Anyone know why it's so hard to slide the main relay out of a 1997 Honda Accord LX? It only seems to be held on by friction between two grooves on the grey box over the metal tab it sits on. But the grey box won't budge up or down. I realize I may have to pry the circuit board out first, then remove the grey box, then remount the relay back in an easier location.

I guess tomorrow I will have to pry the circuit board out but I'd still like to know if it's just stuck in there or if something hidden holds it in. The year 1997 does not have any bolt holding it in.

Here's a couple pics:

 

Remove the wire harness from the Main relay, see the little tab, push it in and slide the wire harness out of the way. Then you will be able to see the tab that locks the main relay onto the bracket for easier removal.

 

Thanks, I'll unhook the wire first, no small feat lying on my back with one arm, but I think I can do it. I might be able to get a second arm in there if I try real hard. I have a pile of lumber next to the car door so I am lying in front of the dash, not angling in which would be easier.

Even if I just get the wire harness off, it's a good day today. I think your procedure will work.

 

An idea just occurred to me, since I don't suspect the PGM-FI relay, but instead a number of broken wires, I will test further down the line first. I'll pull the glove box and start nearer to the ECM and nearer to where the wires go back to the fuel pump. I know I have some wires broken. I'll defer any removal of the main fuel relay for a day or two and simply work on repairing harnesses. I don't even have tail and brake lights at this point. I need to replace harnesses or jumper in wires until I'm sure there are no short-circuits and no open-circuits. The PGM-FI relay is probably fine. And the ECU is probably also fine - just a bunch of wires broken by animals that were living in the car. There are numerous wires chewed through. I almost have the car down to bare metal so it's getting easier and easier to work on. Only a little more vacuuming of the food out and the inside will be just bare metal.

 

I just went out and pulled up the carpet in the front. I had to cut it at the shifter and once on each side of the center console. Years ago, I published an article on a different Honda Forum (Automotive forums) on how to install a stereo so hopefully my post will guide me through pulling the center console out - the screws are all out, I just have to get the shifter **** off - my memory tells me it's threaded (unscrew?) but I'll have to check the service manual, and I need to check the service manual on the glovebox - I have the screw off the damper but there are two more screws on the bottom - I could have sworn my manual said bolts but they are screws I believe. Once I get the glovebox and center console out, I am pretty much down to bare metal and I can start ordering harnesses from somewhere - not sure yet where - perhaps Honda Parts now or some place or some junkyard.

 

Ok, I need to pry the boot off (Service manual 20-120 says 6 clips), then unscrew the ****. And the manual shows 2 bolts, 1 screw for the glovebox, so I need a wrench/socket. Years ago, I rotated the console out of the way WITHOUT removing the shifter **** so I guess I'll try that again.

 

I now realize that the electrical connections in the interior of the car (and the engine area) are organized into a number of large harnesses - main harness (left and right branch), rear harness, fuel harness, tailgate harness, etc.. So it's not so bad - just find a used one or patch up the existing harness. Or synthesize my own using new wire/connectors.

Still must remove the console (it stuck a little when I installed my stereo), glovebox, and 2 long plastic vents in the front passenger area - there are still some peanut/acorn shells in those spots. So far I've carried two very large 16 gallon vacuum cleaner loads of shells - probably weighing more than 30 lbs in total, literally thousands of shells. The vacuum cleaner feels soo light after I empty it each time.

But all in all a good day - very productive and a bit tiring on my hands since I forgot that my pry tool for taking off trim was sitting right next to me and I used my fingers instead.

The pics show the car almost stripped to bare metal and a composting area of set up in a nearby park since I want the wind to blow the little bits of cloth away. The hole is about a foot deep and 5 square feet. So it's up to 5 cubic feet of shells. The last pic was a surprise - ready to eat calzones!

 

If you've got wires that have been chewed on, maybe check out this Youtube article by Autoeclinic:

They suggest using flux before soldering, then wrap with hose repair tape to keep moisture and the resulting corrosion out. Looks good how they did it so I will use progressive refinement - fix one wire at a time. I cannot find the harnesses anyway.

