Sales
"
Edit again: THey're out of P75s they said.