Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
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Honda-Tech Member
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Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
What's up everyone, I'm kind of new to the whole boost world and have been doing extensive research on building a solid setup. I'm currently looking to buy my manifold and turbo now that my motor is fully complete, but I'm having trouble figuring out if I should go with a precision 6262 or 6266 turbo. As far as the AR rating; I have no idea which to go with. Also I need to decide if I should go with a ram horn or top mount manifold. Your advice and opinions are greatly appreciated as well as experiences and suggestions. Not really sure if you need exact part specs so I'll list them anyway.
Power goal: 650-700 hp
Motor specs:
Aebs sleeved 2L b16a block
Forged je 9:1 Pistons
Custom b17 titanium rods
Balanced and Micro polished gsr crank
Full port and polished gsr head
3 angle valve job
Ferrea flat faced valves
Full type r valvetrain
Ctr cams
Victor x intake manifold bored to 70mm
Motor will be tuned on e85 with an aem meth injection kit using hondata with boost by gear of course. Hope to hear from you guys, thanks in advance
Power goal: 650-700 hp
Motor specs:
Aebs sleeved 2L b16a block
Forged je 9:1 Pistons
Custom b17 titanium rods
Balanced and Micro polished gsr crank
Full port and polished gsr head
3 angle valve job
Ferrea flat faced valves
Full type r valvetrain
Ctr cams
Victor x intake manifold bored to 70mm
Motor will be tuned on e85 with an aem meth injection kit using hondata with boost by gear of course. Hope to hear from you guys, thanks in advance
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Welcome to Honda-Tech. You'll find I'm one of the nicer guys on here, so please don't take this critique personally in anyway, as we're all really trying to help.
I understand you're new to the Honda turbo game, so please allow me to let you know about a few things about how we kinda do things around here.
1) The FAQs in the top grey area of the forum has a LOT of information in there. I know it's a little difficult to navigate through, but the titles will really help. Get past the garbage comments and you'll come to the heart of it, and find a lot of your answers.
The search engine sucks here, so use Google with site:Honda-Tech to help.
2) Many people here tend to attempt to use the same formula for everything, which is both good and bad; Good, because it's easy to tell what works and even why.. But that's also bad, because that means that for your particular needs, that some things are completely unnecessary when the focus can be on something else. So, as much as there is a ton of basic information available here, you've got learn to weed out the nonsense. That's the more difficult part.
3) Be honest with yourself. The more you are honest with yourself as to how often the car will be driven, the type of events you're running, and not just the general terms of "street/strip", "Highway running", and other cliche'd remarks (where you're actually getting specific), the more we can help. If you want a popularity contest where responders just give a "thumbs up" or "way to go", so that you can stroke your own ego, that can happen, but then you'll be so into your own head, you'll miss the purpose of why you built it, and honestly, you'll be less satisfied in the long run.
4) We don't know you. Yes, unfortunately, many individuals who look for feedback on forums tend to forget that we only can see you from the view of a profile; one that you can edit to have as little or as much information as you want.
What that means is that we don't know your mechanical inclination, what resources are available to you, or what you do and don't understand specifically about certain aspects of this build. Please remember that as you respond to other people if they make any erroneous assumptions / presumptions about you and your abilities. We don't know if you're 17 or 45 years of age, if you possess specific knowledge about other platforms, or how long you've been into mechanical devices and modes of transportation.
So, if possible, put down your country / city/province where you are, or if not exactly where you're located, where you're near, so we can have a better idea as to what environment you may be exposed to for specific needs like tuner availability, or other resources.
5)Be prepared to go over the budget if you want to make your investment to possess the ability to withstand the abuse you plan to give it.. This may mean that even if you think you have everything you need in one area, double check, you may have forgotten a component or approach that is extremely important and don't even know the value of how important that component or approach may be. Examples include, proper equipment for the turbocharger, fittings, water lines (yes, I said it
), restrictors, flanges and welding. Many times just because it wasn't mentioned, doesn't mean it wasn't important. Look to that person's purpose for their build and their particular use. That component or approach may not be needed for that particular individual, but YOU may need it for YOUR purpose.
6) Please be specific about your build and check your ego at the door.. We're here to help if we can, but not if all we get in return is ingratitude, bad netiquette, and bad attitude. In some cases, we're going to ask a lot of rebuttal questions. Try not to get offended, because in those instances, the question is important to get an overall picture of what you're trying to do, and why you're doing it. We don't spoon feed a lot of information here, so please, answer when you can. You may be surprised that your theory and your application of that theory don't match well.
7)Post a lot of photos with a good camera. Videos may be necessary Be it from a mobile phone or a DSLR, pictures truly are worth 1000 words. We're not there, so we need to see what you're talking about. This is necessary to see what's right and what's wrong based upon your written description. So, if it means you go back out to the car and get some better photos to get an idea of what's needed, please do so.
So, thanks for coming and welcome.. Hopefully this will be a sticky of some sort, and we'll get started.
I understand you're new to the Honda turbo game, so please allow me to let you know about a few things about how we kinda do things around here.