So yesterday, I had to innovate a way to go to the store and pick up gallon jugs of water. So I added a 12 1/2" piece of Brazilian Walnut to the back of my bike-rack, put a hook on, then tied on a dolly with rope, voila - time to go shopping. Today I need to pick up electrical supplies and wiring, and perhaps some conduit, and hose repair tape. I'm not sure I can find this stuff in local shops so I may have to make do with some heat-shrink and electrical tape for a week or so.


Enjoy, and hopefullly put this "what to do when your 4-wheeled vehicle is down for repairs" bag of tricks.

 

I just went out and pulled the boot down off of it's spring-loading on the shifter, then unscrewed the shifter off. Years ago, I left the shifter on, but I need more room to work this time.

So with the shifter off and the boot off, I could then undo the 2 screws for the Pioneer radio I installed years ago, and then 3 screws for the surrounding frame that the console comes out of.

There are connectors - clock (little spring-load to push before pulling), hazard (similar spring-load to clock), cigarette lighter (just pull hard on this one although I rotated it a number of times first to loosen it without knowing what I was doing), and there are two little lights - I believe I just pulled on those.

I still cannot get the glovebox out, and the dash center is not quite out. Perhaps I really need to get the glovebox out since the dash-frame around the front console is still holding a little bit at the upper-right corner - something springy. I also removed the rear white paper over the left rear-taillight connector in the left rear quarter panel. Now I can see everything - like where the rear wire harness hooks into the left-side harness and the antenna motor, etc.. This will help.

I now have to shop for wires and a siphon.

I will simply cut the wires out in long strips if there are more than one break in a 5 foot or so section. That way I won't have a tremendous number of splices on the same wire. I may even replace the harnesses later, patching them up now to get the car drivable.

I simply cannot get the screws to turn on the glovebox, even with a right-angle screw-driver. The manual says bolts but they look like screws to me.

I need even more mirrors and light sometimes - my trouble-light stinks so I need a new one. Perhaps I could use tinfoil or sheet metal as a mirror.

The frame around the console out would help a little with the ducts on the floor - I think there is one screw holding each in but I really wish I could find this stuff in the service manual.

Each day I get something done, but something remains elusive each day.

Next time I'll try an 8mm socket for the glovebox - it might be kind of screws that have the allen on top but the hex bolt pattern on them.
The Honda Civic from 1996 - 1998 had those - perhaps it's same or similar on the Accords.

 

In order to remove the true center console that I had been pulling on, it helped to remove the glovebox first (which I had also been struggling with).

Well, I decided to go into my tool drawer and get my "other" right angle screw-driver, the one with the right bit on it (the smoother, more blunt-ended phillips bit). In fact the screws are as smooth as silk, they are NOT bolts as I thought I had read in the manual, did I read wrong twice, I don't know. So with my smooth-bit right-angle screw-driver the two screws came out. I just broke them, then turned them off with my fingers. In order to get the right one out, I laid my body down in a fetal position facing to the right and had an easy time from there. I just craned my neck to get the left one out, although I had to lie down a little for that one too.

EXPOSED ONE MORE SCREW ON CENTER CONSOLE
So removing the glovebox exposed one more little phillips screw on the center console, then it came free other than one or two more wire connectors. I used a screw-driver (flat-blade) to help pry the connectors off stuff. The bottom-most one has to be pried out by squeezing little tabs on it. Once that's free, the whole console comes out (although one must be careful that the two pieces of metal at the bottom go on over the other).

I still cannot get the vents off - more research needed.

Rear of left-harness needs about 9 2' wires replaced.

So while I'm getting some new parts, tools, and vacuum attachments, I will fix the rear light system. Once I see those rear lights blinking on and off, I'll feel a little better. So there is damage to about 6 of the wires but in different places. But I unhooked the little red clip on the inside edge of the inside quarter panel and I can unhook the taiillights now if I want. The damage is mostly before the rear harness so I will be patching up the last couple feet of what is called the left harness. This may explain why the antenna does not go up or down - it's not grounded. Of 3 grounds, only 1 exists, and even it is not so "hot".

So when I can get some auto wire - mostly 18 and 16 gauge so far as lights are not high amperage devices, I will be fixing the wires. It's mostly green and black ones but I believe I see a blue and or white wire damaged. So I need to get those colors if I want to be picky.

