In a obvious "non-drag" application, assuming both are setup equally suspension wise, which one will handle better? Who have driven both and can share from your experience?

 

Thats a VERY vague question, depends on driver, mods to EG and a whole bunch of other things.


[Modified by Rguy, 11:37 AM 11/4/2002]

 

EG is so much lighter, therefore faster. DC2 has better chassis, stock... and I can't say what the 'better car' is without knowing how exactly you are comparing them.

If an EG had an equal suspension of the ITR, I say it would handle/perform better due to the weight difference. But.. I don't know about many Eg's that have a suspension like a DC2-R.

 

ok, let me rephrase and add some details, assuming both have the same suspension, meaning the EG hatch added ITR shocks+springs, both front and rear sways, strut bars etc, who wil handle better on the track?

Reason for the question is since ITR is made as a track car, so the geometry of the ITR for handling is better than the econo box that the EG was meant for in the states. So with same equipments, would the ITR or EG be better in cornering.

No contest in the drag application since EG is obviously lighter.

 

EG would be accelerating at a higher rate in the straights/slight turns, and no matter how well track-mannered the R is, a lighter car with the same engine and suspension will win!

Now, take a stock EG and compare it to this ITR-modified, b18c5 EG. That's a huge difference, modification-wise.

Take a stock ITR.... and do SIMILAR upgrades that were done to this hypothetical EG, and you have a beast.

 

Isn't Taz Harvey running an EG with ITR suspension in the Speed World Challenge series. I don't think it is faster through the corners then the RTR ITR.
Last year I think Roger Foo also ran his Civic with ITR suspension.

Weight alone cannot dictate the final handling performance of a car, the balance of the car in a whole is much more important.

 

He said hybrid EG ITR. So I would think 500/600 pounds less is a big difference, especailly if the EG had the ITR suspension and was balanced well itself.

This is rather ambiguous, still.

 

Harvey runs a 1999 Civic SI in the WC.

 

How do you compensate for the 150lb? weight added in the front from the motor swap? the corner weight is totally changed by this i would figure.

 

The ITR will win in the circuit hands down, y0!

 

Stiffer springs/spring rates. Even adding some weight in the back to offset would yield a 10-15% weight reduction. What happens when you take out the 130hp Lotus Elise engine and put in an ITR engine? You adjust/upgrade the suspension and you go mad fast.

Same idea here, just not as much weight loss.

 

Tough question. What it really boils down to is 'does lighter weight make up for lesser structrual rigidy, and inperfect suspension geometry?'

I would bet that it doesn't. Just look at cars like the MR2. Its light, but it doesn't handle as well as a ITR.

 

How is the EG suspension geometry different from the ITR's?

Please explain.

 

Also note, that springs, shocks, and sway bars doesn't make for good suspension. I put heavy springs, shocks, and bigass sway bars on my shelby clone, and it wasn't untill I modified the front control arm mounting position that it started handling well.


[Modified by jond, 4:14 PM 11/4/2002]

 

Good point. The integra is built on the civic platform isn't it?

 

Balance is the werd, dowg!

 

Either of them will work.

In a comparison test, the slight edge would go to the EG, but in reality differences in driver skill will far outshadow differences in vehicle capability.

 

My point is not weither or not a well balanced Hybrid EG/ITR could beat a stock ITR (hard to say without racing each other), but it is more weither or not the stock ITR suspension is the best set-up to balance the Hybrid EG/ITR car for optimal handling. The ITR suspension was most likely design with the ITR rigidity and weight in mind...the Hybrid does not have the same chassis rigidity and same weight distribution so maybe it would require a different suspension set-up.

EDIT: My post was not directed at you Reid...it took so much time to write that I lost my place in the thread


[Modified by JPP, 4:26 PM 11/4/2002]

 

No, it's not the best setup for optimal handling.

If you're after optimal handling, get a rollcage welded in before you pick your suspension components.

 

I'd say ITR+EG body=Best Handling.

I saw some place that the EG6 was the most successful FF race car to date....or something like that.

 

Chris - who will go play some GT3 and let you know.

Seriously though, IF the DC2-R suspension/chassis geometry is in fact better than the EG, how much better can it be? I'd think 'slightly'.

Just a thought, but why is the S2K approximately 4 seconds faster than the DC2R at Nurburing? And why is the DC2R approximately 4 seconds faster than the CTR? For those wondering where I got that information, it was in a thread where we were discussing Gansan driving the NSX-R in sub 8 minutes at the ring. There was a link to some info about other honda's times. (stock)

Those 4 seconds must be engine. All three of the cars listed above have excellent handling. Different chassis/suspensions. With more power and the right suspension components, lighter wins. It may not be true that given two equal drivers the EG would win each time, but I'd give an advantage to the EG based on all the above criteria.

 

I think like Reid mentioned, if you go "***** out" and get a roll cage and most importantly match suspensions parts so they work very well together (full coilovers,sway bars, upgraded LCAs, etc) a B18C5 powered EG will be a very sick handling car.. That's my goal for the future: a LEGAL, LEGIT NON-STOLEN B18C5 powered EG...