1) The FAQs in the top grey area of the forum has a LOT of information in there. I know it's a little difficult to navigate through, but the titles will really help. Get past the garbage comments and you'll come to the heart of it, and find a lot of your answers.
The search engine sucks here, so use Google with site:Honda-Tech to help.
2) Many people here tend to attempt to use the same formula for everything, which is both good and bad; Good, because it's easy to tell what works and even why.. But that's also bad, because that means that for your particular needs, that some things are completely unnecessary when the focus can be on something else. So, as much as there is a ton of basic information available here, you've got learn to weed out the nonsense. That's the more difficult part.
3) Be honest with yourself. The more you are honest with yourself as to how often the car will be driven, the type of events you're running, and not just the general terms of "street/strip", "Highway running", and other cliche'd remarks (where you're actually getting specific), the more we can help. If you want a popularity contest where responders just give a "thumbs up" or "way to go", so that you can stroke your own ego, that can happen, but then you'll be so into your own head, you'll miss the purpose of why you built it, and honestly, you'll be less satisfied in the long run.
4) We don't know you. Yes, unfortunately, many individuals who look for feedback on forums tend to forget that we only can see you from the view of a profile; one that you can edit to have as little or as much information as you want.
What that means is that we don't know your mechanical inclination, what resources are available to you, or what you do and don't understand specifically about certain aspects of this build. Please remember that as you respond to other people if they make any erroneous assumptions / presumptions about you and your abilities. We don't know if you're 17 or 45 years of age, if you possess specific knowledge about other platforms, or how long you've been into mechanical devices and modes of transportation.
So, if possible, put down your country / city/province where you are, or if not exactly where you're located, where you're near, so we can have a better idea as to what environment you may be exposed to for specific needs like tuner availability, or other resources.
5)Be prepared to go over the budget if you want to make your investment to possess the ability to withstand the abuse you plan to give it.. This may mean that even if you think you have everything you need in one area, double check, you may have forgotten a component or approach that is extremely important and don't even know the value of how important that component or approach may be. Examples include, proper equipment for the turbocharger, fittings, water lines (yes, I said it
), restrictors, flanges and welding. Many times just because it wasn't mentioned, doesn't mean it wasn't important. Look to that person's purpose for their build and their particular use. That component or approach may not be needed for that particular individual, but YOU may need it for YOUR purpose.6) Please be specific about your build and check your ego at the door.. We're here to help if we can, but not if all we get in return is ingratitude, bad netiquette, and bad attitude. In some cases, we're going to ask a lot of rebuttal questions. Try not to get offended, because in those instances, the question is important to get an overall picture of what you're trying to do, and why you're doing it. We don't spoon feed a lot of information here, so please, answer when you can. You may be surprised that your theory and your application of that theory don't match well.
7)Post a lot of photos with a good camera. Videos may be necessary Be it from a mobile phone or a DSLR, pictures truly are worth 1000 words. We're not there, so we need to see what you're talking about. This is necessary to see what's right and what's wrong based upon your written description. So, if it means you go back out to the car and get some better photos to get an idea of what's needed, please do so.
So, thanks for coming and welcome.. Hopefully this will be a sticky of some sort, and we'll get started.
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Go with a top mount and 6266 which will leave you plenty of room to grow.
Most people that hit their goals end up wanting to push for more, so instead of spending money twice, spend it once.
Most people that hit their goals end up wanting to push for more, so instead of spending money twice, spend it once.
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
What I'll do is put in blue any comments about your build list (if any is needed). I'll also ask specific questions regarding your approach. This is simply for clarity of your build's mission, so please don't take any personal offense to it.
I may also address other areas that don't seem to be in your build description.
Based upon what I see so far, it appears this is an all-drag car, with an occasional drive on public roads.
I may also address other areas that don't seem to be in your build description.
Based upon what I see so far, it appears this is an all-drag car, with an occasional drive on public roads.
Power goal: 650-700 hp -This is using high knock-resistant fuel for this goal presumptively
Motor specs:
Aebs sleeved 2L b16a block
Forged je 9:1 Pistons
Custom b17 titanium rods Why did you find this necessary? Hopefully it was because it was just a deal you came up on. Otherwise, it was not necessary for that material. There are B17 rods that can be made for that platform to fit the B16 block, but perhaps you were looking at a long stroke B16 and these rods were your only option..
Balanced and Micro polished gsr crank
Full port and polished gsr head Again, this was not necessary, unless that was all you had available. The Honda B-series VTEC heads don't really need these treatments in order to extract power for this purpose. most don't change much in the way of better CFM for the engine like it would for other platforms.
3 angle valve job In other words, a standard valve job when using aftermarket valves. Hopefully the entire head was pressure tested and checked before that was done to make sure that your valveguides were in order.