So it's coming along. But I really need that vaccum-attachment system to continue - my hose is 2" ID, 2 3/16" OD and it won't get into the crevasses to get rid of the peanut shells - they are still showing uup as I peel the layers.

Here are some pics - note that I show you what screws I took off next to the tools I used. Only 1 or 2 tools needed today. The tools on the left I didn't need even though I had brought them out.

 

As of yesterday morning, I have perfect working rear (and still perfect front) lights - brake, turn signals, hazard, lights, backup, etc.. All are fine. I now realize a previous mechanic had cut 2 of the left-side harness, ground wires and joined 2 others together. And I had intentionally left one ground wire off (which is needed for the turn signals), so I could see the effect of not grounding that wire. Connected that, and the turn signals worked, and now everything is perfect in the rear. I also had 2 wires going to the right rear turn signal so I checked the voltage on one and it was the correct one (I still need to hunt down why there is one GRN/YEL wire not connected, yet everything works). I then realized I'd routed my wires over top of the metal cross-member to the right rear. So I had to recut all six new 18" wires that I'd spliced in and rerun them below the cross-member. LOL. Now I have no starter solenoid voltage at all so I will trouble-shoot that even though it's the fuel pump that's the biggest problem, as I can still use my remote starter if I want. But I did not get my vacuum hose attachment today (should be here tomorrow). I must vacuum some more before diving in to the dashboard. So far, so good, as it's nice having perfect rear and front lights on my car. Now I need to put some more split loom here and there and finish up the back while I dig further into the front. All the tools and stuff I ordered on ebay have been a great help. And I've located some suppliers for the little things, like cable ties, split looms, etc.. Places like Cable ties and more, a Hong Kong company I forget it's name, The Honda Parts Store, etc.. I like to protect the rear now just to eliminate any possibility of shorts even though I've covered everything copper with varying amounts of electrical tape, high-T, self-stick hose repair tape, etc.. The Klein tools Katapult wire stripper tool really helped as I had to cut and strip dozens of wires to resplice all the animal-chew-throughs. With the cost of harnesses, I now realize it's smart to splice one wire at a time. It's not THAT complicated to wire a car - it's not like a giant airplane or something with a huge amount of devices, sensors, computers, etc.. It's tedious but not too troublesome.

 

Using knowledge gained from a Haynes book, my service manual, and bushougoma's article on Ignition switch replacement, I have a prescription for how to check animal gnawing infestation or perhaps rain-water infiltration (hopefully I haven't left out a step, if so, I might have left off a fuse or two). Here goes for how to investigate why no starter solenoid voltage is present when starting engine with ignition switch in the usual way (but you think the ignition switch is probably ok for now):

1) Start at under-hood fuse box where the 50A/80A fuses are (check them).

2) At connector C929 on fuse-box, there appears a white wire on connector C251 (a 7P that plugs into C929). Unhook that and check for continuity to C404 on the underdash fuse box (unhook that one to check). C404 plugs into C913 on the under-dash fuse box, so that's how to locate it - see pic in your manual.

3) At C906 under-dash, there is a white wire that continues to the Ignition switch (which bushougoma talks about). This wire will be switched by Acc-Ig1-Ig2-Start to the proper terminals of the connector. There is a test procedure but I can skip that for now since we don't suspect the ignition switch.

4) A black/white comes from the Ignition switch and goes to C906 (again? not sure here), then fuse #9, a 7.5A, then to C406 (clutch interlock), and C402 (starter cut relay WHT/RED on 5P under-dash fusebox socket C914).

5) Then check C406 to C428 (clutch interlock 2P)

6) C428 to C433 (Starter cut relay grounded at G403.

7) C433 to C130 (Starter solenoid).

I just have to check all of this stuff, if still not found fault, then worry about stuff like PGM, fuel pump, and ignition switch. But somewhere in steps 1 - 7 I should find a broken and/or shorted wire or two or three.

The starter cut relay/PGM are hard to get connectors off - PGM due to it's stuck a little and starter cut since I can't get to it as easily. I'll eventually get them off though. I have to work straight into the dash, not with my feet out the left side (wow, this is hard to do, but not impossible!)

Well, til tomorrow!