Ferrea flat faced valves
Full type r valvetrain
Ctr cams
Victor x intake manifold bored to 70mm
You don't mention a throttle body here. I recommend not using a billet series and sticking with the SKunk2 Alpha. this is due to their relatively low cost, use of a fine idle screw AND throttle stop, as well as the butterfly has a lower tendency to stick due to the difference in material for the butterfly
Motor will be tuned on e85 with an aem meth injection kit using hondata with boost by gear of course. Hope to hear from you guys, thanks in advance
Ok. Pick one or the other. Not both. You don't get to stack "octane" and all the high knock-resistant properties together. Both als have the ability to reduce engine cylinder temperatures that richen up fuel. Pick that based upon your resources and use, not popularity.
Boost by gear is nice and all, but if you don't have the basic driving principles down without BBG, then you won't understand how it should be with the BBG. So, slow your roll a bit.
As for the Precision turbocharger stuff, I can only say that, well, you want this reliable, and this is really not the way to do it using that company, for a variety of reasons I won't state publicly for libel reasons.
And yes, they can work. For how long,well, not only is based upon your ability (90%) but the ability of the components.. I'd stick with Garrett or Borg-Warner. They're worth the extra money in some cases.
As for exhaust manifold, look to YOUR PURPOSE before deciding. If you plan to use this on the street as much as drag racing, I recommend a lower mounted system over some top end crazy top-mount. Also think about what amenities you plan to keep or not keep, as they are a major factor in your decision. Blindly using a "top mount" may bring unexpected results including additional lag, heat transfer issues, or whether or not you'd like a hood-style exit or traditional downpipe.
Motor specs:
Aebs sleeved 2L b16a block
Forged je 9:1 Pistons
Custom b17 titanium rods Why did you find this necessary? Hopefully it was because it was just a deal you came up on. Otherwise, it was not necessary for that material. There are B17 rods that can be made for that platform to fit the B16 block, but perhaps you were looking at a long stroke B16 and these rods were your only option..
Balanced and Micro polished gsr crank
Full port and polished gsr head Again, this was not necessary, unless that was all you had available. The Honda B-series VTEC heads don't really need these treatments in order to extract power for this purpose. most don't change much in the way of better CFM for the engine like it would for other platforms.
3 angle valve job In other words, a standard valve job when using aftermarket valves. Hopefully the entire head was pressure tested and checked before that was done to make sure that your valveguides were in order.
Ferrea flat faced valves
Full type r valvetrain
Ctr cams
Victor x intake manifold bored to 70mm
You don't mention a throttle body here. I recommend not using a billet series and sticking with the SKunk2 Alpha. this is due to their relatively low cost, use of a fine idle screw AND throttle stop, as well as the butterfly has a lower tendency to stick due to the difference in material for the butterfly
Motor will be tuned on e85 with an aem meth injection kit using hondata with boost by gear of course. Hope to hear from you guys, thanks in advance
Ok. Pick one or the other. Not both. You don't get to stack "octane" and all the high knock-resistant properties together. Both als have the ability to reduce engine cylinder temperatures that richen up fuel. Pick that based upon your resources and use, not popularity.
Boost by gear is nice and all, but if you don't have the basic driving principles down without BBG, then you won't understand how it should be with the BBG. So, slow your roll a bit.
As for the Precision turbocharger stuff, I can only say that, well, you want this reliable, and this is really not the way to do it using that company, for a variety of reasons I won't state publicly for libel reasons.
And yes, they can work. For how long,well, not only is based upon your ability (90%) but the ability of the components.. I'd stick with Garrett or Borg-Warner. They're worth the extra money in some cases.
As for exhaust manifold, look to YOUR PURPOSE before deciding. If you plan to use this on the street as much as drag racing, I recommend a lower mounted system over some top end crazy top-mount. Also think about what amenities you plan to keep or not keep, as they are a major factor in your decision. Blindly using a "top mount" may bring unexpected results including additional lag, heat transfer issues, or whether or not you'd like a hood-style exit or traditional downpipe.
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
- I like top mounts because pulling a turbo on and off is much easier. I had the traditional ram horn and it sucked when needing to pull things apart.
- Top mounts allow the turbo to sit higher up getting much more airflow through the top of the bumper than being blocked and behind an intercooler.
- My top mount allows for the DP to easily become a hood exit but my DP goes right down the normal way to easily connect to an exhaust.
- Now let's talk turbos, I currently run a Garrett Turbo and have run about 6 different Garrett Turbos and they have worked great. In recent times I was also running multiple Comp Turbos. Comps customer service lacks and they are very slow. Now I have heard problems with Precision and their journal bearing units but have not heard issues of the BB units. In fact an off the shelf Gen2 6266 made about 150whp more than my Garrett unit. Both are 62mm turbos allowed in the class I run.
Let's just say the current FIS record of 8.69 was done on a 6266.
- Top mounts allow the turbo to sit higher up getting much more airflow through the top of the bumper than being blocked and behind an intercooler.
- My top mount allows for the DP to easily become a hood exit but my DP goes right down the normal way to easily connect to an exhaust.
- Now let's talk turbos, I currently run a Garrett Turbo and have run about 6 different Garrett Turbos and they have worked great. In recent times I was also running multiple Comp Turbos. Comps customer service lacks and they are very slow. Now I have heard problems with Precision and their journal bearing units but have not heard issues of the BB units. In fact an off the shelf Gen2 6266 made about 150whp more than my Garrett unit. Both are 62mm turbos allowed in the class I run.
Let's just say the current FIS record of 8.69 was done on a 6266.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,309
Likes: 22
From: Indiana
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
-
- Top mounts allow the turbo to sit higher up getting much more airflow through the top of the bumper than being blocked and behind an intercooler.
But you also have way more piping (surface area) for heat to radiate off of. I noticed a huge change from ramhorn to miniram in ECT.
- Now let's talk turbos, I currently run a Garrett Turbo and have run about 6 different Garrett Turbos and they have worked great. In recent times I was also running multiple Comp Turbos. Comps customer service lacks and they are very slow. Now I have heard problems with Precision and their journal bearing units but have not heard issues of the BB units. In fact an off the shelf Gen2 6266 made about 150whp more than my Garrett unit. Both are 62mm turbos allowed in the class I run.
- Just curious what Garrett you used to compare?
- Top mounts allow the turbo to sit higher up getting much more airflow through the top of the bumper than being blocked and behind an intercooler.
But you also have way more piping (surface area) for heat to radiate off of. I noticed a huge change from ramhorn to miniram in ECT.
- Now let's talk turbos, I currently run a Garrett Turbo and have run about 6 different Garrett Turbos and they have worked great. In recent times I was also running multiple Comp Turbos. Comps customer service lacks and they are very slow. Now I have heard problems with Precision and their journal bearing units but have not heard issues of the BB units. In fact an off the shelf Gen2 6266 made about 150whp more than my Garrett unit. Both are 62mm turbos allowed in the class I run.
- Just curious what Garrett you used to compare?
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
- Top Mount turbos have higher exigent ambient engine bay temperatures near radiators than other components.
-If the turbocharger is quality, you don't need to remove the turbocharger as often. That's more to the connection setup then just location of the turbocharger directly.
- Intakes can be more easily made to get more ingested air without being blocked by the radiator, so air access really doesn't promote a Top-Mount style as its core-competency. Drag Race only? Sure, go ahead. Want to fit and Show off a big T04S or T04H housing so it can fit? Makes even more sense. But as a combination strategy for both drag/street use? Meh.
-Precision ball-bearing turbochargers still are only oil cooled, and have more of replacement record than even their journal-bearing units on street driven cars. Drag racing is actually much less stressful for a turbocharger than any street use.
-Comp's service may be slow, but with the correct Garrett, you won't need to worry about service issues, because the turbocharger will be in better shape so that it won't be necessary to have service at all. Check the last Garrett from 1158. 5 years, no rebuilds, no issues, no problems. Why? Proper supplemental equipment, proper installation & proper manufacturing quality control. I'll take the results of an abuse test from a daily-driving soccer mom with 4 kids on a Garrett-powered SAAB for 150,000 miles over some 8.59 second FIS record as testimony any day.
Honestly, you should have taken the plunge and bought that Garrett you tested and headed to the track with it. You would have been more impressed than you think..
-People can quote MPH and "records" made all day. The FIS record was done by a team that had the resources, and possibly sponsorships by Precision to get replacement turbochargers. You know what they say: If you're breaking things, you're not going fast enough.
-Put that Precision in a truly abusive scenario like a time-attack or an enduro, and they'll fail before anything else. That's why world-wide, you see only 1/8th Precision for any one Garrett or Borg-Warner. How do you think Hruska started in 1987? With a Grand National - Garrett.
I know we're just comparing notes and experiences.. So, no worries. No pissing match intended.
-If the turbocharger is quality, you don't need to remove the turbocharger as often. That's more to the connection setup then just location of the turbocharger directly.
- Intakes can be more easily made to get more ingested air without being blocked by the radiator, so air access really doesn't promote a Top-Mount style as its core-competency. Drag Race only? Sure, go ahead. Want to fit and Show off a big T04S or T04H housing so it can fit? Makes even more sense. But as a combination strategy for both drag/street use? Meh.
-Precision ball-bearing turbochargers still are only oil cooled, and have more of replacement record than even their journal-bearing units on street driven cars. Drag racing is actually much less stressful for a turbocharger than any street use.
-Comp's service may be slow, but with the correct Garrett, you won't need to worry about service issues, because the turbocharger will be in better shape so that it won't be necessary to have service at all. Check the last Garrett from 1158. 5 years, no rebuilds, no issues, no problems. Why? Proper supplemental equipment, proper installation & proper manufacturing quality control. I'll take the results of an abuse test from a daily-driving soccer mom with 4 kids on a Garrett-powered SAAB for 150,000 miles over some 8.59 second FIS record as testimony any day.
Honestly, you should have taken the plunge and bought that Garrett you tested and headed to the track with it. You would have been more impressed than you think.
.-People can quote MPH and "records" made all day. The FIS record was done by a team that had the resources, and possibly sponsorships by Precision to get replacement turbochargers. You know what they say: If you're breaking things, you're not going fast enough.