Hopefully, I'll be able to check over more than one circuit at a time first, then narrow it down to one wire.

 

Wow, I got rid of a bunch of lumber from my way and I can now lay down with my body hanging out the left-side of the car - a huge breakthrough!

So I just want to unhook C906 and C913 from the under-dash box so I can check some continuity but it's been hard to get the fuse box to turn towards me - now I seem to be making progress - I've removed the blue connector and couple others. But the sticky bit is the SRS yellow connector - the one mechanics call the knuckle-buster. My manual (23-319) says it's a double-lock connector, lift the lid, then push in the springloaded tab and pull it off. Two things bother me: 1) The manual had the wrong lower screw location for my under-dash fuse box and 2) I keep pulling and pulling and pulling and pulling but all it does is unlock the clip, then when I let go, it locks back in place again. Is there a one or two-bladed pry pin that the manual does not mention in the '97 Wagon (like the newer cars)? Or should I just push on the spring-load and pull with a HUGE force - like 40 or 50 lbs or so?

I just want to take the entire fuse box out as it's easy to get the ignition connector off (since it's on the front), but harder to get C906 off (which is on the back). I just want the whole fuse box out! I guess if I don't hear anything, I'll look for an extra pin, then perhaps pry with a thick knife - perhaps it's loctited? I don't know - it's a toughy.

At least I have a nice work place to fix the thing now.

 

I have now gotten most of the connectors off, including the ones I want to continuity test, C913 and C906. I just had to go one connector at a time, depress the little spring-lock, then wiggle with a flat-head screwdriver. In order to get C913 off (the wht, wht, wht/blk 3P with high-current wires), I had to use 2 screwdrivers, the long one in my left-hand and a shorter one in my right. Once the springlock is depressed, the connectors come off pretty well.

And to make things easier, I took a little half-thickness solid concrete block and placed a rear seatback over it, to level off with the bottom of the driver's side doorjam, then stuck a little couch pillow where the seat would be so I can lie more comfortably. To get C913 off, it was best for me to lie on my RIGHT side on the left-side of the car, not my left-side or stomach. This worked great to get C913 and I believe it was C912? C914? which had to come out first to get C913 out (whichever one is above it). But in fact, I hadn't realized that the spring-loaded clip is on the underside of the connector, so perhaps taking out the vertical one above it was not important. Anyway, it's just one more connector to put back on, and perhaps one more to thoroughly test.

I will probably not have to remove the under-dash fuse box now that I have C913 unhooked.

In the meantime, I checked the ignition switch all the way to the fusebox by testing it's connector (C906 I guess it was), and it works perfectly. So I will design a female connector or something for C913 to make it easier or else I will simply use little clip leads that I bought while I was at Radio Shack. So by today I should know if I have continuity/opens/shorts out to the under-HOOD fuse box (the white wire issue I guess). Does it reach the starter solenoid? Perhaps I can then work left to right through the dashboard or else perhaps simply run a new wire or two out to the engine area. But I made progress, thank the Lord.



Update: I have not looked into whether on cars like mine (manual transmission M/T), should I remove the clutch pedal to make
things easier? The service manual does not say to do this. I guess they just expect us to stretch the wires some whilst we
pull the connectors off, until it's all off. And they are not assuming that we want to put them back on in a hurry. I may need to design some new wires as I would love to have the fuse box in a different location - as in, I would love to relocate the fusebox.

 

Ok, here it is. Same as what Mad Mike said. Just push the little nub inwards towards the grey housing, and as I said, pull/push up on the housing until it starts to move up, and go all the way.

So I now have the PGM relay (still in it's grey housing) hanging down. The only problem is, I need the starter cut relay also hanging down, but I could not find a wrench, socket, or pliers that would get the little nut off, and I cannot get the connector off - another connector that troubles me. So I need to buy a new set of miniature sockets. My sockets and wrenches just do not fit properly to get the nut off. I WD40'd twice thoroughly - maybe tomorrow? Maybe a little torch - I don't know. Probably I'll need to buy a tool by tonight, or else order online.

Once that's off I can check BLK/WHT out to the solenoid which is about all I want to do right now. I am basically just following 23-81 in the service manual, steps 5 - 7, what to do if no voltage at the solenoid.