-Put that Precision in a truly abusive scenario like a time-attack or an enduro, and they'll fail before anything else. That's why world-wide, you see only 1/8th Precision for any one Garrett or Borg-Warner. How do you think Hruska started in 1987? With a Grand National - Garrett.
I know we're just comparing notes and experiences.. So, no worries. No pissing match intended.
Last edited by TheShodan; Apr 13, 2016 at 10:17 AM.
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Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
-
Honestly, you should have taken the plunge and bought that Garrett you tested and headed to the track with it. You would have been more impressed than you think..
I actually did and blew two of them up, I blew one up on the dyno shredded the journal bearing and the extended tips came right off. Had it rebuilt and blew it up again at the track during an IFO event, still won even with the wheel being in chunks. Turbo Direct established that the Journal Bearing turbo could not keep up and be pushed to where we pushed it, I wish it would have stayed together because I made 960whp with it
I then went to the same turbo but in a BB unit and blew two of those up, with multiple housing switches made about 910whp but again the extended tips could not handle being pushed to 44psi. TD made another custom wheel to be a bit more thick but we only made 850whp with the new wheel. TD is having another custom wheel made to make more power and last, so we will see.
The good thing about Garrett and Turbo Direct is they are local to me and they are not charging me anything to try new housings or wheels, they are quick and are willing to continue to push their product until they/we are satisfied. We both benefit by working together so even though I know Precision made more power than what I have, I am confident that Garrett and TD will get this worked out which is why I am sticking with these guys. Awesome Customer Service and Knowledge!!!
-People can quote MPH and "records" made all day. The FIS record was done by a team that had the resources, and possibly sponsorships by Precision to get replacement turbochargers. You know what they say: If you're breaking things, you're not going fast enough.
I will say this, the Gen2 6266 they used was bought used from one of their buddies, no help from Precision, no sponsor from them, no nothing. I think Joe tried to get them to send us a turbo to test but got no response.
Honestly, you should have taken the plunge and bought that Garrett you tested and headed to the track with it. You would have been more impressed than you think.
. I actually did and blew two of them up, I blew one up on the dyno shredded the journal bearing and the extended tips came right off. Had it rebuilt and blew it up again at the track during an IFO event, still won even with the wheel being in chunks. Turbo Direct established that the Journal Bearing turbo could not keep up and be pushed to where we pushed it, I wish it would have stayed together because I made 960whp with it
I then went to the same turbo but in a BB unit and blew two of those up, with multiple housing switches made about 910whp but again the extended tips could not handle being pushed to 44psi. TD made another custom wheel to be a bit more thick but we only made 850whp with the new wheel. TD is having another custom wheel made to make more power and last, so we will see.
The good thing about Garrett and Turbo Direct is they are local to me and they are not charging me anything to try new housings or wheels, they are quick and are willing to continue to push their product until they/we are satisfied. We both benefit by working together so even though I know Precision made more power than what I have, I am confident that Garrett and TD will get this worked out which is why I am sticking with these guys. Awesome Customer Service and Knowledge!!!
-People can quote MPH and "records" made all day. The FIS record was done by a team that had the resources, and possibly sponsorships by Precision to get replacement turbochargers. You know what they say: If you're breaking things, you're not going fast enough.
I will say this, the Gen2 6266 they used was bought used from one of their buddies, no help from Precision, no sponsor from them, no nothing. I think Joe tried to get them to send us a turbo to test but got no response.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,309
Likes: 22
From: Indiana
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
High 190's. Cruising down highway the fan would cycle on and off (fan switch set at 196). Now it does not get above 190 in the same condition.
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Living in AZ and when I street drove with the top mount in 100 degree weather, fan switch set at 198 my car would never go above 200. Driving on the freeway my car would stay around 192-195.
There was no real difference in ECT's when I went from a ramhorn to a top mount. I'm sure if I was in a cooler climate it would be even better. My opinion but I think the key to staying cooler is having the items heat coated, having a good radiator, with a fan shroud and an excellent fan. I only have a half radiator but I have a maradyne 1650 CFM fan that pulls a ton of air.
I bought that fan about 8 years ago along with a fan shroud and that has been the difference maker with my setup.
There was no real difference in ECT's when I went from a ramhorn to a top mount. I'm sure if I was in a cooler climate it would be even better. My opinion but I think the key to staying cooler is having the items heat coated, having a good radiator, with a fan shroud and an excellent fan. I only have a half radiator but I have a maradyne 1650 CFM fan that pulls a ton of air.
I bought that fan about 8 years ago along with a fan shroud and that has been the difference maker with my setup.
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Originally Posted by AZ_Civic
I actually did and blew two of them up, I blew one up on the dyno shredded the journal bearing and the extended tips came right off. Had it rebuilt and blew it up again at the track during an IFO event, still won even with the wheel being in chunks. Turbo Direct established that the Journal Bearing turbo could not keep up and be pushed to where we pushed it, I wish it would have stayed together because I made 960whp with it
Precision was dealing with wheel flex issues WAY before 44-45psi on their compressor wheels, but they also had thrust bearing material issues, which is at the heart of their matter. whether or not it was Ball-bearing or journal bearing, you had wheel flex, and you were close enough to people to help you with a redesign. Nothing more, nothing less. It would have happened with either CHRA.
Originally Posted by AZ_Civic
I then went to the same turbo but in a BB unit and blew two of those up, with multiple housing switches made about 910whp but again the extended tips could not handle being pushed to 44psi. TD made another custom wheel to be a bit more thick but we only made 850whp with the new wheel. TD is having another custom wheel made to make more power and last, so we will see.
Originally Posted by AZ_Civic
I will say this, the Gen2 6266 they used was bought used from one of their buddies, no help from Precision, no sponsor from them, no nothing. I think Joe tried to get them to send us a turbo to test but got no response.
Originally Posted by AZ_Civic
The good thing about Garrett and Turbo Direct is they are local to me and they are not charging me anything to try new housings or wheels, they are quick and are willing to continue to push their product until they/we are satisfied. We both benefit by working together so even though I know Precision made more power than what I have, I am confident that Garrett and TD will get this worked out which is why I am sticking with these guys. Awesome Customer Service and Knowledge!!!
Summation
Please remember, your situation is DRAG RACING ONLY, not a dual purpose. That's just simple R&D that you're going through right now with those guys. But it's not a Garrett manufacture issue.
Now, I'm sure that you're going to say "All I know is that X did this, so I went to Y" to make these particular determinations of functionality. But you need to look at your scenario a little differently than that of this OP.
(On a personal note) I'm glad you're staying Garrett, but you need to understand why things had failed; not just that they did, ya know?
That way you don't fall for the blanket statements that the internet is known for. 
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
That's because it was a wheel flex issue. Without even going through the whole deal I can tell you that it was the exducer that probably flexed a tiny bit after going over 40-45psi of pressure. Power probably went down because of the fact that your redesign had a smaller exducer size (only logical thing to do), and therefore made less. But, that's not a Garrett thing, that's a specific compressor wheel thing. I'm more than likely sure that the wheel failure caused the thrust bearing failure that caused the journal bearing failure. It's all relative.
Yes I agree the tips were paper thin and that caused them to almost fold backwards and you're probably right that it most likely caused the bearing to fail.
Precision was dealing with wheel flex issues WAY before 44-45psi on their compressor wheels, but they also had thrust bearing material issues, which is at the heart of their matter. whether or not it was Ball-bearing or journal bearing, you had wheel flex, and you were close enough to people to help you with a redesign. Nothing more, nothing less. It would have happened with either CHRA.
Again you are probably right they sell enough turbos to not really care.
I'm sure you will. Just know that so far, the 40-48psi range is where things start to really change. That is No where NEAR what the average guy here or even in Drag Racing is going to do. You're doing it because you're class limited, plain and simple. Everyone else would have increased their turbo size altogether to do what it is you're trying to do.
Again, totally true, I am trying to make as much power as possible to stay within class rules. Most people would have simply moved on to a bigger turbo and not thought twice. However, if pushing the limits of these small turbochargers forces competitors to up their game and produce better products it benefits everyone in the end
You probably won't either. They've done enough testing and use for their product in your type and class of racing. There's no reason for them to answer your call. They've got all the information they're willing to utilize.
That's good. But remember, not everyone will get that treatment. You're the guinea pig with local connections that are changing WHEELS to help you and your class. It's a matter of business because the people you're working with will help them out in return for helping YOU out. Guinea pigs will always get a little extra special love.
Totally understand and yes you are right, I am in the right place and am working with the right people that are trying to come up with a really cool product and are willing to help me help them. Believe it or not there are not many people willing to be Guinea pigs.
Summation
Please remember, your situation is DRAG RACING ONLY, not a dual purpose. That's just simple R&D that you're going through right now with those guys. But it's not a Garrett manufacture issue.
Totally agree, it is not a Garrett issue at all because that wheel is not a Garrett product. That is why I mentioned that I have used off the shelf Garrett turbos with zero problems for many years. In fact I ran only Garrett Turbos for 8 years before I tried out Comp and am back with Garrett.
Now, I'm sure that you're going to say "All I know is that X did this, so I went to Y" to make these particular determinations of functionality. But you need to look at your scenario a little differently than that of this OP.
(On a personal note) I'm glad you're staying Garrett, but you need to understand why things had failed; not just that they did, ya know? That way you don't fall for the blanket statements that the internet is known for.
Yes I agree the tips were paper thin and that caused them to almost fold backwards and you're probably right that it most likely caused the bearing to fail.
Precision was dealing with wheel flex issues WAY before 44-45psi on their compressor wheels, but they also had thrust bearing material issues, which is at the heart of their matter. whether or not it was Ball-bearing or journal bearing, you had wheel flex, and you were close enough to people to help you with a redesign. Nothing more, nothing less. It would have happened with either CHRA.
Again you are probably right they sell enough turbos to not really care.
I'm sure you will. Just know that so far, the 40-48psi range is where things start to really change. That is No where NEAR what the average guy here or even in Drag Racing is going to do. You're doing it because you're class limited, plain and simple. Everyone else would have increased their turbo size altogether to do what it is you're trying to do.
Again, totally true, I am trying to make as much power as possible to stay within class rules. Most people would have simply moved on to a bigger turbo and not thought twice. However, if pushing the limits of these small turbochargers forces competitors to up their game and produce better products it benefits everyone in the end
You probably won't either. They've done enough testing and use for their product in your type and class of racing. There's no reason for them to answer your call. They've got all the information they're willing to utilize.
That's good. But remember, not everyone will get that treatment. You're the guinea pig with local connections that are changing WHEELS to help you and your class. It's a matter of business because the people you're working with will help them out in return for helping YOU out. Guinea pigs will always get a little extra special love.
Totally understand and yes you are right, I am in the right place and am working with the right people that are trying to come up with a really cool product and are willing to help me help them. Believe it or not there are not many people willing to be Guinea pigs.
Summation
Please remember, your situation is DRAG RACING ONLY, not a dual purpose. That's just simple R&D that you're going through right now with those guys. But it's not a Garrett manufacture issue.
Totally agree, it is not a Garrett issue at all because that wheel is not a Garrett product. That is why I mentioned that I have used off the shelf Garrett turbos with zero problems for many years. In fact I ran only Garrett Turbos for 8 years before I tried out Comp and am back with Garrett.
Now, I'm sure that you're going to say "All I know is that X did this, so I went to Y" to make these particular determinations of functionality. But you need to look at your scenario a little differently than that of this OP.
(On a personal note) I'm glad you're staying Garrett, but you need to understand why things had failed; not just that they did, ya know?
That way you don't fall for the blanket statements that the internet is known for.
Thread Starter
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Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Hey everyone, thank you so much for all your input. To the shodan, I'm gonna answer as much as I can, please be patient with me as time is truly a factor (family man who works nights lol). thank you for laying down some topics for me to further my knowledge in helping my build as well as the suggestions recommended. Perhaps I'll do more extensive research with Google. And don't worry, constructive criticism is very welcomed 
ok, on the the blue highlights
1. I really don't know what high knock fuel is, if you can elaborate that would be awesome
2. The titanium rods came with the block when I purchased it. It will be running an 87.2mm stroke if that helps
3. I had the head port and polished with 3 angle valve job because I wanted max air flow since it was being boosted. I guess I never really thought about what could be overkill or not, which is my error, but what's done is done I guess. The head was flow tested and everything is good to go.
4. Sorry I must have forgot to mention. I'm using the blox 70mm throttle body
5. As far as fuel, I assume 91 octane with meth injection would suffice? Or should I just go e85, still learning about fuel octane and ratings, I was recommended the meth injection kit so I looked into and and found it interesting.
6. You seem to side with Garrett turbos very strongly, IF I decided to go with a Garrett, which would be equivalent to the precisions I'm looking into?
So the car would be more of a weekend/show car. As far as luxuries, no ac or power steering will be on the car if threats what the implications are. So with that said, being family oriented, I really don't have the luxury of going to the drag strip and road racing. Having a wife and two kids tends to suck up a lot of my time, although my wife is very understanding about the whole car scene and knows I still like my Sunday drive every now and then with the occasional car shows/meets. as for my location, I live in SoCal. Again, thank you everyone for your suggestions
ok, on the the blue highlights1. I really don't know what high knock fuel is, if you can elaborate that would be awesome
2. The titanium rods came with the block when I purchased it. It will be running an 87.2mm stroke if that helps
3. I had the head port and polished with 3 angle valve job because I wanted max air flow since it was being boosted. I guess I never really thought about what could be overkill or not, which is my error, but what's done is done I guess. The head was flow tested and everything is good to go.
4. Sorry I must have forgot to mention. I'm using the blox 70mm throttle body
5. As far as fuel, I assume 91 octane with meth injection would suffice? Or should I just go e85, still learning about fuel octane and ratings, I was recommended the meth injection kit so I looked into and and found it interesting.
6. You seem to side with Garrett turbos very strongly, IF I decided to go with a Garrett, which would be equivalent to the precisions I'm looking into?
So the car would be more of a weekend/show car. As far as luxuries, no ac or power steering will be on the car if threats what the implications are. So with that said, being family oriented, I really don't have the luxury of going to the drag strip and road racing. Having a wife and two kids tends to suck up a lot of my time, although my wife is very understanding about the whole car scene and knows I still like my Sunday drive every now and then with the occasional car shows/meets. as for my location, I live in SoCal. Again, thank you everyone for your suggestions
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 919
Likes: 0
From: Orange County, CA
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Hey everyone, thank you so much for all your input. To the shodan, I'm gonna answer as much as I can, please be patient with me as time is truly a factor (family man who works nights lol). thank you for laying down some topics for me to further my knowledge in helping my build as well as the suggestions recommended. Perhaps I'll do more extensive research with Google. And don't worry, constructive criticism is very welcomed ok, on the the blue highlights
1. I really don't know what high knock fuel is, if you can elaborate that would be awesome
2. The titanium rods came with the block when I purchased it. It will be running an 87.2mm stroke if that helps
3. I had the head port and polished with 3 angle valve job because I wanted max air flow since it was being boosted. I guess I never really thought about what could be overkill or not, which is my error, but what's done is done I guess. The head was flow tested and everything is good to go.
4. Sorry I must have forgot to mention. I'm using the blox 70mm throttle body
5. As far as fuel, I assume 91 octane with meth injection would suffice? Or should I just go e85, still learning about fuel octane and ratings, I was recommended the meth injection kit so I looked into and and found it interesting.
6. You seem to side with Garrett turbos very strongly, IF I decided to go with a Garrett, which would be equivalent to the precisions I'm looking into?
So the car would be more of a weekend/show car. As far as luxuries, no ac or power steering will be on the car if threats what the implications are. So with that said, being family oriented, I really don't have the luxury of going to the drag strip and road racing. Having a wife and two kids tends to suck up a lot of my time, although my wife is very understanding about the whole car scene and knows I still like my Sunday drive every now and then with the occasional car shows/meets. as for my location, I live in SoCal. Again, thank you everyone for your suggestions
ok, on the the blue highlights1. I really don't know what high knock fuel is, if you can elaborate that would be awesome
2. The titanium rods came with the block when I purchased it. It will be running an 87.2mm stroke if that helps
3. I had the head port and polished with 3 angle valve job because I wanted max air flow since it was being boosted. I guess I never really thought about what could be overkill or not, which is my error, but what's done is done I guess. The head was flow tested and everything is good to go.
4. Sorry I must have forgot to mention. I'm using the blox 70mm throttle body
5. As far as fuel, I assume 91 octane with meth injection would suffice? Or should I just go e85, still learning about fuel octane and ratings, I was recommended the meth injection kit so I looked into and and found it interesting.
6. You seem to side with Garrett turbos very strongly, IF I decided to go with a Garrett, which would be equivalent to the precisions I'm looking into?
So the car would be more of a weekend/show car. As far as luxuries, no ac or power steering will be on the car if threats what the implications are. So with that said, being family oriented, I really don't have the luxury of going to the drag strip and road racing. Having a wife and two kids tends to suck up a lot of my time, although my wife is very understanding about the whole car scene and knows I still like my Sunday drive every now and then with the occasional car shows/meets. as for my location, I live in SoCal. Again, thank you everyone for your suggestions
1. Knock resistant fuel allows for more spark advance without causing detonation (which will blow your motor). Basically, your tuner adjusts the timing (spark) so you can achieve MBT (max brake torque, i.e most power) As the pistons travels up, the mixture is compressed, and in order to achieve the most power, you want all of the energy from the expanding ignition to push down on the cylinder as soon as it begins heading downward. Knock occurs when the ignition is set off too early, and pushes down on the cylinder as it travels upward.
2. Seems like a standard b16 stroke (iirc)
3. Eh, at least it'll flow even better now
4. He's going to tell you to ditch this most likely because it's a chinese copy brand...assuming no one else has had reliability or other issues with it (google) I say keep it
5. I too live in SoCal and I'm planning on using meth, simply because I don't feel like driving to Fountain Valley or Anaheim to buy gas. E85 is simpler in terms of just upping your ccs on the injectors and getting an e85 compatible pump, meth injection has more components but seems pretty nice as well. The two give similar results, cooler cylinder temps, higher octane, both equating to more knock resistance (more reliability and power)
6. Really don't know what comes after the gt35... that can get you a bit north of 600 to the wheels. Borgwarner s300sx comes to mind. You should help to Speedtrapp consulting's website however, call them up and ask to Mac , who is No ways associated with the shodan you are currently speaking too (
)Jokes aside, seriously their turbos are pretty awesome. Lightningteg here has ran two, both north of 600whp. Theshodan is going to get mad at me now for mentioning the company and all that so I'm going to piece and get a head start haha
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Posts: 2,246
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From: toledo
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
unless uour using a deck plate for the b16 block, the 87.2 crank wont work for that block. thats a crank for a taller b series deck height block.
an b16 deck height crank would be 77.4
an b16 deck height crank would be 77.4
Last edited by ls joker; Apr 14, 2016 at 02:21 AM.
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 919
Likes: 0
From: Orange County, CA
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Re: Opinions and suggestions wanted for turbo setup
Geis, thanks for the info man, it defiantly helped a lot
Ls joker, that exactly what I thought but the custom made rods and Pistons accommodate the stroke without overlapping. here are the part numbers so you can see. Might have to use google because the sites search engines suck lol
Je piston part number #207247
Crower part numer # T93727B
You will notice the rod length is different and the piston pin distance is raised
Hope this helps thanks guys
Ls joker, that exactly what I thought but the custom made rods and Pistons accommodate the stroke without overlapping. here are the part numbers so you can see. Might have to use google because the sites search engines suck lol
Je piston part number #207247
Crower part numer # T93727B
You will notice the rod length is different and the piston pin distance is raised
Hope this helps thanks guys
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